RE: Two girls who love each other making out and showering. Claims its not sexual.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 5/28/2009 6:05:16 PM

marie2

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I agree with the majority here, Wildthought. I can't see how making out isn't sexual to some degree. However, I wouldn't automatically conclude that your girl is full of shit or is trying to manipulate or be dishonest with you. It could be that she sees it as less sexual than something that would take place below the waist...or maybe she's just in a bit of denial, or not completely in touch with her feelings about the other girl.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 5/28/2009 6:57:46 PM

Drifa

Posts: 547
Joined: 7/27/2007
From: Rural Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DavanKael
However, I am very dubious that making out with someone you love can be construed as a non-sexual act. How is it possible not to get turned on in that situaltion? Anyway, wanted hear from woman - especially bi on this topic. Can you be in a loving relationship with a female friend, make out, maybe even shower together and have that not turn you on and therefore not be sexual? It sounds crazy to me, but I have testosterone and a penis and feel the need to double check.

Okies, I am bi, and have been in a D/s relationship with another woman for 15 years. Here's my answer to your question.

It has nothing really to do with being bi or lesbian. Or with being "in love", whatever that means to the girl in question. I'm still creeped out by the description the OP used in the first post of the emotion as "sister love". My sister is kinky and bi-flexible, but eeeww, I am so not having any sexual thoughts or actions that include her!!!! You don't screw your sister. Eeew.

There is a difference between cuddling and foreplay. "Making out" is foreplay, it's a prelude to sex. The way some kids use "making out" these days it can also mean "any sexual act in which a penis is not inserted into a vagina". "Making out" by any definition is sexual. Cuddling, which I'd define as being stuff like non-sexual massage, hugging, sitting or lying wrapped around one another (but no dry humping!) is not necessarily sexual but can certainly shade into foreplay.

In general, women are not as visually wired as men. So being naked in the shower isn't sexual. I can wash another person's back and have that not be sexual. But if the soapy goodness is including breasts, genitals, nipples... it's sexual.

I can be in a very deeply emptional loving relationship with another woman that is non-sexual. I have a dear friend who was my college roomie that I love like a sister but never any overtones of sexual love in there. If I'd ever found myself making out with her, that would totally have changed the dynamic and made it sexual... not that this was or ever will be a possibility in our relationship. But just seeing her naked or even helping her scrub the peeling sunburn in the shower was never sexual. Neither was hugging. We were never into cuddling either.

None of this is really the point though. When you are in a committed relationship, vanilla or kink, and what you are doing makes your partner this profoundly uncomfortable, then the relationship has problems. I still think WildThought should DTMFA, but if he wants to salvage the relationship, they need to be communicating better and talking honestly, openly, and working the issue out.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 5/31/2009 9:10:05 PM

flowerchicknz

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Cut her some slack. If my local church is anything to go by, most girls will never tell their husband and kids they're sexually transmitting closet gay,
She's telling him half a hard truth instead of an easy white lie. And now he has to do some thinking about his love for her, versus, not being the "only one" in her life.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/1/2009 2:20:57 AM

greeneyedreamer

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quote:

I think you've wandered into the wrong fora. Manipulative feminism is down the hall, 2nd door on the right.

I think I came across wrong. It appears that this is a "need" she has. If so, maybe, he can let her experience this the way she wants just once... Her need isn't going to go away I am sure, so could be it would be a good thing to let her have her "fling" with a girl and just get it over with. then they could discuss it and move on ... Ahh I have really not come across the way I meant to..

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Post #: 64

RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/1/2009 2:22:36 AM

greeneyedreamer

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quote:

Cut her some slack. If my local church is anything to go by, most girls will never tell their husband and kids they're sexually transmitting closet gay,
She's telling him half a hard truth instead of an easy white lie. And now he has to do some thinking about his love for her, versus, not being the "only one" in her life.

Finally someone who understands my point of view!!! Thank you for stating what I was trying to say much better than I did...

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/1/2009 9:23:37 AM

aravain

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble
Making out can be for the connection, the joy of pure tactile sensation (like petting a kitten; I love the soft fur but the action doesn't turn me on), for the bonding or even just for giggles.

note to self: All those pussy/cat metaphors aren't about vaginas, but kissing? I'm confused.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/2/2009 7:13:06 PM

sublibrarian

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I'm bi and I have made out with my best friend on a few occasions merely as an expression of our love and emotional intimacy with each other - totally without fucking/sex being involved. Granted, we were both on an illicit substance every time this happened. ;-)

However, even though I'm bi and poly, I have to agree that if this is a limit set by her Dom she needs to follow it, renegotiate, or leave. When I wanted permission to fuck other guys without my Dom being there or giving permission at that time, I talked it out with him and waited a while for him to think about it. I certainly didn't just do it and say, "But this is who I am! I'm a slut!"

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/3/2009 7:41:12 AM

OsideGirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

Whether or not being turned on is a criteria for something to be sexual is another story

That was a point that stuck in my mind. So, she's supposed to never be turned on without your permission? I can look at a corset and be turned on. I can think of some scene and be turned on.

While I can understand your point of view, I'll add a different side to this. If she's making out and turned on......and unable to have sex or climax without your permission. You're coming home to an aroused woman.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/3/2009 10:10:43 AM

Arpig

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quote:

While I can understand your point of view, I'll add a different side to this. If she's making out and turned on......and unable to have sex or climax without your permission. You're coming home to an aroused woman.

Except that the agreed upon rule was no sex with others without the dom present. As the dom, it is his (or her just to be gender-neutral) prerogative to decide what he (or she) considers sexual. End of story.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/3/2009 10:54:33 AM

GYPZYQUEEN

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OP:
you said no PLAYING...without you there..so what does playing mean to you?
what does turned on mean to you?what does making out mean to you? what does sexual mean to you?
IF you feel 2 naked women showering is sexual and playing then it is
YOUR DECISION that IT IS...and to discuss what you had put in place for her.
Her trying to persuade you by using her idea of sexual is disobediance..as far as I am concerned..YOU SAID NO..no is no..

I feel that what is happening is EROTICISM...which is basically being turned on..eroticism is the precurser/anticipation to sexual activity which is then whatever the person thinks is sex..if they are eroticising (wheather visually..auditory or touch) they are half way there... ..
and she said "making out"....so what is that? in high school if you made out on the couch with someone what was the feeling??
non sexaul??............. nope

I am bi and I had a close close relationship with a woman..we even SLEPT in a bed( and also one with a man where we slept together for comfort)
but yet I never felt anything sexual...we however did not shower together..naked adds a new dimension..opens to the fragility of the mind..takes away boundries and limits..

TALK...

GQ

< Message edited by GYPZYQUEEN -- 6/3/2009 10:58:41 AM >

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/3/2009 11:00:11 AM

YourhandMyAss

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I am in love with my daddy and we can kiss and shower and not get aroused, and I have on a time or two bathed another women I was sexually involved with and not been aroused, it depends on the intent, am I bathing them for a sexual purpose or are we in there getting clean to go about our day.

quote:

ORIGINAL: WildThought

I have a sub who is very much in "sister love" with another girl. They hang out often and I am ok with that. Anyway, I get a phone call and she wants to know if its ok if her and her friend make out. I am not into playing with others without both present and told her no. She goes on to try to convince me that since they do not diddle or lick each others clits its not sexual. She has no problems following my orders with this regard. However, I am very dubious that making out with someone you love can be construed as a non-sexual act. How is it possible not to get turned on in that situaltion? Anyway, wanted hear from woman - especially bi on this topic. Can you be in a loving relationship with a female friend, make out, maybe even shower together and have that not turn you on and therefore not be sexual? It sounds crazy to me, but I have testosterone and a penis and feel the need to double check.

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/3/2009 6:49:11 PM

lostgirl83

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I am sure if the roles were reversed and YOU were making out with another girl she wouldn't take that as being "nothing sexual". Just because she's making out with another woman instead of someone of the opposite sex doesn't make it ok unless all parties agree on the situation. If you already told her how you felt about it and you re explained it to her over the phone she should either take that and respect it or maybe you need to reevaluate the relationship.

(in reply to Drifa)

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RE: Two girls who love each other making out and shower... - 6/3/2009 11:55:48 PM

YourhandMyAss

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I don't know about making out since I'm not a big kisser and maker outer, however.On the bathing part I disagree, you can take a bath with someone you love and not have it be sexual. You can even wash and handle dangly bits, and not have it be sexual or get turned on. If it's not possible for you, great, but it's possible for others, me included.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

...Can you be in a loving relationship with a female friend, make out, maybe even shower together and have that not turn you on and therefore not be sexual?...

No.