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tazzygirl -> RE: are we all "equal"? (7/1/2009 1:44:51 PM)
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i see those facets of fullfilling each others needs not as equality, but as compatability. can you fill my needs, can i fill yours... are we compatable enough to give each other what we want/need/desire.
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Yes, we would be equal, just that I'd be in charge.
Few things are more moronic than the idea of superiority, either in a gender sense, or a D/s sense.
if what you say is true, what gives you the right to call others moronic? name calling in the middle of a debate is used for nothing more than to try and incite. please, try and refrain, it serves no good purpose.
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ORIGINAL: oceanwinds
Our value to life holds equal opportunity in the areas that we are good at. I am an excellent cook, and I know males who are just as good, perhaps some better and some not. I cannot sew but late hubby was great at that, and made most of our leather things, as well as garments we wore for pagan rituals at times. We both were good with growing flowers and vegs, so is Sir. He is better at focus and mastering his emotions, i am striving for that myself.
I believe equal is becoming all you can be in this world. Some are great in logic, others in abstract. Some are better in dealing with other people, some are not. But we all have something of worth to give to this world, hence this is what makes us equal. Ds or Ms is giving the all that you are in that situation. What you give to it has worth.
equal opportunity is indeed afforded to each of us. but, it is up to us to try and grasp it, to excell at whatever we are good at. equal opportunity does not make us "equals". it only gives us the chance, not bthe entitlement. and, yes, we all have worth. im not implying we dont. nor, again, do i see myself as "less" than Master. i just see him as not my equal, because i have given him the power over me.
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ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
in my way of thinking, the minute i turn to a man and say... i am giving up control to your wisdom... i am giving up my right to be equal to that man. im still waiting to hear an argument against this.
But that depends if you see yourself as equal to that man before you do the giving up control thing?
For me, I never saw myself as equal anyway. I don't see myself equal to anyone. So when I hand over authority to another, we were not equal in the first place.
the.dark.
i see your point dark. so, perhaps the question is, do we see ourselves as not being equal to anyone. and in this, i have to agree. i am not equal to anyone. no one had the same exact life as i have had to this moment in my life. education, opportunities, health, relationships... all that is different, as a whole, from everyone elses.
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ORIGINAL: Missokyst
I am equal in that I am the sum of my parts. Add up my life, skills, experience, and taste .. it pretty much adds up to who I am now. I don't judge myself by anothers yardstick. The fact that I can dominate life, or submit to a man does not make me more or less in my eyes.
Kyst
so there is only more, less, or equal, in your eyes. what happened to the idea of just being.. different? must we all be equal, the same?
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ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant
Somehow along the way, the goals of the founding fathers got screwed up and people began thinking that there should be equal OUTCOME rather than equal OPPORTUNITY but that's for a political thread.
There is no equality in relationships either. Sometimes things are going to go more your way and sometimes things are going to go more your partner's way, at least in vanilla relationships. In D/s, if you are really looking at the dynamic, and you have a healthy D/s dynamic that works for you, there really is more equality going on...in terms of outcome...than in many non D/s relationships and that is because the submissive is having his/her wants and needs and desires cared for by the dominant and the dominant is having his/her wants and needs and desires cared for by the submissive. His need to be responsible, her need to serve are being met, etc, etc, etc.. From that abstract position, that is where you find the equality. The inequality comes in in that the dominant has the ability to make final decisions, it is the dominant whose wants and desires and needs (but not basic needs, as discussed in other threads) that come first. The inequality comes in in that the submissive has the right to make something that was not a hard limit before a hard limit now. The submissive has the right, no matter how deeply the dominant owns and controls her, to say "No". The equality comes back in in the recognition by both the submissive and the dominant that abdication of the dominant's responsibilities or the invoking of the choice of "No" by the submissive alters the dynamic.
There is equality to be found within the inequality and inequality to be found within the equality. Master FireMa'am's slave acquaintance put it nicely...We are of equal value but not of equal status. That does not make either party inferior or superior nor does it make them equal. It makes them partners who understand that life isn't always fair but on balance, it is what works best.
this i find interesting... the first bolded section, i have a bit of trouble with. a Dominant has the ability to decide IF he will fullfill teh submissives desires and wants... needs should always be met, in my opinion. the submissive will always strive to fullfill the D's wants, desires and needs. a slight difference, i think.
the second bolded part i could not agree more with. my value, in Master's eyes, rise with my obedience. i can see a man coming to the point where he will look at the woman (or the woman looks at the male submissive) and states... you have no equal in my eyes.
then again, i already knew that. i have no equal. not do i want one, or do i expect to become equal to anyone else. what i have, i worked for, what i dont have, i didnt deem worthy of my efforts. but if you list all my accomplishments, all my failures, all my trials and experiences, my education, my work history, my wants, desires, needs, ect ect ect... you will find no one is my equal. that does not make me better, that does not make me inferior... it makes me ... different.
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