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RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 4:54:30 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
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If you are having to punish her...you are failing her.

Seriously, if she won't obey when you want her to but she will bend over and take her punishments...you aren't in control and she isn't being punished and worst of all, the relationship isn't getting better.

Personally, I would grab her by the hair, drag her over to the couch, bend her over it and force my cock into whichever hole it popped into first and fuck her senseless while choking her with my other hand. Then, while the cum is still dripping out of her, I would sit her ass down and make it clear that she will either obey or come to you to talk about why she can't so you can work things out.

Or you could just keep letting her top you from the bottom, not do what you want, and get "punished" for it. Or you could keep beating her for things she thinks are wrong and one day you are going to look around for your woman...and she will be gone.

My way works better.

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 21

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 5:52:45 PM

StrangerThan

Posts: 1515
Joined: 4/25/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tayr

I have a question that I would like to get both Dom and sub perspectives on.

As a Dominant, I sometimes have to dispense discipline. Well, this often tends to get me all worked up. Nothing like a good ol' spanking to get a Dom all horny, ya know? So, my question is on whether or not the discipline should be followed up with some gratifying sex? Is that something that would have negative effects on my submissive? Should it be avoided? Or should I just indulge my "I don't care how you feel about it" attitude and force the sex on her? The last thing I want is for my sub to start associating sex with anything negative. But I want my cake (or pie, whatever ), too. What are your opinions or experiences with this issue?

I'm going to go along with some folks below and say that discipline doesn't make me horny. If I'm put in that position, I'm more likely to be disappointed. Now there are some staples in my relationship that will engender real discipline. If she ever refers to me as Master, I'll blister her ass. If I ever hear the term come from her in relation to another human except as a manner of respectful greeting, I'll blister it again. Having left those little blisters on her ass a time or two, she knows it isn't an idle threat. There are a few others, but none of them make me want sex.

Honestly, I'm not much of a believer in the kind of discipline a lot of folks practice. I think if you're having to correct someone that much, either you're being vague in your expectations,wishy-washy with them, or the person on the other end is not listening or is dense, or there's a rebellious soul to deal with. Granted, rebellious things can be fun and if I'm going to have to do it, I want the latter rather than either of the formers. We have, on occasion, what we call fight nights. Kind of what the name implies, and when the fight is over the fucking commences whether she likes it or not.

In a general sense though, the answer to your question is dependent upon the people involved. If it floats your boat and hers to have that much discipline involved, then tell her what I tell mine, in the end, you will satisfy me because you are my pussy. End of discussion. It is her place and no one elses.

Sort of an out built in there though I guess cause discipline doesn't do the thing for me. It's more control, sessions that can contain a lot of pain, but are done with threading that needle of pleasure, pain and goofy floating spaces than being someone's monitor.

_____________________________

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(in reply to Tayr)

Post #: 22

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 6:43:25 PM

DarkSteven

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After a punishment is over... it's over. Close out the session by asking her if she understands what she did was wrong, and if she's sorry. Then after that, forgive her. Give her a big hug and tell her that she's forgiven and that you still love her.

That makes it very clear in her mind that anything that follows is not part of the punishment. Plus it puts her into a very close and loving mind frame... so she will be feeling especially loving and submissive.

_____________________________

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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

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(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 23

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 9:00:41 PM

dreamerdreaming

Posts: 2839
Status: offline

What Kana, Smutmonger, and LadyPact said. And I'll trot out my stock answer:

My slaveboy and I don't have a reward/punishment dynamic. We're about mutual pleasure, fulfillment and self-realization. If I want him to suffer physical pain, discomfort, humialiation or whatever, it is for both of us to enjoy. We savor the sweetness of it, together.

A reward/punishment dynamic is not necessary at all, to a fulfilling D/s dynamic. My slaveboy is willingly obedient to me. I'll beat his ass, or whatever- anytime I want too. Its not connected to his behavior, in any way. Its just so we can feel exquisitely happy, together.

What we do is FUNishment, because that's yummy for us.

In summation:

punishment= unnecessary

FUNishment= yummy

I also agree with the poster who said that you're sending her mixed signals. What if she's just being disobedient so that you'll get off on punishing her? Can you see how your pleasure in punishing her might promote her disobedience?

If you want to "set her up for failure" so that you can FUNish her, just let her know that this is what you're doing so that she doesn't feel like a failure. So that you both can enjoy it.

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(in reply to Tayr)

Post #: 24

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 9:07:12 PM

came4U

Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
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OP, there is no 'should or should nots', why ask here?

that is between you and him/her.

If you are the Dominant and she has no 'parenting issues' from some weird childhood abuse, then what negative can come about your situational ...

wait a min, she did agree to you being her Dominant right? you did lay out the rules and limits?

edit: see? some believe in this fun-discipline thing, do you? I don't. It is real or it is nonsense. You are asking people that have wayyy varied opinions on issues that you and your sub have to face - face to face. It is not uncommon to ask, but to ask whether it might be negative and harming ...don't know. Up to you to ask and find out before you do it.

then do what you have to (within those un-harmful emotional/physical limits) and ask questions BEFORE, DURING AND AFTER.

The only harm you do is to the both of you as a couple by asking questions from strangers on what you should and shouldn't do.

< Message edited by came4U -- 3/3/2010 9:12:06 PM >

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 25

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 9:17:10 PM

WyldHrt

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Joined: 6/5/2008
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quote:

quote:

Personally, I like punishments that hurt. girls need to be hurt. corner time only turns them into spoiled little pigs. hurt them til they cry like little girls. I wouldnt have no wimpy brat that won't let you hurt em. Dont hurt them like you do in sex (if you do) hurt them twice as much as you would ever do in sex. This has the side benifit of pushing thier limits. then you can hurt them more during sex and they can take it cause they take twice as much in a punishment.

For instance cunnt spanking. If the most you ever spanked her cunny during sex was 50 times. then give her att least 100 wacks. if she was real bad 200.

Then after wards cuddle but NO sex. My girl doesnt like anal and I almost never do anal. So if I get horny after punishment (almost never) then I will do her in the ass and she cries all the more.

We have a regular sex night twice a week. So I dont really need to have sex after punishing her.

But you have to understand that I dont like ookie victim sex (Im a Romantic Sadist). If you like that then fucking them when they feel really shitty about themselves would prolly get you off but she wont learn much from it (assuming that is the intention).

course that's My experience others may vary. Works for Me. No gaurantee for you. Some girls just wont learn. But that's for another thread.

I'll second that.

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(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 26

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 9:25:16 PM

came4U

Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline

quote:

quote:

Personally, I like punishments that hurt. girls need to be hurt. corner time only turns them into spoiled little pigs. hurt them til they cry like little girls. I wouldnt have no wimpy brat that won't let you hurt em. Dont hurt them like you do in sex (if you do) hurt them twice as much as you would ever do in sex. This has the side benifit of pushing thier limits. then you can hurt them more during sex and they can take it cause they take twice as much in a punishment.

For instance cunnt spanking. If the most you ever spanked her cunny during sex was 50 times. then give her att least 100 wacks. if she was real bad 200.

that is as aggrivating as a lineup at the bank

Then after wards cuddle oh noooo, a cuddle, now THAT is punishment lol ewww but NO sex. My girl doesnt like anal and I almost never do anal. So if I get horny after punishment (almost never) then I will do her in the ass and she cries all the more.

oh boy, aren't you a thrill a min, you don't get horny. oh and no anal? I want a refund for this ride.

We have a regular sex night twice a week. So I dont really need to have sex after punishing her.

haha , no comment.

But you have to understand that I dont like ookie victim sex (Im a Romantic Sadist). ohh boy, fun fun goodies LOL If you like that then fucking them when they feel really shitty about themselves would prolly get you off but she wont learn much from it (assuming that is the intention).

course that's My experience others may vary. Works for Me. No gaurantee for you. Some girls just wont learn. But that's for another thread.

ya, awe, some girls don't learn. because we already KNOW

< Message edited by came4U -- 3/3/2010 9:26:50 PM >

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 27

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 11:51:19 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

Was that post in response to me, or were you using "fast reply"?

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(in reply to Lorenzo19)

Post #: 28

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/3/2010 11:53:51 PM

Lorenzo19

Posts: 237
Joined: 2/8/2010
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UniqueRaven wrote clearly and accurately about the feelings on both sides.

I would add too that the girl might start equating punishment with sex and when you really want to have just sex for fun she will have feelings of punishment too. In other words she may not be able to differentiate sex and punishment. sex will become ookie all the time. And it will be really hard to change it back.

_____________________________

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Everything I needed to know about life I learned by killing smart people and eating thier brains.
Give Me your heart. Make it real. Or else forget about it.

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 29

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 2:31:49 AM

lally2

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Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

if youre getting off on punishment and then youre getting sex afterwards there is a danger that youre going to be looking for every reason to punish and fuck her. if she's into that then no harm no foul. but if she finds punishment a miserable business then you finding reasons to punish her cos you love it so much and then fuck her cos thats oh so much fun she is going to be in a regular spiral of feeling she's failed and then having her failure 'used' by you to get off on. if shes smart she'll eventually work out that youre finding fault just cos you can, just cos you want to spank her and fuck her.

if that happens youre going to be minus one submissive before long.

like i say, if she enjoys the punishment dynamic too then go for it - plenty of people enjoy that, we call it funishment here. but if her response to punishment is that she just feels bad and has failed you badly then youre phucking with her motiviation to get it right - in fact youll probably confuse her totally.

she may well end up thinking that you want her to misbehave and brat so you can punish and fuck her and so she'll oblige because she thinks thats one way to please you.

in my opinion (for what its worth) you need to either

* keep punishment as punishment and no sex -
* consider it funishment and go for it -
* forget physical punishment altogether and use something else that isnt a turn on

in the end it isnt all about you (i know a shocker) you have to weigh up in youre own mind if she will respond well to this or if she'll get mightily confused or end up thinking the way to please you is to play up and brat out so you can punish her to youre hearts content. trouble with the latter is that youll end up in a psychologically negative situation the whole time where she's playing up to feed youre 'funishment' kink and youre forever beating on her. she'll be thinking out of the submissive box by taking control of the situation by having to decide for herself when she should be bratting out in order to serve youre kink.

i speak from experience btw.

and i can tell you, ultimately it didnt work because i constantly felt i was failing in order to please - a truely negative situation, but then im not into being punished, youre sub might be. in which case what you have is a funishment dynamic and alls equal on that.

_____________________________

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(in reply to Lorenzo19)

Post #: 30

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 4:19:23 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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Spanking here is for fun.

If there's a problem, we discuss it. Usually it comes down to miscommunication, and him being unclear isn't something that punishing me will solve, neither will me assuming I understood what he meant. Communication does solve it.

For a while I was having an attitude problem mid afternoon most days. It came down to the fact that I hadn't eaten for a while. Punishing me will have no effect on my blood sugar. Him scheduling time in the schedule for me to eat lunch will. So should I be punished because he caused my blood sugar drop? Not in my book.

If she's that disobedient, you folks need to talk about it. What's going on that she doesn't care about what you tell her? Or are you giving her orders she can't follow in order to spank her? Because setting someone up to fail to give you an excuse to spank is contemptible.

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(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 31

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 4:27:58 AM

thishereboi

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That sounds hot. But I have a question. Do you walk around with a constant hard on or does her disobedience turn you on?

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(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 32

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 5:38:04 AM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

That sounds hot. But I have a question. Do you walk around with a constant hard on or does her disobedience turn you on?

Neither. Disobedience to things we have agreed on without discussion isn't just a turn off, it quickly becomes a piss off and they get shown the door. The point was that TALKING about why someone can't do something and getting to the real reasons is the solution, not spanking/punishing them. That is a dysfunctional circle of misery. Teaching someone to be open and honest about what is going on is the path to having an actual adult relationship and learning to deal with issues as adults is the path to happiness. And yes, that IS the one true way and I have thus spoken.

Lucky for me, the only path I worry about is mine. But with my way, when you fuck someone, or beat someone you are living in THAT moment, not thinking about what they did or didn't do, or wondering what this or that really means, or any of the rest of the torments people live with.

(in reply to thishereboi)

Post #: 33

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 6:32:18 AM

Whiplashsmile4

Posts: 2305
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Discipline does not have to mean physical punishment, though it can. It can be a mistake to interchange these two words with one another.

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(in reply to Tayr)

Post #: 34

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 6:40:02 AM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tayr

I have a question that I would like to get both Dom and sub perspectives on.

As a Dominant, I sometimes have to dispense discipline. Well, this often tends to get me all worked up. Nothing like a good ol' spanking to get a Dom all horny, ya know? So, my question is on whether or not the discipline should be followed up with some gratifying sex? Is that something that would have negative effects on my submissive? Should it be avoided? Or should I just indulge my "I don't care how you feel about it" attitude and force the sex on her? The last thing I want is for my sub to start associating sex with anything negative. But I want my cake (or pie, whatever ), too. What are your opinions or experiences with this issue?

He's a sadist and doesn't need or want a reason to hurt me. Sex and pain is all wrapped up together for us.
Punishments haven't been part of our dynamic because I follow his directions. I would think that sex would not follow a punishment, but I don't really know.

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(in reply to Tayr)

Post #: 35

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 7:08:00 AM

ownedbyPF

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Joined: 2/18/2010
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Fast Reply~

My Master is a sadist. He hurts me simply because he feels like it several times a week. When he disciplines me it isn't for fun, it's because I failed at something. It is entirely different, it's much more lean over the bed and take it.... I sob desperately and he continues until he feels I've had enough. It doesn't turn either one of us on, but it makes me admire him desperately for being strong enough to whip me that way. I'd like to say I don't need that in order to learn and be obedient, but the truth is anything short of that and I tend to take advantage. It doesn't happen often, I try very very hard to avoid it! I've heard lots of peole say that having sex after disicpline can confuse things. This hasn't been the case for us. First of all the way he whips me for disobedience is vastly different and there is no enjoyment factor there. Alot of times we do have sex afterward, but first there's a whole lot of cuddling and hugging me while I finish crying my eyes out and telling him how sorry I am and how much I swear I worship him, and him telling me I'm forgiven. The sex part is... seperate, it makes me feel good... it's what makes me feel like he really does forgive me and we have moved past it.

I think this is one of those things that really changes from person to person. What if my Master wasn't a sadist and I felt the need to provoke him in order to get whipped? And what if it wasn't a gut wrenching whipping, but a heart pounding caning? What if he wasn't comfortable hurting me for the sake of hurting me so he made excuses to "punish" me, leaving me confused and feeling like I couldn't ever do anything right? See, there is too much to it that depends on you and her and what you all do to get a definate answer on what you should do. You need to talk to her about whether it confuses her. Pay attention to how she acts and reacts. Is she seeking it out? Does she seem to want to be punished on purpose? Does she forget the lesson if you have sex, but remember it if you don't? And so on...
~s

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 36

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 8:00:26 AM

Andalusite

Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline

Tayr, in my last relationship, *I* got turned on during one of the only two times in the three years we were together that he felt the need to punish me. I felt very guilty and confused for reacting that way, and started crying (usually afterward, sometimes during things) from feeling upset/guilty about getting turned on during regular S/M activity for the next 3 weeks. Something would remind me of it, and I'd just be in buckets. I told my Master about this while we were discussing D/s, M/s, and so on, shortly after we started dating. He has decided that if I need to be punished, there are plenty of non-physically-oriented methods that would work better. So far, he hasn't felt the need to do so - I try hard to please him.

DS, I think if there was some time in between the punishment and the sex, I'd be fine, but I can't spin on a dime emotionally like that. Even if it's over for him, and he's no longer upset with me, I probably would associate them. A situation like ownedbyPF describes wouldn't be nearly as confusing.

Lorenzo, twice as much of the same level of pain as usual would take *hours*. The longest scenes I've done went from breakfast until we fell asleep that night, with a break for a couple of hours in the middle for lunch and a nap, and another short break for dinner (granted, that was with a switch, but I still spent a good 7 hours or so being tied up and/or thwacked in various ways). 3-4 hour scenes have been pretty common. I *LIKE* it when I'm crying, snot is running from my nose, and I have welts and bruises for a couple of weeks afterward. I love it when I'm so lost in the moment that I can't say red, or no, or my own name.

< Message edited by Andalusite -- 3/4/2010 8:02:32 AM >

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 37

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 11:19:36 AM

Lorenzo19

Posts: 237
Joined: 2/8/2010
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response to Andalusite:

Well... Every girl is different. I agree, the total pain slut is a special case. I have not so far had to punish a pain slut. If I did I would not spend hours punishing her for a little thing. But it would involve some kind of pain. I would just have to be very creative about it.

Punishment is the most difficult and important thing for a Master to learn. It cant be learned from one thread or even a whole book. But, hopefully a piece of the puzzle may be gleaned. I see each post here having a piece. Some times just a dirty look is enough to hurt a girl, or a threat, or an insult. As a Master grows and learns the art and science of punishment, both Master and slave will be drawn closer and thier bond more unbreakable.

As the OP did not state the girl was a pain slut. I felt no need to elaborate on it. But, that would make an interseting topic. After reading these fine posts hopefully, OP sees how sex immediately after punishment can affect the subbies spirit.

< Message edited by Lorenzo19 -- 3/4/2010 11:21:27 AM >

_____________________________

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Everything I needed to know about life I learned by killing smart people and eating thier brains.
Give Me your heart. Make it real. Or else forget about it.

(in reply to Andalusite)

Post #: 38

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 1:09:53 PM

camille65

Posts: 5746
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Austin Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lorenzo19

Punishment is the most difficult and important thing for a Master to learn. It cant be learned from one thread or even a whole book. But, hopefully a piece of the puzzle may be gleaned. I see each post here having a piece. Some times just a dirty look is enough to hurt a girl, or a threat, or an insult. As a Master grows and learns the art and science of punishment, both Master and slave will be drawn closer and thier bond more unbreakable.

Really? THE most difficult thing to learn? That seems like such a strange statement to me, in all of the people that I know and have met I'd have to say that learning how to punish is not at the top of the list. You have.. a very different view on things than most I've come across.

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(in reply to Lorenzo19)

Post #: 39

RE: A query on sex and discipline... - 3/4/2010 1:21:55 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lorenzo19

Punishment is the most difficult and important thing for a Master to learn. It cant be learned from one thread or even a whole book. But, hopefully a piece of the puzzle may be gleaned. I see each post here having a piece. Some times just a dirty look is enough to hurt a girl, or a threat, or an insult. As a Master grows and learns the art and science of punishment, both Master and slave will be drawn closer and thier bond more unbreakable.

Why people think this sort of stuff works is beyond me. It doesn't work when training animals, it doesn't work when raising children, why the hell would it work on adults?

Yes, grabbing someone who is being bitchy and spanking the hell out of them or giving them the look ON OCCASION makes things hot, reminds them of their place but really only works when it is a bit tongue in cheek, try that in the middle of a seriously emotional discussion with tempers running hot and you will see any woman worth her salt head for the door.

Mastery, as I use the term, isn't about beating a woman into submission, any clod can do that and many do. It is about sitting them down and dealing with issues, facing them, and working through them to the other side. If someone is acting out, there is a reason and you can't beat that reason away, you need to reach inside them and pull it out of them, sometimes with soft words, sometimes with a bit of stern talk, and other times with patience. Do THAT and you can truly enslave a woman's heart.

< Message edited by SimplyMichael -- 3/4/2010 1:23:16 PM >

(in reply to Lorenzo19)

Post #: 40

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