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RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 3:19:29 AM   
daintydimples


Posts: 967
Joined: 7/6/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Elipsis

Well... by built on I'm going to take that to mean what is the foundation ...as in how do the relationships start and not where they end up.

Based on those definitions, relationships are not built on:

-Love (it takes a long time to really love someone so how could you build on it before it exists)
-Trust (probably not, trust has to be earned)

Relationships can be built on the following but it's probably not a good idea imo:

-BDSM / Fetish compatibilities (it's fun, but it's not much to go on)
-Sex (because you can have sex with anyone, and if this is where you start it will be easy to replace each other with someone else who also has sex)

Relationships are best built on the following, again imo:

-Respect (you don't have to have a long history with someone to treat them with respect)
-Admiration (it doesn't take long before you can determine if you think a person has admirable qualities)

Other ideas and things you might want to have:

-Commitment [depending on your kind of relationship] (you can start a relationship committed to each other, and both decide to make a best effort at making it work)
-Common Interests (not absolutely required, but they make spending time together easier and more enjoyable imo)



I didn't use the word "compatibility" anywhere in there because I feel like compatibility is sort of an umbrella that overall describes the sum of all of these (and more) parts in a relationship



I agree with all of the above.

And he didn't say fall in love, he said love.

You can fall in love instantly. I've done it. But really that means fall in lust. It's all about a mutual chemical attraction. It makes for great sex, but has nothing to do with love, because it is inherently selfish. A nice strong, "I want to scratch your back, because you scratch mine so well."  I'm not saying that doesn't have value, because it does. It's just not love to me.

Love, to me, is not selfish. It's feeling so strongly about a person, you are willing to put their needs above your own. And I don't believe people do that instantly. I think it takes time to build.

I have to mention that I really wish Elipsis was 25 years older. We'd have to have a serious talk.






_____________________________

Some soften by the forced reflection that comes from loss; others harden. Which are you?




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Profile   Post #: 21
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 5:12:14 AM   
agirl


Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: allthatjaz

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elipsis

Well... by built on I'm going to take that to mean what is the foundation ...as in how do the relationships start and not where they end up.

Based on those definitions, relationships are not built on:

-Love (it takes a long time to really love someone so how could you build on it before it exists)
-Trust (probably not, trust has to be earned)

Relationships can be built on the following but it's probably not a good idea imo:

-BDSM / Fetish compatibilities (it's fun, but it's not much to go on)
-Sex (because you can have sex with anyone, and if this is where you start it will be easy to replace each other with someone else who also has sex)

Relationships are best built on the following, again imo:

-Respect (you don't have to have a long history with someone to treat them with respect)
-Admiration (it doesn't take long before you can determine if you think a person has admirable qualities)

Other ideas and things you might want to have:

-Commitment [depending on your kind of relationship] (you can start a relationship committed to each other, and both decide to make a best effort at making it work)
-Common Interests (not absolutely required, but they make spending time together easier and more enjoyable imo)



I didn't use the word "compatibility" anywhere in there because I feel like compatibility is sort of an umbrella that overall describes the sum of all of these (and more) parts in a relationship


Oh I think people can instantly fall in love. Look at a mother the moment she gives birth to her child. The love is instant.
IMO other important elements are chemistry, the scent of you partner and mutual aspiration.
I have respect, admiration and common interests with my friends and family but none of them are my partner


That's often said ......but I know lots of mothers, including myself, that GREW to love their babies. I had instant protectiveness and certainly cared for them but I didn't *love* them instantly.

I also view the *falling in love* thing as very different to having grown to love someone.  I see it as falling in love with the idea of a person. I can't discount the fact that people DO say they *fell in love the second I clapped eyes you* , I've had 2 men say it to me and when they actually got to know me , they weren't quite so much in *love*.

My relationship was most assuredly built in the way Elipsis mentioned. Deep affection and trust grew out of the continued respect and admiration. There were lots of other things that aided that, of course, as I WAS marginally attracted to him after a few years.

agirl

(in reply to allthatjaz)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 6:21:16 AM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SteelofUtah
Let me say this. Sex is not the Number one important thing on my list in fact of the three people in my relationship I am the LEAST Sexually driven, however if sex were all the sudden GONE you can be sure I would be giving walking papers quickly as it is really IMPORTANT that it be there and not forced and not begged for.

Let me say that oddly enough I have found LOVE to be the least important factor in a healthy relationship  (Now wait and read the rest before getting all pissy) I say this because Love is the one thing that everyone says they have for the other and it is NEVER enough to make things better, in fact it is often the one thing that keeps people together who really shouldn't be together.


But just like sex... once love is gone, you're screwed.

No pun intended.



_____________________________

"Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable." Sidney J. harris

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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 7:32:46 AM   
CallaFirestormBW


Posts: 3651
Joined: 6/29/2008
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quote:

But just like sex... once love is gone, you're screwed.


You know, I'm going to go with Heinlein on this one. I think that if "love"... whatever that elusive quality -is-... is present, it doesn't -go- away. I can honestly say that, for anyone that I've actually gone so far as to say that I -loved-, even the ones I came to -hate- I still -loved-. If it fades, it wasn't "love"... lust, maybe... interest... fascination... affection... but you can't love what you don't completely -know-, IMO... so if the bloom fades from the rose after you've come to fully know someone or something... then what you were feeling wasn't love.

DC



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Profile   Post #: 24
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 7:58:24 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		I have to say that I am looking at the OP from one very specific viewpoint, which may be in contrast to the original.

I am one of those who, at times, will give those types of responses on certain topics.  The one that stands out the most to Me in My insufficient caffeine infused related morning is how I will tend to bring it up when it comes to threads related to 'how do I make My vanilla partner kinky' type subjects.  Where folks have a wonderful marriage, but now suddenly one partner has decided that they have a 'need' to include kink in their life and the other person has no interest in it.  I don't give the response on order to shame anyone into feeling guilty for wanting to be kinky.  It's more about My belief that people need to take a look at what really is important to them, and if they are in such a position, decide which is most important to them.  In some cases, it's best for them to have an idea of which of their wants has the higher priority, either the marriage of the kink, because it's entirely possible that they are only going to have one or the other.

Truth be told, I attribute this to My own experience in My marriage where this potential has come to pass.  When MP and I decided to do this thing, that decision was made with the condition that our marriage was more important than our being poly, or kink, or S/m or any other thing.  We knew more than any other wants that we had, we wanted each other most of all and anything else was secondary.  I've been saying this for as long as I've been on this site and longer.  If right now today I had to make a choice between My husband and the BDSM related stuff, the BDSM would be gone.  Not that I don't appreciate the fact that I am one of those lucky people who are able to have both.  It's just that I know which has the higher priority in My life and I don't confuse Myself about it.

Yes, giving it up would suck and I'm sure I'd have some things to work through during the process.  There are some things that I'd miss a hell of a lot.  The thing is, I know that more than anything else, in My old age, I want him with Me more than anything else.  If giving up the kink would be what was necessary to have that, I could absolutely do it.

I'll come back to the thread after the drive back from San Fransisco.  Folsom was awesome, but Mr Wonderful wants to get on the road.  LOL.


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to DomImus)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 9:04:36 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		I am going to answer from a very generic point of view, ALL relationships. Regardless of type, regardless of who, how many, or any other factor.....for a relationship to work and grow, there has to be some sort of common goal. Some ying that feeds the other yang. If you haven't got that commonality, it is destined for failure.

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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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Profile   Post #: 26
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 9:45:52 AM   
tammystarm


Posts: 3045
Joined: 7/26/2006
Status: offline 		Master's and my relationship is built on trust, friendship, compatibility, mutual goals, respect and love... i am one very lucky sub/slabve   

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~~Emotionally delusional~~

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Profile   Post #: 27
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 11:37:02 AM   
kallisto


Posts: 1185
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SteelofUtah

So what do you think a Relationship is Built on?

Steel


A realization that your yin feeds his/her yang or his/her yin feeds your yang.   (To steal LaTigresse's words).     To see that person and want to go forward with them.    You compliment each other in your likes/dislikes/interests/morals/ethics/love of nature/sports/etc. and you have that want/need to find  out more.  

A relationship is always growing and maturing.  If it gets stagnant, then I think that's where problems begin.
 

(in reply to SteelofUtah)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 12:46:06 PM   
MasterFireMaam


Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline 		I feel that there must be some kind of connection, first and foremost. What that connection is and looks like is individualistic... it can even be a dysfunctional connection, unless we're talking about only healthy relationships here. For ease of discussion, let's assume we are.

From that connection, I feel there needs to be some sort of agreement about transparency and openness. For me, often the depth of the relationship is, in part, based on the depth of the transparency. So, that means that the connection has to be emotional for me. If it's just physical, I don't think it'd last long.

After that, appropriate communication is important. It doesn't go well if I have an emotional connection to someone who yells at me all the time. But then, if we're talking about a healthy relationship, that's not going to happen. Still, we have to be able to communicate well in order to maintain the health.

Finally, we have to be able to speak each other's language. In other words, they need to be able to show that I'm important to them in a way that I understand. This varies, I feel, based on the type of relationship. My slave shows me he "loves" (and I use that term loosely) me in a totally different way than my boyfriend. The converse is also true.

If we can get all that going, I think we'd have and maintain a beautiful relationship.

Master Fire

_____________________________

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BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to SteelofUtah)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 12:51:04 PM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SteelofUtah
So what do you think a Relationship is Built on?


Rock and Roll.

the.dark.

_____________________________
RC&dc


love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

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Profile   Post #: 30
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 2:40:40 PM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW
You know, I'm going to go with Heinlein on this one. I think that if "love"... whatever that elusive quality -is-... is present, it doesn't -go- away. I can honestly say that, for anyone that I've actually gone so far as to say that I -loved-, even the ones I came to -hate- I still -loved-. If it fades, it wasn't "love"... lust, maybe... interest... fascination... affection... but you can't love what you don't completely -know-, IMO... so if the bloom fades from the rose after you've come to fully know someone or something... then what you were feeling wasn't love.


A couple of thoughts on this. First, this is a fairly common refrain that pops up when the subject of love is discussed. I have always considered the "you never loved if you no longer love" angle to be a cop out. Just my opinion.

Secondly, do you ever really know someone completely? Or to rephrase, at what point can you be sure that you know them completely? Does a little buzzer go off somewhere like the timer on a microwave? Is it after a certain number of years together? Would Ed McMahon (if he were still alive) show up at your door with a certificate proclaiming such?




_____________________________

"Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable." Sidney J. harris

(in reply to CallaFirestormBW)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 3:18:11 PM   
CallaFirestormBW


Posts: 3651
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus

A couple of thoughts on this. First, this is a fairly common refrain that pops up when the subject of love is discussed. I have always considered the "you never loved if you no longer love" angle to be a cop out. Just my opinion.


Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and sometimes the most effective tool for communication is the phrase "We agree to disagree."

quote:

Secondly, do you ever really know someone completely? Or to rephrase, at what point can you be sure that you know them completely? Does a little buzzer go off somewhere like the timer on a microwave? Is it after a certain number of years together? Would Ed McMahon (if he were still alive) show up at your door with a certificate proclaiming such?


I concede this point -- I think, though, that there has been, IME, a point at which illusion falls away, and the people in a relationship see one another for who they truly are -- no decoration, no pretense. To me, if you can embrace this person -- the one whose flaws are exposed and whose most irritating features are visible and noticeable, then that, to me, shows the presence of what _I_ call "love". Part of the problem, though, is that love is an 'undefined' term... or more accurately, an individually-defined term. So that opens up the definition of 'love' to anything a person wants it to be.

Maybe we can't truly know another person -- I suspect that's probably true -- but I guess that, for me, I won't call it "love" until I know that I can embrace the person not -despite- hir flaws, but fully inclusive of them -- until I know the person well enough to be able to trust that that is the case, I suppose that I withhold defining what we have as "love", because, to me, it feels superficial without the capacity to embrace everything that that person has revealed about hirself, good, bad or ugly.

Dame Calla


_____________________________

***
Said to me recently: "Look, I know you're the "voice of reason"... but dammit, I LIKE being unreasonable!!!!"

"Your mind is more interested in the challenge of becoming than the challenge of doing." Jon Benson, Bodybuilder/Trainer

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Profile   Post #: 32
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 3:31:29 PM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		My Sir and my relationship is built on affection, friendship, a compatible intelligence, and a mutual kink. After a few meetings i knew i could live with this man. There was enough of a connection to allow me to see that we had interests in common so that we could communicate effectively. We spoke the same language as it were.

Even when the kink waxes and wanes, the enjoyment we have in each other is constant.

(in reply to CallaFirestormBW)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 4:26:21 PM   
Elipsis


Posts: 301
Joined: 7/8/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: daintydimples

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elipsis

Well... by built on I'm going to take that to mean what is the foundation ...as in how do the relationships start and not where they end up.

Based on those definitions, relationships are not built on:

-Love (it takes a long time to really love someone so how could you build on it before it exists)
-Trust (probably not, trust has to be earned)

Relationships can be built on the following but it's probably not a good idea imo:

-BDSM / Fetish compatibilities (it's fun, but it's not much to go on)
-Sex (because you can have sex with anyone, and if this is where you start it will be easy to replace each other with someone else who also has sex)

Relationships are best built on the following, again imo:

-Respect (you don't have to have a long history with someone to treat them with respect)
-Admiration (it doesn't take long before you can determine if you think a person has admirable qualities)

Other ideas and things you might want to have:

-Commitment [depending on your kind of relationship] (you can start a relationship committed to each other, and both decide to make a best effort at making it work)
-Common Interests (not absolutely required, but they make spending time together easier and more enjoyable imo)



I didn't use the word "compatibility" anywhere in there because I feel like compatibility is sort of an umbrella that overall describes the sum of all of these (and more) parts in a relationship



I agree with all of the above.

And he didn't say fall in love, he said love.

You can fall in love instantly. I've done it. But really that means fall in lust. It's all about a mutual chemical attraction. It makes for great sex, but has nothing to do with love, because it is inherently selfish. A nice strong, "I want to scratch your back, because you scratch mine so well."  I'm not saying that doesn't have value, because it does. It's just not love to me.

Love, to me, is not selfish. It's feeling so strongly about a person, you are willing to put their needs above your own. And I don't believe people do that instantly. I think it takes time to build.

I have to mention that I really wish Elipsis was 25 years older. We'd have to have a serious talk.


Oh... well, thank you... I believe. :)

I wouldn't call it falling in lust either.  You can lust for someone and have no interest in a relationship in them.

A better word than either love or lust is infatuation.

(in reply to daintydimples)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 4:41:08 PM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline 		Interesting thread, Steel...you've been coming up with some good ones.

des noted it so I am going to tackle one issue head on.  One of the few times my ex-wife and I went to a counselor together, he said the following to us:  "Sexuality is not the biggest nor the most important part of a relationship...".  I wish you all could've seen her face, triumphantly turned towards me with a "see?  I told you" look on it when he finished his statement thusly "until it is NOT a part of the relationship at all."

I've stated before that in my world, I want my relationship and my dynamic entwined and yet separated.  Entwined because for me, the romantic/love relationship enhances the D/s dynamic and vice-versa.  Even with someone I might play casually with, I no longer want it to be a "faceless" encounter...I want to know the person and like them on some level.  That said, in my primary relationship, I want to have love, sexuality, companionship that comes from compatibility, communication, and honesty.  It's often been posted on the boards that a D/s dynamic is about the dominant's wants and the submissive's needs at a basic level.  In my D/s dynamic, I want obedience, sexuality, masochism to match my own sadism, sexuality, and the ability and willingness and desire to say "yes, Sir" when she would really rather say "No, Sir", the courage to say "No" in defiance of a breach of our dynamic by me, the willingness to explore, and compatibility (the 85 - 15 rule).  I want a submissive whose submissive's souls sing in harmony to my dominant plucking of them.  I don't need love within the dynamic except as an enhancement of the D/s at the heart of the relationship we embarked on.  In recognition of the entwining of the relationship and the D/s dynamic, I want a partner/submissive who loves me and cares about me enough to not run when the going gets tough and who needs me and who I am as a partner and as a dominant enough to want to fight to hang onto us...not out of some stubborn pride but from out of a place within that knows that while I don't encompass her whole world, I am the one who most...outside herself... makes her world livable.

(in reply to SteelofUtah)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 5:14:24 PM   
pyroaquatic


Posts: 1535
Joined: 12/4/2006
From: Pyroaquatica
Status: offline 		A Relationship is built on....

how well you relate to the individual you are on the ship with. Through the rough seas or the wonderful sunsets they are there, steadfast, as you are.

Love binds the boat together and holds it strong against the currents and waves, the eddies, and yes even the rocks. Sure the boat can break but it can be rebuilt.

Love endures.

Sex just makes little dingys.


_____________________________

You are what your deep, driving desire is.
As your desire is, so is your will.
As your will is, so is your deed.
As your deed is, so is your destiny.
-Brihadaranyaka Upanishad IV.4.5

(in reply to SteelofUtah)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 5:23:28 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		When Lady Neets and I first got together and it was obvious that there was something deeper starting to happen, I sat her down so we could talk. We talked about our 30 year age difference, the fact that I had already had a vasectomy and my T2 Diabetes together with my osteoarthritis in both knees. She grew up in a home with her dad who is like me a Vietnam vet and knew first hand about the effects of PTSD. We built our relationship of friendship first and allowed the respect and trust to grow with time. We loved each other already and yes love and lust was and is well blended still as an integral part of our relationship. There were and are almost no secrets (Outside my previous areas of operational work). She took on board my paganism like a duck to water as she did my love of the alternative lifestyle we shared (Gorean Lifestyle) which changed into the current evolution into the Victorian Lifestyle. We have been in step and on the same page all the way.

I honestly do not understand from a practical experience aspect what this falling in love is. For me it, if I take my own experiences, more like the Sicilian Thunderbolt which hits you right between the eyes and leaves you dazed without any warning. For me you can love some madly in the evening, sort of like them when you struggle out of bed to shower and head off to work, may even dislike that person at lunchtime and and be wrapped in emotional and sexual amour when you get home. I am in love with my Neets deeply in love and this does not vary. It has stood the tests of time, illness, adversity from her parents (until the understood that I would place my life on the life for her), and being shut out of numerous social areas locally due to our age differences. That to me is what being In Love is. All else is Hollywood Flim Flam and oft mostly Lust.

Ergo our relationship is built solidly upon three legs:
  1. Friendship!
  2. Respect!
  3. Trust!
Our lives follow the four sides of the Lodge Pyramid
  1. To Know!
  2. To Will!
  3. To Do!
  4. To Keep Silent!





_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to CreativeDominant)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 5:51:58 PM   
SteelofUtah


Posts: 5307
Joined: 10/2/2007
From: St George Utah
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

quote:

ORIGINAL: SteelofUtah
So what do you think a Relationship is Built on?


Rock and Roll.

the.dark.


No that is what we built this city on.

Thank you 80's Music. I would like to thank you for this pun and the one that followed.

We Owe you so much, like Bangle Earings and Parachute Pants.

Steel

_____________________________

Just Steel
Resident Therapeutic Metallurgist
The Steel Warm-Up © ™
For the Uber Posters
Thanks for the Grammatical support : ) ~ Term

(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 5:59:15 PM   
zephyrkajira


Posts: 238
Joined: 8/15/2009
Status: offline 		Hi Steel,

I've been thinking about this post all day and....I don't know. Each of my relationships has been built on something different; some love, some D/s, some M/s and each was special in it's own way. I know it sounds wimpy to say this but I don't think every relationship is built on just one thing, there are many ways to build a solid relationship it depends on the two (three, four) people in that relationship.

Great thread though....

(in reply to SteelofUtah)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: ~A Relationship is built on .......~ - 9/28/2009 6:48:15 PM   
Andalusite


Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline 		For me, in the initial stages of a relationship, it's built on chemistry/attraction, emotional connection (tends to start out fairly light, and deepen over time), at least some shared interests, lots of time together, getting to know each other's friends, and giving trust and love time and room to develop. I need BDSM, so I bring that up by the 3rd or 4th date, if it isn't immediately obvious (ie. meeting here or on another kinky dating site).

(in reply to Elipsis)
Profile   Post #: 40
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