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RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/26/2009 5:11:57 PM   
ShaktiSama


Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: azjojoba

I'm surprised you haven't had more of a tongue lashing yet. The women on this website are vicious on this issue. Just look at the way they excoriate me for the same dilemmas.


We don't excoriate you for having a dilemma.  We excoriate you for taking the lowest road you possibly can to cope with it.

Your "solution" is always to pass the buck and take no responsibility for your own sexuality or anything sexual you do.  Your urges and actions are the fault of everyone and anyone but you.  Cheating, lying, faking, whatever--someone besides you is always to blame.

Cheating on your spouse is not a solution; you just create more problems with your lies and cheating.  And further, you create a situation where innocent people who do not need to be involved in your marital drama are dragged into it and get hurt for absolutely no reason.

quote:

Assuming that talking your wife into being dominant isn't going to happen, you can either cheat or go to a pro. Either choice is OK if they work for you.


Two things.

1) "cheating" and "going to a pro" are the EXACT SAME THING.  One of them just costs more money, and thus is likely to piss your wife off even more, because you are not only betraying your marriage, you are depriving your family of resources to do so.

2)  Neither choice is "OK" if your wife does not KNOW ABOUT IT and AGREE to it. 

quote:

The divorce option should be your last choice. I always hold out hope my wife will be willing to change, but it hasn't happened yet. I guess if she catches me cheating and chooses to divorce me then that problem will be solved.


Ideally, yes, divorce should be your last choice; we agree on that score.  However, if getting a divorce is the only way that you can live an honest life, find happiness and be true to your nature, then bloody have the balls to pull the trigger your OWN self, BEFORE you cheat, and get it over with.

Waiting to get caught cheating is the absolutely weakest, most loathsome and cowardly way to end a relationship.  And in the end, it will make your divorce about a thousand times worse and more painful, especially in the legal and financial sense, to be caught red-handed in adultery.  Cheating, especially kinky cheating, will turn a judge and jury against you so fast it will make your head spin, and it will also make your spouse about a BILLION times more vindictive and vicious in court.  An angry woman divorcing you for adultery will crucify you with extreme prejudice.  Take every dime you have, all your mutual property, and deny you joint custody even of your pets, much less any children you may have.

In short, do NOT mistake anything that azhola says as useful advice.  Following his path will not only make every female organism on this planet loathe you and claw out her own genitals rather than fuck you; it will get you badly hurt financially, emotionally and legally, and it will cause your loved ones a million times more pain than is necessary even if you ultimately have to file for divorce.

"Irreconcilable differences" looks a whole lot better on those papers than "adultery".


_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
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(in reply to azjojoba)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/27/2009 6:07:31 PM   
YourhandMyAss


Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Uh, not that I really care other than I don't like generalizations being posted as truths, but not every woman on the planet is going to hate you if you're a cheater, and there defiantly are people who will fuck a cheater. It is not now and has not been a way to make every female alive hate you and claw out her own genitals rather than fuck you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama



In short, do NOT mistake anything that azhola says as useful advice.  Following his path will not only make every female organism on this planet loathe you and claw out her own genitals rather than fuck you;

(in reply to ShaktiSama)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/27/2009 8:15:49 PM   
ShaktiSama


Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline 		Snooch to the nooch.

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Profile   Post #: 43
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/27/2009 8:18:12 PM   
YoungLust


Posts: 70
Joined: 3/5/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

Uh, not that I really care other than I don't like generalizations being posted as truths, but not every woman on the planet is going to hate you if you're a cheater, and there defiantly are people who will fuck a cheater. It is not now and has not been a way to make every female alive hate you and claw out her own genitals rather than fuck you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama



In short, do NOT mistake anything that azhola says as useful advice.  Following his path will not only make every female organism on this planet loathe you and claw out her own genitals rather than fuck you;

Someone seems to not understand the fine art of hyperbole.

(in reply to YourhandMyAss)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/27/2009 9:09:50 PM   
azjojoba


Posts: 513
Joined: 2/1/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

Uh, not that I really care other than I don't like generalizations being posted as truths, but not every woman on the planet is going to hate you if you're a cheater, and there defiantly are people who will fuck a cheater. It is not now and has not been a way to make every female alive hate you and claw out her own genitals rather than fuck you.



Fortunately that's true. There are women who prefer married men. Thank goodness for that! I'm not sure why so few women at CM are sympathetic to that view -- but maybe like minds tend to stick together.

(in reply to YourhandMyAss)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/27/2009 9:17:18 PM   
Kaiel


Posts: 748
Joined: 4/17/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavelash

Thanks for the reply but leaving the marriage is not an option. i love her too much but she just can't get into the lifestyle. i figure something out, though!


I dont get this at all. If I was with someone i really loved, and they didnt like the lifestyle, I would quit. It seems the only option you have, is to talk with her about your needs, and see if she is happy for you to find an outlet.

In response to "I would quit".... quit what exactly? being who you are?
Umm, for some of U/us (Myself, included) suppressing who and how Y/you are is not an option. The OP needs to make some tough decisions. If his wife won't engage in the lifestyle then explaining to her the dynamics of a Pro maybe an option. I think honesty and truth weigh out above anything... and I think the first person you need to be honest with is yourself... what kind of relationship can you HAPPILY live with, whatever you come up with, go talk to her about it.... if she loves you, like you say you love her, then maybe there is a solution that you both just haven't found. Life doesn't have to be all or nothing.

On the flip side if she loved him, why would she ask him to be something other than who he has discovered himself to be???

< Message edited by Kaiel -- 4/27/2009 9:30:03 PM >

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RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 1:15:28 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaiel
In response to "I would quit".... quit what exactly? being who you are?
Umm, for some of U/us (Myself, included) suppressing who and how Y/you are is not an option. The OP needs to make some tough decisions. If his wife won't engage in the lifestyle then explaining to her the dynamics of a Pro maybe an option. I think honesty and truth weigh out above anything... and I think the first person you need to be honest with is yourself... what kind of relationship can you HAPPILY live with, whatever you come up with, go talk to her about it.... if she loves you, like you say you love her, then maybe there is a solution that you both just haven't found. Life doesn't have to be all or nothing.

On the flip side if she loved him, why would she ask him to be something other than who he has discovered himself to be???

Because it isn't what she signed up for.  In fact, right here, you are proving My earlier statements about what I said regarding her right to be vanilla.  I'm thinking that when they entered this marriage together, it was reasonable for her to expect an equality based monogamous partnership.  It would be My belief that is the way the majority of people on this planet do it.  We kinky folks have to remember that we really are the minority.  If we weren't this issue wouldn't come up nearly as often.

Turn the issue around for a moment.  Unless I'm mistaken, you are married.  If tomorrow your sub/husband came to you and said that he wanted to change your lives completely  and you'd have a vanilla household, how do you think you'd react?  I'll bet it wouldn't be pretty.  I'd even venture to say that most people in that situation would be ready with 'you knew this is who I was when you married me' comment.  Should you be able to envision yourself standing up for the right to be who you are,  you have to extend the same right to any non kinky person to be who they are.

Believe it or not, being open minded isn't a one way street.





_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

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Profile   Post #: 47
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 1:48:39 AM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaiel

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavelash

Thanks for the reply but leaving the marriage is not an option. i love her too much but she just can't get into the lifestyle. i figure something out, though!


I dont get this at all. If I was with someone i really loved, and they didnt like the lifestyle, I would quit. It seems the only option you have, is to talk with her about your needs, and see if she is happy for you to find an outlet.

In response to "I would quit".... quit what exactly? being who you are?
Umm, for some of U/us (Myself, included) suppressing who and how Y/you are is not an option. The OP needs to make some tough decisions. If his wife won't engage in the lifestyle then explaining to her the dynamics of a Pro maybe an option. I think honesty and truth weigh out above anything... and I think the first person you need to be honest with is yourself... what kind of relationship can you HAPPILY live with, whatever you come up with, go talk to her about it.... if she loves you, like you say you love her, then maybe there is a solution that you both just haven't found. Life doesn't have to be all or nothing.

On the flip side if she loved him, why would she ask him to be something other than who he has discovered himself to be???


Hi Ma`am. Hopefully this clarifies my viewpoint.

The distinction lies in the fact that he married her in the first place. You are right in that we cant change who we are, which is why he should have told his wife of his needs before marrying her.

I can only speak for myself and I truthfully would quit if my other half wanted me to. It would be grossly unfair to convince someone to marry me without them knowing all about me, including my lifestyle needs. Your comment about the flip side is true, only providing he was honest in the first place.

Now, if he found out he had these needs after getting marriage, his first obligation is surely to the vows he made, and not his new found needs.

(in reply to Kaiel)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 6:26:19 AM   
subtlebutterfly


Posts: 2230
Joined: 6/15/2008
From: Not your hood
Status: offline 		FR:
I bet your wife will be thrilled when she figures out you're on this kind of site, whining about your unhappy marriage, having username including the word slave, and last but not least have a picture of yourself only dressed in your pants. Well done!
You can only blame yourself for having married her in the first place, apparently she didn't know what kind of person she was marrying..so really..I do pity her.
Since you've tried marriage counseling then heh dude, either get used to it that you're married to a vanilla wife or divorce her. blahblahblahblabhlah you love her blahblahblah apparently you don't love her enough to keep your desires away so either lock them up in a closet or leave.
oh and btw..yeah, something called communication could work, since you apparently aint interested in living with her due to your kinky needs the result would probably be:
A: she gives in n tries but..guess what, not everybody WANTS to be dominant in the lifestyle way, if it doesn't do it for her you both will end up unhappy because this's not in her nature.
B: she/you comes up with the ultimatum, stay or leave.

heck you're 54 years old and starting complaining about it now, is a bit LATE.

*grumps*

*takes a deep breath*
and to add a bit..yanno maybe you should just show her your profile, seriously.
If I put myself into your wives shoes that profile would more than break my heart.
Here she is with a person who she's bothered marry, but the only thing coming out of that marriage is that the other party is miserable 'cause of who she is, yet that party decided to marry her. I'd want a divorce.
I would definitely not be interested in being the main reason for why my partner feels miserable.... the only reason being that I didn't want to dominate his kinky ass.
Loving a person doesn't mean you are meant to be together, there's more to a relationship than that.

< Message edited by subtlebutterfly -- 4/28/2009 7:11:40 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 49
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 7:06:28 AM   
ShaktiSama


Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subtlebutterfly
Loving a person doesn't mean you are meant to be together, there's more to a relationship than that.


I agree 100% with your post, and this line in particular.  This is really the long and short of why people on this site tend to recommend divorce to anyone who cannot negotiate well enough to have an honest relationship with their spouse.

There are MANY married men and women here and in this community in general who have their D/S needs met outside their primary partnership.  There are MANY polyamorous people here who have multiple people within their circle of relationships.  The difference between these people and those who want to be patted on the head for adultery and cheating is not about the details of who beats whose ass while wearing/not wearing a wedding ring.

It's about honesty and mutual respect.  These are the values that we are collectively standing up for here.  Sorry that this is something that azjojoba and YourHandMyAss do not understand--pointing out that there are people who do not care about honesty and mutual respect in this world does not make these things less important as community values.

Are there women who like to get involved with lying cheaters?  Yes, I'm sure there are.  And like all immoral and dishonest people, I'm sure they lead the lives that they deserve.

I see a ton of whining, self-pitying profiles on this site, written by men who want my assistance in betraying their spouses.  They will never, ever get that assistance.  For the record, I am also not going to help you molest your children, embezzle money from your parents' retirement fund, or in general betray the trust and good faith that you owe to any other member of your family.


_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
-- Robert A. Heinlein

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RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 6:52:25 PM   
azjojoba


Posts: 513
Joined: 2/1/2007
Status: offline 		So, I guess part of the femdom mantra on CM is to be judgemental towards all men who want to play around. You women sure are a bunch of traditional prudes. I have a hard time imagining you doing the kink you claim to do. Shaktisama would look more appropriate dressed in a nums schoolmistress outfit. Both her and that unsubtlebutterfly remind me of Meryl Streep in Doubt -- except that Streep was more open minded.

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Profile   Post #: 51
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 7:33:54 PM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Excuse me azjojoba... what is wrong with having a problem with people who lie?  What is prudish about that?

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RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 8:39:00 PM   
FullfigRIMAAM1


Posts: 1160
Joined: 11/20/2008
Status: offline 		I don't think he fails to see the problem in his non logic of, women not phucking around with lying married men=prudes, as much as he's trying to get a reaction...  I think he loves all of the online spankings he gets here for free.   M

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RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 8:52:52 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: azjojoba

So, I guess part of the femdom mantra on CM is to be judgemental towards all men who want to play around. You women sure are a bunch of traditional prudes. I have a hard time imagining you doing the kink you claim to do. Shaktisama would look more appropriate dressed in a nums schoolmistress outfit. Both her and that unsubtlebutterfly remind me of Meryl Streep in Doubt -- except that Streep was more open minded.



Just curious here.  Exactly how did you formulate the conclusion that kinky people would have lower morals and standards than the rest of society?


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 9:15:20 PM   
WyldHrt


Posts: 6412
Joined: 6/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

So, I guess part of the femdom mantra on CM is to be judgemental towards all men who want to play around.

Ummm, it's not just the Dommes that have an issue with people who lie and cheat. If you're going to throw accusations at women who object to such things, sign me up.  Jus' sayin.


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Profile   Post #: 55
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 10:03:29 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline 		I also have a major problem with people who cheat on their spouse

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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 10:09:53 PM   
dreamerdreaming


Posts: 2839
Status: offline 		This thread topic comes up about every five seconds here. Search it, please. I am tired of repeating myself. Go back and read what I said to the last five guys with this OP.

If the choices you've made are no longer working for you, make new and different choices.

Just be prepared for the new and different results.

Does your wife love the real you, or who you are pretending to be, for her? If she loves the real, whole you, then she may best express it by letting you go so that you can be your authentic self. Sometimes love means letting go.

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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 10:38:08 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: azjojoba

So, I guess part of the femdom mantra on CM is to be judgemental towards all men who want to play around. 


No, only to the ones who want to lie about it.
 
See, herein lies (pardon the pun) the problem with your logic:  I'm polyamorous.  There are quite a few women on this site who are polyamorous.  None of us have a problem with married men who want to play.  I don't want one -- I'm more interested in women -- but I don't have a problem with married men getting their kinky needs met by someone other than their wives.
 
What I do have a problem with and what you can't seem to get through your deliberately obtuse skull is that the problem I, and so many other women, have is with lying.
 
Do you get it yet?  I can't make the key word any bigger but I guess I can put dancing pineapples or something around it so it will stand out for you.  GET PERMISSION BEFORE YOU PLAY.  Once again, it ain't rocket science.  If you can't get permission from your wife to have someone else scratch that itch for you, then you have a bigger problem than whether or not the women who constantly shoot you down are open-minded. 
 
And if you think it's perfectly okay to cheat on your spouse, then do your poor wife a favor and go directly to the divorce lawyer.  Don't even think about attempting to have a relationship with anyone except your dominant hand.  You.  Are.  Broken.

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(in reply to azjojoba)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 10:54:06 PM   
azjojoba


Posts: 513
Joined: 2/1/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Just curious here.  Exactly how did you formulate the conclusion that kinky people would have lower morals and standards than the rest of society?


I thought they would be more open minded and sexually liberated. OK, I was wrong. I just slapped myself on the head for being so stupid.

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: How can a subbie survive in a happy/vanilla marriage? - 4/28/2009 10:58:47 PM   
ShaktiSama


Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: azjojoba
I thought they would be more open minded and sexually liberated. 


Not sure what open minds and sexual liberation have to do with being a liar and betraying people who care about you, but sure, whatever.  If being "open-minded" and "liberated" means that lying cheating douchebags suddenly aren't lying cheating douchebags, and black is white, up is down, etc., then by all means, write us off as "prudes" because we don't practice Manson Family Values.

_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
-- Robert A. Heinlein

(in reply to azjojoba)
Profile   Post #: 60
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