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RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/25/2009 8:25:53 PM

stella41b

Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slavelash

We went to a marriage counselor about 2 years ago who said that my urges were all quite normal. i admit that she tried - for about a week. Then it was back to what i call "Catholic Sex!"

Hang on a minute here squire.. You've got a screen name of slave, you're complaining about being trapped in a vanilla marriage where you cannot fulfill your needs as a male submissive because your wife 'won't go there'. This is the wife you love so much, would never cheat on, and despite having seen a marriage counsellor two years ago you cannot bring your wife to understand these needs.

Furthermore your interests appear to be service, and yet you complain about 'Catholic sex'.

Would you care to explain what you've been doing in those two years since you went to that marriage counsellor? Was it an issue then? What have you done about changing the situation? Have you attempted to communicate these issues in some way to your wife? What have you tried? What haven't you tried? Why haven't you tried it? What's stopping you?

Maybe if you try and address the above questions, and understand that you're going to have to compromise to achieve a solution anyway (but this is no worse than actually being a submissive or a slave with a domme, because you for sure won't get what you want all the time or even perhaps more than some of the time) then you might find yourself moving in the general direction towards a solution.

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(in reply to slavelash)

Post #: 21

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/25/2009 10:09:49 PM

wildcat07

Posts: 4
Joined: 4/23/2009
Status: offline

SylvereApLeanan Wow, that was great up there. Well writen and thought out. I am seriously going to use that advise, no joke. I think you should start a podcast or something. I will be the first to sign up. I am amazed at how when I hear problems and think "well that sucks, no solution" and someone like you comes along and has an amazing idea. That just made my night. ( I just read this back to myself and it sounds like I am being sarcastic but i am 100% not)

(in reply to peppermint)

Post #: 22

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/25/2009 10:34:48 PM

DavanKael

Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline

I haven't read all of the replies to this, so I may say some things that are redundant.
In my marriage, my ex- was opposed to D/s as a dynamic between us and I asked at around 19 or 20, we were together until I was 32. Sooooo, I know a bit of what you're experiencing.
We did have some poly- relationships but I staunchly avoided looking for D/s-dynamics because I knew how inherent a thing it is to me and did not want to risk those needs being fulfilled outside of my marriage and creating a conflict or pull that could be a threat. I did have a D/s oriented relationship with another during my marriage and I love that person dearly to this day. When things ran afoul, not only did I have a loved one no longer in my life, I lost the amazing interplay and interconnectedness of our relating and that included matters D/s.
I am a person who does better with abstaining than having a taste and then being denied.
So, what was an aching need became a torturous hunger.
I don't know what to tell you. I do not know what the right choice is for you.
If you're asking if seeing a pro-domme is cheating, I would say you need to ask that question to the person to whom you said "I do". I suspect since you're asking, you already know she would think it is cheating.
Sublimating your desires may be the only option if you stay or, maybe better stated, transmuting.
I can tell you that I served my husband in many ways during our marriage and as the marriage deteriorated and I ceased doing those many little things for him, he reacted poorly, despite his never being willing to be dominant toward me. Did those things of service I did meet all of my D/s needs? No, but the love of my husband and the preservation of my marriage and the things one does to cherish one's other won out. It is, of course, not so simple as the way I type those words but you really do have to make choices and don't pull the wool over your own eyes: do what you're going to do or commit yourself to what you're not going to do while taking responsibility for it.
Best wishes,
Davan

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(in reply to peppermint)

Post #: 23

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 12:17:20 AM

FullfigRIMAAM1

Posts: 1160
Joined: 11/20/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavelash
Thanks for the reply but leaving the marriage is not an option. i love her too much but she just can't get into the lifestyle. i figure something out, though!

I dont get this at all. If I was with someone i really loved, and they didnt like the lifestyle, I would quit. It seems the only option you have, is to talk with her about your needs, and see if she is happy for you to find an outlet.

Thank you Polite for calling bullshit.
Sounds to me like she is dominating just fine, by not submitting to his kinks, and he is being dishonest with himself and her. M

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(in reply to Politesub53)

Post #: 24

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 4:52:03 AM

masmiss

Posts: 494
Joined: 2/16/2009
From: New Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: peppermint
I never count on anyone to help make me happy as the key is still inside of me.

Bravo, peppermint.

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Post #: 25

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 5:47:15 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

I'm going to start by answering the question that the OP asked. If your idea is to see a pro domme without your wife's knowledge, then yes, it's cheating. How would you like it if she saw a guy on the side to fulfill her desires or to share intimacy without your knowledge? I doubt if you put the shoe on the other foot, it would be such a comfortable fit.

I have to concur with what Stella said in her post. I'm a little confused as to what it is that you really want. The complaint I'm hearing is a lack of kinky sex. The service part must be in your profile, because it isn't in this post. Are you wanting to be submissive or is it more accurate to say that you want your wife to cater to your sexual fantasies? Check your motivations.

While I absolutely agree with what the marriage counselor told you a couple of years ago that your urges are quite normal, you're leaving out the other half. The thing is, her sexual urges are normal, too. Not everyone is wired the same way. If we want people to accept that we're kinky, we have to accept that some people just plain aren't.

My advice to you is going to be the same that I give out at least once a week. (You'd be amazed how many husbands in vanilla marriages come to these boards asking what is essentially the same question.) Buy a copy of the book "When Someone You Love Is Kinky." Before asking her to read it, you read it first. That way, when the two of you are ready to talk about it, you both have the same terminology and reference. Also, you can use it as a guide for the things you are interested in and those that you are not.

If she still doesn't want to participate with you, find out what she is willing to compromise on. Would a visit to a pro be ok? What about public play with no physical sex involved? Is she open to poly, so she can have the vanilla you at home and the kinky you has an outlet elsewhere? There are a lot of ways that people work these things out without deception being necessary.

< Message edited by LadyPact -- 4/26/2009 5:48:47 AM >

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(in reply to slavelash)

Post #: 26

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 9:25:07 AM

SylvereApLeanan

Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: wildcat07

SylvereApLeanan Wow, that was great up there. Well writen and thought out. I am seriously going to use that advise, no joke. I think you should start a podcast or something. I will be the first to sign up. I am amazed at how when I hear problems and think "well that sucks, no solution" and someone like you comes along and has an amazing idea. That just made my night. ( I just read this back to myself and it sounds like I am being sarcastic but i am 100% not)

How incredibly sweet of you. Thank you.

I've never thought about doing a podcast before. I don't have the equipment for it. But I suppose I could do a YouTube series that accomplishes the same thing. Hmm...now you've given me food for thought.

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(in reply to wildcat07)

Post #: 27

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 10:46:40 AM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline

I think someone else may have mentioned this but.... the OP states they are an "expert" at quite a few things lifestyle oriented, i.e. cbt, whips, obedience training. Seeing as how he lists his age at 54, it really makes me question the sincerity. Is it a "new" happy marriage where all of the lifestyle things were experienced through a past relationship? Or despite all the talk about being "faithful" to the spouse, he has stepped out "undetected" many times and for some reason is now looking for validation to do so?

Having desires that your partnet doesn't share is of course completely normal. But if those desires are so overwhelming that you can't be satisfied by your partner, then you need to decide which is more important to you. Your partner or those desires. Interestingly enough, it seems those "desires" are always of a sexual nature. As many have said here, there are so many ways to serve your partner to satisfy "that" part of your nature. Seems the problem is she doesn't want you doing the stuff naked around the house and doesn't want to put a leash on your or tie up your testicles while doing it. Also as others have said, she appears to be more dominating than you realize, depriving you of what you want in favor of what pleases her instead.

(in reply to SylvereApLeanan)

Post #: 28

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 10:59:08 AM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

I think someone else may have mentioned this but.... the OP states they are an "expert" at quite a few things lifestyle oriented, i.e. cbt, whips, obedience training. Seeing as how he lists his age at 54, it really makes me question the sincerity. Is it a "new" happy marriage where all of the lifestyle things were experienced through a past relationship? Or despite all the talk about being "faithful" to the spouse, he has stepped out "undetected" many times and for some reason is now looking for validation to do so?

Could be a little more innocent than that, Lafayette. He might have got his present wife to try some of those things with him and while she didn't like them, he did. Or he could be an 'expert' at fantasising about such things rather than actually doing them. From what I hear, people are often wont to fill in their profile 'interests' on the latter basis.

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(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 29

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 11:08:28 AM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline

Peon,

I completely agree with you that people like to call themselves experts based on their readings and fantasies. It just makes me wonder when they pose questions such as this and their profile expresses that they are looking for very specific things. While his profile openly admits to being in a vanilla marriage, no where does it say that his spouse is aware of his "search" on this or other sites. So while he is practically screaming he is faithful to his wife, I have a feeling that is just because he has perused the boards and realizes that he would get blasted for violating that trust between spouses. In my opinion if you are willing to violate the trust and commitment in one relationship, there is no reason to expect you won't do it in others.

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Post #: 30

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 12:00:26 PM

GYPZYQUEEN

Posts: 730
Joined: 4/14/2009
Status: offline

OP STATES: "I feel like a GAY man in a straight marriage"

ok so what does that mean??

shall I read between the lines here..???

I think he wants ass play and strap on play as a dominant thing( or a good cock sucking) and associates it with gayness (which it is NOT) ..
thus letting the word slip out

If he is complaining of catholic sex then it is kink he seeks..or what he thinks it is..
not to do housework as a sub..or WORSHIP HIS WOMAN

I cannot tell you how many men I meet who will do housework or run errands to get to the good stuff ( ass fuck)as they see it
( "do- me" fake subs..that they are)

and it never happens...

* fuk them and their glass eye

evil grin

IF OP really wants some good advice
check...........
*venusontop.com ........ sections for men in vanilla marriage
*goddessclub.com....section for men & videos for couples
*Elise Suttons..Predominant (femdom) website

< Message edited by GYPZYQUEEN -- 4/26/2009 12:02:12 PM >

(in reply to peppermint)

Post #: 31

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 1:15:14 PM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GYPZYQUEEN

OP STATES: "I feel like a GAY man in a straight marriage"

ok so what does that mean??

shall I read between the lines here..???

I think he wants ass play and strap on play as a dominant thing( or a good cock sucking) and associates it with gayness (which it is NOT) ..
thus letting the word slip out

Must admit, I thought that by 'gay' he just meant he had a basic outlook that didn't fit with the standard roles men and women take in a partnership. I've never seen the word 'catholic' used as euphemism for anything sexual - but I took it to mean, roughly, missionary position and/or vanilla sex in general.

quote:

If he is complaining of catholic sex then it is kink he seeks..or what he thinks it is..
not to do housework as a sub..or WORSHIP HIS WOMAN

I cannot tell you how many men I meet who will do housework or run errands to get to the good stuff ( ass fuck)as they see it
( "do- me" fake subs..that they are)

We've just had a thread on that - it does seem that there are plenty of men who'll do housework without requesting or requiring ass-fucking. I certainly did, in one partnership I had. It's not a necessity to me now, either. As for the OP, from his profile interests, the boxes he's ticked suggest he is into the general area of service and worship.

Well, well. He can come and answer these and earlier charges if he wants. If he wants to play away while keeping his wife in the dark, that his own squalid business and I hope he roasts in one way or another for it. For my purposes, I don't care. My concern is for people who are genuinely locked into marriages with people they love but have suppressed a kink that now torments them.

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Post #: 32

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 1:28:08 PM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

. . . . while he is practically screaming he is faithful to his wife, I have a feeling that is just because he has perused the boards and realizes that he would get blasted for violating that trust between spouses . . .

My sense, from his profile, is that he's into servicing but won't do anything physical. He thinks that this means he's not being disloyal. But it's the usual rule: if it's not being disloyal, then one should be able to square it with one's partner.

*Sigh*. All a bit tawdry and dismal, really. I'm just glad somebody up there stopped me getting married (never mind having kids) before I found out I could get what I really wanted.

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Post #: 33

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 2:31:47 PM

azjojoba

Posts: 513
Joined: 2/1/2007
Status: offline

I'm surprised you haven't had more of a tongue lashing yet. The women on this website are vicious on this issue. Just look at the way they excoriate me for the same dilemmas.

I can already tell you what kind of advice they will give you: don't cheat, or get a divorce. For some weird reason the dominant women love to tell men to get divorces. Maybe they feel that will increase their potential pool of subbies.

I have the same problem you do, but perhaps worse since my wife doesn't care about sex -- vanilla or otherwise. That goes doubly for kinky sex.

Your urges won't go away. You have only a few alternatives. Assuming that talking your wife into being dominant isn't going to happen, you can either cheat or go to a pro. Either choice is OK if they work for you. It's an individual choice. Personally the pro option just doesn't appeal to me, so I cheat when I can. The women here hate me for being so blunt, but it hardly seems to matter, since it's unlikely I will find a woman at CM to do anything with.

The divorce option should be your last choice. I always hold out hope my wife will be willing to change, but it hasn't happened yet. I guess if she catches me cheating and chooses to divorce me then that problem will be solved.

Dude, I really sympathize, but don't expect any of the women here to give you useful advice. If you persist you will become a pariah just like me.

(in reply to slavelash)

Post #: 34

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 3:36:47 PM

SylvereApLeanan

Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: azjojoba
Assuming that talking your wife into being dominant isn't going to happen, you can either cheat or go to a pro. Either choice is OK if they work for you. It's an individual choice. Personally the pro option just doesn't appeal to me, so I cheat when I can. The women here hate me for being so blunt, but it hardly seems to matter, since it's unlikely I will find a woman at CM to do anything with.

Did it ever occur to you that the reason you'll probably never find a woman on CM who will have anything to do with you is BECAUSE you cheat?

Dude, it ain't rocket science.

Stop cheating and fucking deal with your situation like an adult either by getting a divorce or getting informed consent from your wife to play elsewhere. Don't expect to find a dominant woman until you man up and choose one of those options. There are dominant women who don't mind playing with you if you're married as long as your wife knows and is okay with it. What we mind is your propensity for lies, for acting like a selfish jackass, and for encouraging other men to follow your pitiful example.

The OP has already said he doesn't and won't cheat on his wife. His definition of cheating might not match mine (I don't know, he hasn't given details), but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. If he's being honest, at least he has something vaguely resembling integrity. What do you bring to the table?

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Dark Muse
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(in reply to azjojoba)

Post #: 35

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 4:07:23 PM

azjojoba

Posts: 513
Joined: 2/1/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SylvereApLeanan

Did it ever occur to you that the reason you'll probably never find a woman on CM who will have anything to do with you is BECAUSE you cheat?

Dude, it ain't rocket science.

Actually it did occur to me. I have been bludgeoned by that by many women here and although I'm not a rocket scientist, I can read and comprehend. In addition to the cheating thing, I have also made enough enemies on this forum to realize I don't have a chance at CM.

If I really want to meet some women here, I'll choose to make another identity and lie. I have learned enough here how to make a phony profile that will appeal to the majority of women at CM, and I have learned that when I post in this forum it should always be conciliatory. I can play the phony game as good as anyone if that's what's required.

I have no desire at the moment to play those sort of games, but I may change my mind at any time.

Oh well, thanks to all of you for educating me.

(in reply to SylvereApLeanan)

Post #: 36

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 4:09:33 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

You have lots of practice at lying and ignoring, I am sure you will do well.

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Post #: 37

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 4:23:55 PM

azjojoba

Posts: 513
Joined: 2/1/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

You have lots of practice at lying and ignoring, I am sure you will do well.

Hibby -- you ain't being nice, and you are being way too hard on me.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 38

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 4:35:05 PM

YourhandMyAss

Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

Many people have done that , and their personal shit and their posting style gives them away, and word spreads, and then if you want to get anywhere you gotta start again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: azjojoba

If I really want to meet some women here, I'll choose to make another identity and lie. I have learned enough here how to make a phony profile that will appeal to the majority of women at CM, and I have learned that when I post in this forum it should always be conciliatory. I can play the phony game as good as anyone if that's what's required.

I have no desire at the moment to play those sort of games, but I may change my mind at any time.

(in reply to azjojoba)

Post #: 39

RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 4:35:09 PM

SylvereApLeanan

Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: azjojoba

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

You have lots of practice at lying and ignoring, I am sure you will do well.

Hibby -- you ain't being nice, and you are being way too hard on me.

We're dominant women...we're more popular when we aren't "nice." And she's not beeing too hard on you. More like she's spot on. Truth's a bitch, n'est pas?

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl

"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

(in reply to azjojoba)

Post #: 40

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