RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids

RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (Full Version)

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Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/15/2010 9:31:42 PM)
quote: I am not dyslexic. Not you! Me! quote: I have not called you a nit picking dick head which you seem to feel is your perogative. I consider it my perogative to say anything I choose to say. quote: I have pointed out that calling people names is a poor substitute for discussion. So is the passive-agressive crap you like to pull.

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/15/2010 9:36:18 PM)
quote: YAY for State's rights in education! No, no, no, no, no! You are not allowed to agree with me. Nobody agrees with me. [:)]

Aylee -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/15/2010 9:54:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Marc2b quote: YAY for State's rights in education! No, no, no, no, no! You are not allowed to agree with me. Nobody agrees with me. [:)] Arghhhhh!!!!! Now I have that Sylvia song in my head. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhrcmDFt02c

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/15/2010 9:56:28 PM)
quote: Arghhhhh!!!!! Now I have that Sylvia song in my head. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhrcmDFt02c Well, thanks to you, now it's stuck in my head. Quick, somebody put on some Pink Floyd! ETA: Well, this has been a fun round but it's late and I'm going to bed. Got to be nice and fresh for Lost tomorrow! I wish Peace and Prosperity for everyone.

thompsonx -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 8:11:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Marc2b quote: So you agree that I am right. You need to pay your rent whether you use the apt. or not. Sigh. It was a voluntary choice in the first place. So is your membership in "Club America" Nor was I compelled to choose that particular apartment. That is why it doesn't work as an anlolgy for compulsary education. When you rent an apartment you agree to the "rules" of the contract. Like paying rent whether you occupy the apartment or not. When you belong to "Club America" you are necessarily obligated to follow the rules and regulations of "Club America"...like driving on the right side of the road and compulsory education. The government does not care what kind of car you drive on the right side of the road so long as it is roadworthy(yes roadworthyness is certified by the state) just as the state does not care which school you choose to go to so long as its cirricula is accurate(yes again the state certifies the accuracy of the cirricula) .Just to bring you up to speed: The earth is round not flat. The sun not the earth is the center of the solar system. Dinasaurs died before humans developed. Darwinian evolutionary theory more closely approximates reality than creationism. Long division with roman numerals takes way too much paper.

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 10:29:44 AM)
quote: So is your membership in "Club America" Not really. I’ve not the means to move to another country (even if I wanted to). quote: When you rent an apartment you agree to the "rules" of the contract. Like paying rent whether you occupy the apartment or not. When you belong to "Club America" you are necessarily obligated to follow the rules and regulations of "Club America"...like driving on the right side of the road and compulsory education. The government does not care what kind of car you drive on the right side of the road so long as it is roadworthy(yes roadworthyness is certified by the state) just as the state does not care which school you choose to go to so long as its cirricula is accurate(yes again the state certifies the accuracy of the cirricula) I am not obligated to like it nor am I obligated to keep silent about it (despite what some people around here think). Once again you miss the heart of the question: should the state have the right to dictate truth? You’re fine with it so long as it’s your truth that is being forced down people’s throats but what happens when it is no longer your truth? Will you keep silent about it? On what basis will you object (since you’ve already accepted the premise that the state can dictate what is truth)? You see, I don’t care what is on the state curricula. I don’t care whether it is accurate or not. It’s not the point. You come from an authoritarian, “do as we say or else,” viewpoint. I consider that unethical. I do not seek to oppress people and make them miserable just to satisfy my own ego about what is “right.” It is your will to power over others that I object to. I find the desire to bend people to one's own will abhorrent. I understand it. I considerer it a part of human nature that I myself am not immune to (that is what BDSM fun time is for, as far as I'm concerned, indulging and satisfying one of our baser instincts without having to be a tyranical dickhead towards the rest of society). But if we want to rise above our animal nature then we must refuse to be tyranical dickheads toward others. We must refuse to think it is proper and okay to force others to be like us simply because we don't like their religion or politics or skin color or whatever lame excuse people come up with to justify their meddling in other people's lives. Human beings have been doing that since their were human beings. Time and time again we have been operating on the premise that if we just force those other people to be like us (or worse, exterminate them) then everything weill be just fine and dandy. It hasn't worked yet, what makes you think it will work now? quote: Just to bring you up to speed: The earth is round not flat. No shit, dickhead (remember what I said about insulting people). quote: The sun not the earth is the center of the solar system. No shit, dickhead. quote: Dinasaurs died before humans developed. No shit, dickhead. quote: Darwinian evolutionary theory more closely approximates reality than creationism. No shit, dickhead. quote: Long division with roman numerals takes way too much paper. I’ve never tried it so I wouldn’t know, but that sounds reasonable. Dickhead.

thompsonx -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 11:27:58 AM)
quote: I am not obligated to like it nor am I obligated to keep silent about it (despite what some people around here think). You voluntarily agree to something then demand the right to complane about the results of your own actions...If you feel that is a mature and rational choice then I feel it is my obligation to point out how purile it is. Once again you miss the heart of the question: should the state have the right to dictate truth? Well who exactly is this "state" that you feel so uncomfortable with making decissions about which text book to use and which cirricula is more accurate? They are people you elected to the school board for fucks sake. What truth that the state dictates are you particularly uncomfortable with? Is it that one plus one thing? Long division? That the Missouri is the longest river in the U.S ? that Lansing is the capital of Michigan? That a cube has six sides. You’re fine with it so long as it’s your truth that is being forced down people’s throats but what happens when it is no longer your truth? Are you saying that there is more than one truth about one given subject? Will you keep silent about it? On what basis will you object (since you’ve already accepted the premise that the state can dictate what is truth)? You see, I don’t care what is on the state curricula. I don’t care whether it is accurate or not. It’s not the point. If the truth is not the point what the fuck is your arguement. Are you saying that you would rather be taught things that are untrue? You come from an authoritarian, “do as we say or else,” viewpoint. No I come from the viewpoint of objective truth...you on the one hand may believe that there are only 50 keys on a full size piano...this is called subjective truth. The actual number of keys on a full size piano is verifiable by counting and this is called objective truth. I consider that unethical. I do not seek to oppress people and make them miserable just to satisfy my own ego about what is “right.” So you believe that it is unethical to be truthful. I must say your candor on this subject is ...instructive.

thornhappy -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 4:12:06 PM)
Jeez, you guys. Get a room!

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 4:46:47 PM)
quote: You voluntarily agree to something then demand the right to complane about the results of your own actions...If you feel that is a mature and rational choice then I feel it is my obligation to point out how purile it is. I don’t demand the right to complain. I have the right to complain. Its called freedom of speech. quote: Well who exactly is this "state" that you feel so uncomfortable with making decissions about which text book to use and which cirricula is more accurate? Let me try to make this clear: I do not have a problem with the state – be it one of the American States or an abstract meaning a national government – making decisions about what curricula to have in its public schools (no do I have a problem with there being public schools). I have a problem with attendance being compulsory. I have a problem with people not being allowed to seek alternatives. quote: They are people you elected to the school board for fucks sake. What truth that the state dictates are you particularly uncomfortable with? Is it that one plus one thing? Long division? That the Missouri is the longest river in the U.S ? that Lansing is the capital of Michigan? That a cube has six sides. If you understand what I am saying in my response directly above, then you understand why I have no need to answer this. Again. quote: Are you saying that there is more than one truth about one given subject? Sometimes. It depends upon the subject. Sure, in a subject like math you can have objective truth (two plus two always has and always will equal four). But what about a subject like the origins of the universe? Science has given us plenty of ideals, some sound theories, but we are far away (if ever) from knowing the objective truth about it. The truth will depend upon who you talk to. But none of that is really relevant to my posistion. quote: If the truth is not the point what the fuck is your arguement. Are you saying that you would rather be taught things that are untrue? No. Why would you think that? quote: No I come from the viewpoint of objective truth...you on the one hand may believe that there are only 50 keys on a full size piano...this is called subjective truth. The actual number of keys on a full size piano is verifiable by counting and this is called objective truth. Tell me something I don't know. quote: So you believe that it is unethical to be truthful. I must say your candor on this subject is ...instructive. No. I believe it is unethical to force people to accept your version of it whether it is objective or subjective.

thompsonx -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 6:43:03 PM)
I have a problem with attendance being compulsory. Do you have the same problem with driving on the right side of the roadway...it is also compulsory I have a problem with people not being allowed to seek alternatives. No one is being denied the the right to seek alternatives so long as the alternatives teach the the carricula that the locally elected school board agrees on. If you do not want the local school board deciding carricula then who the fuck do you want to do it? Do you want each parent to decide for each child? If that is so then why even have school boards or even public schools?

thompsonx -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 6:47:41 PM)
No. I believe it is unethical to force people to accept your version of it whether it is objective or subjective. So you think it is unethical to teach the truth? My version of the truth is 2+2=4. If you want it to be 5 and are comfortable with that then I want some of what you are smoking

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 7:55:55 PM)
quote: Do you have the same problem with driving on the right side of the roadway...it is also compulsory That makes no sense. I agree that some things in society should be compulsory therefore I must agree that anything can be compulsory? That just doesn’t wash. You do not refute an argument by taking its premise and applying it in a situation that makes it look extreme. This is a common tactic of yours. What you fail to realize is that it can be turned around: so you think driving on the right side of the road should be compulsory? Then I guess you have no problem with the government making saying the Pledge of Allegiance compulsory. quote: No one is being denied the the right to seek alternatives so long as the alternatives teach the the carricula that the locally elected school board agrees on. If you do not want the local school board deciding carricula then who the fuck do you want to do it? I’ve already answered this. quote: Do you want each parent to decide for each child? If that is so then why even have school boards or even public schools? So that the people who want to use them, can use them.

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 7:59:06 PM)
quote: So you think it is unethical to teach the truth? And I have already answered this as well. Why do you keep asking the same questions and expecting different answers? quote: My version of the truth is 2+2=4. If you want it to be 5 and are comfortable with that then I want some of what you are smoking And why do you keep pretending that I haven't said what I have already said?

thompsonx -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 8:01:15 PM)
You want people who want to use the public schools to use tham as is but the people who don't want to use public schools should be allowed to teach their kids what ever they want but should not have to pay taxes that subsidize the public schools and none of this should be manditory...Have I got your position right?

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 8:37:00 PM)
quote: You want people who want to use the public schools to use tham as is but the people who don't want to use public schools should be allowed to teach their kids what ever they want but should not have to pay taxes that subsidize the public schools and none of this should be manditory...Have I got your position right? Close, but no cigar.

thompsonx -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 8:41:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Marc2b quote: You want people who want to use the public schools to use tham as is but the people who don't want to use public schools should be allowed to teach their kids what ever they want but should not have to pay taxes that subsidize the public schools and none of this should be manditory...Have I got your position right? Close, but no cigar. Then what the fuck is your position?

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 8:49:27 PM)
quote: Then what the fuck is your position? I've already stated it more than once. It's there in my previous posts, just read it - without the bias that leads you to make erroneous presumptions and jumpt to false conclusions (like the right side of the road thing).

thompsonx -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 9:00:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Marc2b quote: Then what the fuck is your position? I've already stated it more than once. It's there in my previous posts, So you are unable to state your position.

Marc2b -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 9:09:33 PM)
quote: So you are unable to state your position. And you accuse me of not being able to read. [8\|]

cadenas -> RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool their kids (3/16/2010 11:51:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thompsonx I am not OK with the asylum because all they need to do is apply for a visa and move. Asylum is a specific concept and they do not fall within the clear guidlines I agree with you that this is a complete abuse of hte asylum system. However, most Americans don't realize that you can't just "apply for a visa". Except for a tourist visa, which specifically bans going to school or working. The type of visa this family would have needed is called an immigrant visa. Only a very small percentage of people qualify for it at all, and it takes between ten and 25 years to get. I know because I'm one of the lucky few who qualified (mine took "only" eight years but the process has gotten even slower since then). Quite likely, Asylum really was the only way for the family to get legal status in the USA.

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