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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 5:13:40 AM   
Marc2b


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quote:

Love, love, love this quote, Marc!


Thanks. Although you should probably thank Abba Eban (whoever that is) as well.

I get most of my quotes from the Domai web sight's thought of the day. Pretty naked chicks and profound quotes - can it get any better?

< Message edited by Marc2b -- 3/5/2010 5:53:25 AM >

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 5:52:08 AM   
Marc2b


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quote:

I believe far more strongly than you do in everyone's rights.


That is simply im – fucking – possible. I am quite possibly the ultimate live and let live guy. So long as people are not harming others or violating their rights them my attitude is that you, me, government, and society in general should butt the fuck out!


quote:

You unfortunately give primacy to one group over another.


Which group would that be? Parents over children? Well, parents (for reasons that should be utterly obvious) have been exercising authority over children ever since we became human (and actually before that).

Religious people over non-religious people? Absolutely not. Quite the opposite in fact. I’m arguing for the right of religious people not to have to endure other groups having primacy over them just because such people arrogantly presume that they know better.

And it cuts both ways. Just as I argue that the Duggars have the right to teach their children that evolution is nonsense I would also argue against the Duggars having the right to impose their notions of creation upon other people’s children.

quote:

As someone who grew up in an abusive and neglctful home I can say categorically that the only thing that saved me and my siblings was the fact that my parents would have had to go more trouble to homeschool us than it was to send us to public school. I believe society is improved by saving those kids whose parents are less lazy than mine were that others don't sickens me.


I too believe that society is improved when society intervenes in abusive and neglectful homes. But as for those homes that are not abusive and neglectful – leave them the fuck alone. Their lives our none of our business.


< Message edited by Marc2b -- 3/5/2010 5:54:12 AM >

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 11:48:10 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		You still refuse to acknowledge that your belief boils down to parents own their children. You're sanguine with parents isolating their children and curtailing their life options by not allowing them to get more than some minimum 3 r's education. I say that the parents right to be ignorant and detrimental ends at everyone else's, including their children's, noses.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 1:42:40 PM   
Marc2b


Posts: 6660
Joined: 8/7/2006
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quote:

You still refuse to acknowledge that your belief boils down to parents own their children. You're sanguine with parents isolating their children and curtailing their life options by not allowing them to get more than some minimum 3 r's education. I say that the parents right to be ignorant and detrimental ends at everyone else's, including their children's, noses.


Yes.  Parents do have rights in how their children are raised.  That's the way it's supposed to be.  Is it an absolute right?  No. 

Your problem is that you arrogantly presume upon yourself the right to determine what is ignorant and what is not and then to intrude upon the lives of strangers because you don't approve of their lifestyle.  It baffles me that you and others cannot see how dangerous that is.  Sure, it seems great so long as it's your idea of a proper education that is being espoused.  But what happens when ideas you are opposed to start being officially espoused?  What happens when the state decideds to teach your kids that homosexuals are deviants by choice and black people are inferior to whites.  Since you have already accepted the premise that the state has the right to educate your children despite a parent's objections to what is being taught, you have no basis upon which to object the new curriculum.  If you do not respect the rights of others, you have no basis upon which to assert your own.

Your acting like there is some national epidemic of parents locking their children in the basement to sheild them from the world but the truth of the matter is that most parents do right by their children but they are not the ones that get media attention.

This is America.  We are supposed to have a thing here called freedom.  That means if somebody wants to raise their children to believe in the Bibical story of creation rather than evolution then that is their right.  If you don't like it, tough fucking shit.  Freedom is a bitch, baby.  Deal with it. 

ETA:  Parents do not own their children - and neither does the state.  

< Message edited by Marc2b -- 3/5/2010 1:44:36 PM >

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 2:37:40 PM   
LafayetteLady


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From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b

And it cuts both ways. Just as I argue that the Duggars have the right to teach their children that evolution is nonsense I would also argue against the Duggars having the right to impose their notions of creation upon other people’s children.



I believe in God, Adam and Eve, the whole thing. I taught my son to believe in that as well. So confident am I of what I taught my son, that I am not concerned about what the school teaches him regarding evolution. He had questions and they were answered.

Now I support the Duggars right to home school their children, but the reality is that when parents are choosing to do so based on not wanting certain "objectionable" curriculum taught to their children, it is because they aren't quite so confident that they have instilled those values into their kids to begin with. Eventually those children will be in the real world and hear about such things. As a parent you are either confident in the values you taught your children will keep them on the path you desire for them or you aren't.

quote:


I too believe that society is improved when society intervenes in abusive and neglectful homes. But as for those homes that are not abusive and neglectful – leave them the fuck alone. Their lives our none of our business.



You missed her point. The public school system is the first line of defense in protecting children from abuse. Children in abusive situations that are home schooled typically don't have the outside contact that would allow anyone to notice a problem.

The only way that home schooling works is when it is regulated. That doesn't mean forcing parents to teach evolution or sex education. It means putting standards on what the children are taught. Have you ever noticed how many times the parents who seem to want to home school their children lack education themselves? Without some kind of regulation, children WILL suffer. What's a parent going to do when their children's math studies surpass the parent's knowledge? If a child goes to public school, there are teachers and aids available to help a child learn what they don't understand. If you are home schooling your kid and you don't understand fractions, you are pretty useless. There used to be a show on called "Wife Swap." Many of the families on those shows home schooled their children. Eight or nine times out of ten, the kids that were home schooled were behind the public school kids.

You asked how we determine who is too ignorant or stupid to home school their kids? Seems pretty clear that if they are grades behind their age group, it is pretty easy to figure it out.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 4:24:03 PM   
DomKen


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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b
Your acting like there is some national epidemic of parents locking their children in the basement to sheild them from the world but the truth of the matter is that most parents do right by their children but they are not the ones that get media attention.

Actually there is an epidemic of parents homeschooling their children in order to indoctrinate them into good little followers of their parents belief system. There are even colleges that cater specifically to the "graduates" of religious home schooling. I oppose madrassa's in Pakistan that don't teach anything and I oppose homeschooling in the US that accomplishes teh same outcome.

You continue to insist that parents have the right to produce little copies of themselves while I say they don't have the righ to keep their children from achieving true independence. You claim you support freedom but all I see is someone who thinks the accident of birth gives someone the power of life and death of another person for 18 years. I reject that.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 5:06:25 PM   
Marc2b


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quote:

Actually there is an epidemic of parents homeschooling their children in order to indoctrinate them into good little followers of their parents belief system. There are even colleges that cater specifically to the "graduates" of religious home schooling. I oppose madrassa's in Pakistan that don't teach anything and I oppose homeschooling in the US that accomplishes teh same outcome.


If by "madrassas" you mean terroist schools then the anology doens't work. There is a huge difference between teaching junior that God created the earth in six days and teaching junior to kill infidels.

quote:

You continue to insist that parents have the right to produce little copies of themselves while I say they don't have the righ to keep their children from achieving true independence.


True independence as you define it.

quote:

You claim you support freedom but all I see is someone who thinks the accident of birth gives someone the power of life and death of another person for 18 years. I reject that.


Life and death? Where the fuck did that come from? Never mind. We're starting to go around in circles here. I've already stated my posistion more than once. You attempts to mischaracterize my posistion (parents owning their children, life and death) will not change it.


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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 5:30:33 PM   
sophia37


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Status: offline 		This is disgusting. You guys dont know squat about homeschooling. I was a home schooling parent. And the things I see written here about me, that parent, who you do not know, are completely wrong. There are as many reasons to home school as there are family's who seek out that idea.

What makes you think home school parents are bible thumping illiterates? Its like theres a round of applause over public schooling with how you come across. Lots of kids suffer in public schooling. Lots of times there isnt another school to put the child in. There are in fact affiliate schools that support parents with their children's education. Just like in that article. So good for them. it must be lonely homeschooling in Germany. Suckith.

My children went to school thru Clonlara. You pay money and receive a yearly curriculum and personalized support including state testing requirements. The kid passes the test like any other student.  Its not bible based. Its home schooling. I applaud parents who stand up to people like you. Obviously the Germany family is experiencing just your bias. If that's the case I don't fault them for leaving.  If only you could hear yourself.

Home educated children can get an education on a par with US education and in many ways a better education, depending on your district. Get real people. If you haven't gone thru home education in some way close to you, then opt out of a discussion you know nothing about. Why must everyone have opinions on any every damn little thing, regardless of ability to join in the conversation in an intelligent and knowledgeable manner. Yadda yadda yadda, Now THIS, is truly the result of public education.



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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 5:30:49 PM   
DomKen


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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b

quote:

Actually there is an epidemic of parents homeschooling their children in order to indoctrinate them into good little followers of their parents belief system. There are even colleges that cater specifically to the "graduates" of religious home schooling. I oppose madrassa's in Pakistan that don't teach anything and I oppose homeschooling in the US that accomplishes teh same outcome.


If by "madrassas" you mean terroist schools then the anology doens't work. There is a huge difference between teaching junior that God created the earth in six days and teaching junior to kill infidels.

Actually madrassa are best known for often teaching nothing what ever except requiring rote memorization of the Qu'ran.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 5:42:09 PM   
DomKen


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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sophia37

This is disgusting. You guys dont know squat about homeschooling. I was a home schooling parent. And the things I see written here about me, that parent, who you do not know, are completely wrong. There are as many reasons to home school as there are family's who seek out that idea.

What makes you think home school parents are bible thumping illiterates? Its like theres a round of applause over public schooling with how you come across. Lots of kids suffer in public schooling. Lots of times there isnt another school to put the child in. There are in fact affiliate schools that support parents with their children's education. Just like in that article. So good for them. it must be lonely homeschooling in Germany. Suckith.

My children went to school thru Clonlara. You pay money and receive a yearly curriculum and personalized support including state testing requirements. The kid passes the test like any other student.  Its not bible based. Its home schooling. I applaud parents who stand up to people like you. Obviously the Germany family is experiencing just your bias. If that's the case I don't fault them for leaving.  If only you could hear yourself.

Home educated children can get an education on a par with US education and in many ways a better education, depending on your district. Get real people. If you haven't gone thru home education in some way close to you, then opt out of a discussion you know nothing about. Why must everyone have opinions on any every damn little thing, regardless of ability to join in the conversation in an intelligent and knowledgeable manner. Yadda yadda yadda, Now THIS, is truly the result of public education.

Been there done that. Took me years to convince my cousin to stop homeschooling and put her kids in public school.

Never heard of Clonlara but a quick look shows it to be not objectionable. However it also isn't a common program. By far the biggest home school curriculums are the BJU one and A BEKA. Both of which are simply awful.


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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 5:46:13 PM   
intenze


Posts: 2176
Joined: 1/26/2009
Status: offline 		In my state, you cannot legally homeschool without following a specified curriculum and submitting to frequent assement by the state to make sure schooling is actually being done. If a parent is caught not teaching the state curriculum, their child is considered truant. I think many people may disagree with this, but in fact it keeps a checks and balances system in place so that students are truly schooled. There is a lively homeschool group here that works closely with the school district and uses their facilities for many functions.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/5/2010 9:15:14 PM   
LafayetteLady


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From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sophia37

This is disgusting. You guys dont know squat about homeschooling. I was a home schooling parent. And the things I see written here about me, that parent, who you do not know, are completely wrong. There are as many reasons to home school as there are family's who seek out that idea.

What makes you think home school parents are bible thumping illiterates? Its like theres a round of applause over public schooling with how you come across. Lots of kids suffer in public schooling. Lots of times there isnt another school to put the child in. There are in fact affiliate schools that support parents with their children's education. Just like in that article. So good for them. it must be lonely homeschooling in Germany. Suckith.

My children went to school thru Clonlara. You pay money and receive a yearly curriculum and personalized support including state testing requirements. The kid passes the test like any other student.  Its not bible based. Its home schooling. I applaud parents who stand up to people like you. Obviously the Germany family is experiencing just your bias. If that's the case I don't fault them for leaving.  If only you could hear yourself.

Home educated children can get an education on a par with US education and in many ways a better education, depending on your district. Get real people. If you haven't gone thru home education in some way close to you, then opt out of a discussion you know nothing about. Why must everyone have opinions on any every damn little thing, regardless of ability to join in the conversation in an intelligent and knowledgeable manner. Yadda yadda yadda, Now THIS, is truly the result of public education.



Ok, obviously, you have come across a lot of people who did not like your decision to home school your kids and are still pretty angry about it.

I do not homeschool my son, although I did look into it at one time. He is a special needs child and to be honest, I don't have the patience necessary to teach him at home. I have known people who home schooled their kids and it went well. Sadly, I have also known people who home schooled their children and they really shouldn't have.

You are quite right that when it is done correctly, a home schooled child can get as good an education or better than in the public school system. That's primarily because of the home schooled child gets more one on one instruction. If children in the public school got one on one instruction, the results would be comparable.

No one has said the the German family should not be permitted to home school their children. I support their decision to do so. What I don't support is them being granted asylum in the USA when they could have simply moved to France or the UK and home schooled to their heart's content without the need for Visas or Green Cards or sponsors. There were options available to them to move within Europe and home school their kids.

quote:

ORIGINAL: intenze

In my state, you cannot legally homeschool without following a specified curriculum and submitting to frequent assement by the state to make sure schooling is actually being done. If a parent is caught not teaching the state curriculum, their child is considered truant. I think many people may disagree with this, but in fact it keeps a checks and balances system in place so that students are truly schooled. There is a lively homeschool group here that works closely with the school district and uses their facilities for many functions.


And the above is the main point that I was making. You obviously live in an area and a state where "safeguards" have been put in place to ensure that the home schooled kid is getting the education he/she needs to succeed in the future. You do realize that not every state has those same policies in place, though, right? The families I knew that home schooled their children were in Florida. They didn't have a "home school" group or any kinds of group functions that are a very needed part of a child's adolescence to learn socialization skills. So these kids were often pretty lonely and felt left out, which is not a good thing.

The bottom line when it comes to home schooling is that not every parent is qualified to teach their kids. If mom and dad barely made it out of high school, how can they really be doing what is best for their kids by home schooling? Is that fair to the child? I'm certainly not implying that was your situation at all, but you must know that those situations DO exist.

Imagine the states that don't have the checks and balances that your state does? Imagine the areas where there aren't "lively home school groups" where the kids get to interact with other kids and there are adults who might notice is something was "not quite right" with a kid. There are a lot of areas where a parent or guardian can claim to be home schooling their kids, but the education they are getting is worthless and the child is being neglected or abused. Without the checks and balances you have in your area, who is going to notice that something might be wrong with this kid's home life? As someone who cared enough about her child to home school them, you can't be oblivious to the fact that stuff like that happens. All I know about your reasoning for home schooling your kid was it wasn't based on religious beliefs. The sad reality is that nationwide, if all the home schooled children were tested, they wouldn't be scoring as high as your kid probably did. Don't get me wrong, I think the fact that you decided to home school your children is great. You obviously had the time and the patience and the skills needed to do it. But for every parent like you who home schools their child in this country, there are probably at least 4 other parents who are home schooling their children and those kids are not being adequately educated, because they live in a state that doesn't have the same checks and balances and safeguards in place and those parents don't have the knowledge necessary to teach their kids.

That German family should have every right to home school their kids, but it doesn't mean they should be permitted residency status in the USA to do it when there were options for them to home school without seeking assistance from the US courts granting them asylum.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/6/2010 4:31:00 AM   
calamitysandra


Posts: 1682
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sophia37

This is disgusting. You guys dont know squat about homeschooling. I was a home schooling parent. And the things I see written here about me, that parent, who you do not know, are completely wrong. There are as many reasons to home school as there are family's who seek out that idea.

What makes you think home school parents are bible thumping illiterates? Its like theres a round of applause over public schooling with how you come across. Lots of kids suffer in public schooling. Lots of times there isnt another school to put the child in. There are in fact affiliate schools that support parents with their children's education. Just like in that article. So good for them. it must be lonely homeschooling in Germany. Suckith.

My children went to school thru Clonlara. You pay money and receive a yearly curriculum and personalized support including state testing requirements. The kid passes the test like any other student.  Its not bible based. Its home schooling. I applaud parents who stand up to people like you. Obviously the Germany family is experiencing just your bias. If that's the case I don't fault them for leaving.  If only you could hear yourself.

Home educated children can get an education on a par with US education and in many ways a better education, depending on your district. Get real people. If you haven't gone thru home education in some way close to you, then opt out of a discussion you know nothing about. Why must everyone have opinions on any every damn little thing, regardless of ability to join in the conversation in an intelligent and knowledgeable manner. Yadda yadda yadda, Now THIS, is truly the result of public education.






Now, homeschooling is not lonely in Germany, it is prohibited, simply not an option. We have a mandatory school attendance.

There are a whole host of reasons, but I would like to point out one that has come up in this discussion.
Some of you talked about a minimum of reading, writing, and math. That is not enough around here. The core curriculum in Germany also encompasses certain levels of science (biology, physics, chemistry), art, history, geography, sports, music, second language, and social studies (I am pretty sure I missed something).
At least a ground level education in all those subjects is required, not optional. Later on the children (and their parents) get to decide which level of education the are striving for, and they will have to start to specialize, but in the beginning, groundwork in all subjects is mandatory.
And I think this is the right way. This is no longer a world in which only reading, writing, math is enough.

Now, how many parents would really be qualified to teach all this? Not to speak of the facilities needed, or at least helpful, for some of the subjects.
In addition, imagine the bureaucracy that would be necessary to ensure that the homeschooling is up to those standards.

All in all, I feel that homeschooling is not really an viable option in Germany. True, there might be families who would fare better if they could homeschool, and who would have the necessary infrastructure to do so. However, considering the German school system, I feel that this is such a small minority, that implementing the structures needed to regulate homeschooling, and paying the price for this out of the education budget, would stand in no satisfying relation to the amount of children who would really profit.



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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/6/2010 7:25:33 AM   
Marc2b


Posts: 6660
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Status: offline 		Hmm… It seems to me that your response was meant to be directed toward DomKen and not me, but I am going to respond anyway.

quote:

This is disgusting. You guys dont know squat about homeschooling. I was a home schooling parent. And the things I see written here about me, that parent, who you do not know, are completely wrong. There are as many reasons to home school as there are family's who seek out that idea.


Actually I know quite a bit about home schooling since we had to home school one of my nieces who was unable to attend public school due to emotional problems.  The legal hoops we had to jump through were nothing short of bizarre.  We were fought every step of the way.  The local school district actually hired an attorney to try and stop us.  These pompous petty-ass tyrant wannabes actually had the audacity to proclaim that they knew what was better for my niece than her own family (the reality is that they don’t like the loss of state funds they endure whenever a child is removed from their system). 

quote:

What makes you think home school parents are bible thumping illiterates? Its like theres a round of applause over public schooling with how you come across. Lots of kids suffer in public schooling. Lots of times there isnt another school to put the child in. There are in fact affiliate schools that support parents with their children's education. Just like in that article. So good for them. it must be lonely homeschooling in Germany. Suckith.
 

I don’t think home school parents are bible thumping illiterates (at least not most of them) and even if they are I don’t see that as any good reason to dictate to them what their beliefs should be.  Some people, however, presume upon themselves a moral and intellectual superiority and believe that this grants them the right to trample over other people’s rights and freedoms… for the good of the children, you understand.  Always for the good of the children.  I prefer Frank Herbert’s take on it:

“In my estimation, more misery has been created by reformers than by any other force in human history. Show me someone who says, "Something must be done!" and I will show you a head full of vicious intentions that have no other outlet.”

Also, you will never find me applauding a public school system that turns out graduates who can’t even find their own country, the United States, on a map.  And it’s not like it a little country either!

quote:

My children went to school thru Clonlara. You pay money and receive a yearly curriculum and personalized support including state testing requirements. The kid passes the test like any other student.  Its not bible based. Its home schooling. I applaud parents who stand up to people like you. Obviously the Germany family is experiencing just your bias. If that's the case I don't fault them for leaving.  If only you could hear yourself.


Actually, I think you applaud parents who stand up to people like DomKen, not me.  I fully support your right to home school your children whereas DomKen presumes that he knows better than you what is best for your kids and therefore you should not be allowed to make your own decisions regarding them.  He calls this freedom.  I call it for what it really is – tyranny.

quote:

Home educated children can get an education on a par with US education and in many ways a better education, depending on your district. Get real people. If you haven't gone thru home education in some way close to you, then opt out of a discussion you know nothing about. Why must everyone have opinions on any every damn little thing, regardless of ability to join in the conversation in an intelligent and knowledgeable manner. Yadda yadda yadda, Now THIS, is truly the result of public education.


Actually my experience has been that the majority of home schooled children have a far superior education that those “educated” in the public school system.  This, as far as I am concerned, is just one more good reason to give parents the power to decide where and how their children will be educated.  But once again, money and some people’s belief in their own moral and intellectual superiority get in the way.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/6/2010 5:27:33 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b

Actually I know quite a bit about home schooling since we had to home school one of my nieces who was unable to attend public school due to emotional problems.  The legal hoops we had to jump through were nothing short of bizarre.  We were fought every step of the way.  The local school district actually hired an attorney to try and stop us.  These pompous petty-ass tyrant wannabes actually had the audacity to proclaim that they knew what was better for my niece than her own family (the reality is that they don’t like the loss of state funds they endure whenever a child is removed from their system). 


The school doesn't get the funds you're talking about for every child, they get it for the special needs children.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b
I don’t think home school parents are bible thumping illiterates (at least not most of them) and even if they are I don’t see that as any good reason to dictate to them what their beliefs should be.  Some people, however, presume upon themselves a moral and intellectual superiority and believe that this grants them the right to trample over other people’s rights and freedoms… for the good of the children, you understand. 


Actually the majority of children who are home schooled are done so for religious reasons. Yes, more and more people are making that decision for non religious reasons, but it still has a majority of people doing so because of their religious beliefs.

No one has presumed a moral or intellectual superiority. What has been stated REPEATEDLY, is that there needs to be a system in place to ensure those homeschooled kids are getting an adequate education. Big difference. Realistically, the more children that are home schooled, the less crowded the classrooms will be, and the better the education for the ones that do attend public school.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b
Actually, I think you applaud parents who stand up to people like DomKen, not me.  I fully support your right to home school your children whereas DomKen presumes that he knows better than you what is best for your kids and therefore you should not be allowed to make your own decisions regarding them.  He calls this freedom.  I call it for what it really is – tyranny.


I think you need to re-read DomKen's posts. He isn't saying that children shouldn't be home schooled.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b
Actually my experience has been that the majority of home schooled children have a far superior education that those “educated” in the public school system.  This, as far as I am concerned, is just one more good reason to give parents the power to decide where and how their children will be educated.  But once again, money and some people’s belief in their own moral and intellectual superiority get in the way.


The "majority"? Really? And exactly how many home schooled children are you in contact with? Honestly, it is like comparing apples to oranges. It is no secret that one on one instruction is far superior to 30 on one instruction. The only statistics available on home schooled children are derived from the data available through the programs like Clonlara. That doesn't represent the whole of home schooled children, making the data pretty invalid.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/7/2010 9:20:51 AM   
Marc2b


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quote:

The school doesn't get the funds you're talking about for every child, they get it for the special needs children.


Which my niece was.

quote:

Actually the majority of children who are home schooled are done so for religious reasons. Yes, more and more people are making that decision for non religious reasons, but it still has a majority of people doing so because of their religious beliefs.


So? We have something here in the United States called freedom of religion.

quote:

No one has presumed a moral or intellectual superiority. What has been stated REPEATEDLY, is that there needs to be a system in place to ensure those homeschooled kids are getting an adequate education. Big difference. Realistically, the more children that are home schooled, the less crowded the classrooms will be, and the better the education for the ones that do attend public school.


I have not heard of any state that allows home schooling that doesn't have some sort of oversight, some sort of requiered testing, for home schooled children.


quote:

I think you need to re-read DomKen's posts. He isn't saying that children shouldn't be home schooled.


He sure as hell comes across that way. His posts drip with contempt for religious people actually having the audacity to want to teach their religion to their children.

quote:

The "majority"? Really? And exactly how many home schooled children are you in contact with? Honestly, it is like comparing apples to oranges. It is no secret that one on one instruction is far superior to 30 on one instruction. The only statistics available on home schooled children are derived from the data available through the programs like Clonlara. That doesn't represent the whole of home schooled children, making the data pretty invalid.


In my dealings with my niece's situation, freinds, and co-workers, I've come across quite a few, and everyone of them was way more intelligent and knowledgeable that the average public school kid I've come across.





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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/7/2010 9:35:50 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b
I have not heard of any state that allows home schooling that doesn't have some sort of oversight, some sort of requiered testing, for home schooled children.

Then you are incedibly poorly informed.

For instance Illinois has no required oversight nor required testing.
http://www.hslda.org/laws/analysis/Illinois.pdf

In Texas no oversight or testing
http://www.hslda.org/laws/analysis/Texas.pdf

The same is true in many states.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/7/2010 9:56:02 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

I have not heard of any state that allows home schooling that doesn't have some sort of oversight, some sort of requiered testing, for home schooled children.
this is true for the state i live in. In fact, from talking to parents who home school their children, it is actually pretty structured.

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/7/2010 10:03:31 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

Still, the notion that the State has the right to dictate what your kids learn is a dangerous one.


Why?

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RE: Seeking Asylum now in the US so they can homeschool... - 3/7/2010 10:03:44 AM   
Marc2b


Posts: 6660
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quote:

Then you are incedibly poorly informed.

For instance Illinois has no required oversight nor required testing.
http://www.hslda.org/laws/analysis/Illinois.pdf

In Texas no oversight or testing
http://www.hslda.org/laws/analysis/Texas.pdf

The same is true in many states.


Very weel, then. But that is a problem for the people of those states to solve and I fail to see how it in any way invalidates your obvious bigotry against religious people.

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