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RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/15/2010 1:55:09 PM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA
.
a)  Under the guise of this dynamic (and in a LEGAL sense), if one is "unwilling", then consent has NOT been given.

to varying degrees - once a submissive has entered an understanding between herself and her Dominant that S&m will be a large part of their dynamic 'unwilling' does not mean consent has been withdrawn.  i have 'consented' by dint of being there and felt massively unwilling.  in the spirit of healthy Ds and/or Ms the legal side of things is moot. 

b)  When consent HAS been given, then the only CONSENSUAL/LEGAL pairing is one of a Sadist and massochist (because only a masso would give their consent); leaving the Sadist forever unfulfilled, and left to only "playing" the Sadist.

i would argue that even the submissives and slaves who do not actually get off on the pain, argue till their blue in the face that they are unwilling to go through pain, are there, for some reason or another because the pain, struggle to endure, struggle to please, struggle to survive it, satisfies a level of massochism in them.  they may not be the type of massochist that processes pain as pleasure, but they are still massochists.  why else would they seek a place with a sadist.  no one is forcing them into an S&m based relationship.  on some level or another their 'misery' is satisfying them.
 
recently theres been a thread about someone being spanked for punishment, im sorry, i cant take those threads seriously at all - call me cynical.  the whole 'it was so awful' thing is a thin disguise to what is really going on there.  a need to be chastised and taken through pain hits a core level in a sub or slave that identifies with CP as a legitimate form of correction within their dynamic.  it feeds a need or they wouldnt be there. 
 
im not the type of masso that gets off on huge levels of pain, but i have endured huge levels of pain for a Master - why? because it settles something in me, it satisfies the need to struggle, it forces me to submit when at times i struggle to.  it takes away choice and insists that i stay still.  all of that gives me catharsis.
 
i consented by being there and accepting what would happen before it happened but at no time did my sadistic Master doubt that i was struggling like hell to stay put and he totally got off on that and giving him that outlet was all part of why i stayed still and took it.


.

< Message edited by lally2 -- 3/15/2010 2:05:41 PM >

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to MasterSlaveLA)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/15/2010 1:59:00 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline
quote:

im not the type of masso that gets off on huge levels of pain, but i have endured huge levels of pain for a Master - why? because it settles something in me, it satisfies the need to struggle, it forces me to submit when at times i struggle to. it takes away choice and insists that i stay still. all of that gives me catharsis.

i consented by being there and accepting what would happen before it happened but at no time did my sadistic Master doubt that i was struggling like hell to stay put and he totally got off on that.


I get that., makes sense to me.

_____________________________

It hurts.....that you call me a masochist


(in reply to lally2)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/15/2010 7:15:23 PM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissBeautiful2U
I've never heard that to be a sadist you should want to inflict the pain on an unknowing or unwilling partner.  That thought offends my sense of responsibility.


I think that definition is more appropriate of a societal sadist that one within our own ranks. Part of the struggle of sadism and sadists in this thing that we do is finding a balance between our consent based system and that stricter societal model that does not include consent which strikes a happy medium for each of the participants.

quote:


I consider myself a sadist because I enjoy inflicting pain, but I want the person I am playing with to enjoy it on some level.


While I want them be able to derive some sense of fulfillment or satisfaction from the activity (perhaps after the fact) I don't particularly care whether they enjoy the specific activity and indeed will seek out those activities that they do not enjoy. We are all different sadists on different journeys with different ultimate destinations. A s long as we can arrive at that happy medium (which will likely be different for each couple/group) it's all good.




_____________________________

"Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable." Sidney J. harris

(in reply to MissBeautiful2U)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 1:00:36 AM   
AlexandraLynch


Posts: 778
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline 		For me, at least, the answer is that I don't really give a fuck about what you define yourself as, as long as you react to what I do. The thing that will cause me to turn on the ceiling lights and pack up the floggers is someone who just soaks it and takes it. Screw that. I want reactions. 

_____________________________

I use fastreply. Don't take offence where none is meant.

Just because I'm not a bitch doesn't mean I'm not perfectly capable of making sure you'll be very sorry if you disobey.

(in reply to DomImus)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:11:48 AM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968


quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedbyPF


As I said, not a maso, no sub space. I feel every bit of aganozing torment. Yet, I need it. I desperately need him to take me, use me, and beat me without any regard for my "enjoyment", or for me. THAT makes me wet and hot! However, honestly, when it's happening, I don't even realize I'm wet. I don't realize it until he stops for a few minutes and fingers me or some such thing and suddenly I'm like... omg... I'm crazy wet!


This entire thing you've written is me exactly. You've worded it better than I ever could. Thank you.


But, isn't this masochism?

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:21:30 AM   
Aileen1968


Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Level


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968


quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedbyPF


As I said, not a maso, no sub space. I feel every bit of aganozing torment. Yet, I need it. I desperately need him to take me, use me, and beat me without any regard for my "enjoyment", or for me. THAT makes me wet and hot! However, honestly, when it's happening, I don't even realize I'm wet. I don't realize it until he stops for a few minutes and fingers me or some such thing and suddenly I'm like... omg... I'm crazy wet!


This entire thing you've written is me exactly. You've worded it better than I ever could. Thank you.


But, isn't this masochism?


Good morning Level...
I always thought that to be considered a masochist, one had to orgasm from the pain. That's my definition for it. I don't orgasm from it. I just curse him up and down.

_____________________________



(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:25:17 AM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		I agree with Level, that sounds a lot like masochism to me. And no, you don't have to orgasm from pain to be a masochist. You don't even have to like it, but you just have to crave it.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:27:16 AM   
Aileen1968


Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I agree with Level, that sounds a lot like masochism to me. And no, you don't have to orgasm from pain to be a masochist. You don't even have to like it, but you just have to crave it.

- LA


Ah fuck me. Don't tell ShoreBound cause now he's gonna bump it up another notch.

_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:31:01 AM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I agree with Level, that sounds a lot like masochism to me. And no, you don't have to orgasm from pain to be a masochist. You don't even have to like it, but you just have to crave it.

- LA


Ah fuck me. Don't tell ShoreBound cause now he's gonna bump it up another notch.


Aileen... I'm a sadist. What is ShoreBound's email? ;-)

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:32:31 AM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		Good morning, Aileen/beach bunny

Yup, I agree with LA agreeing lol. But don't worry, I'm sure Shore won't see this.



_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:34:29 AM   
Aileen1968


Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline 		He's laying right next to me at this very moment....

_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:41:42 AM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		Smack'er! Wallop'er! She likes it!

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 4:48:14 AM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

He's laying right next to me at this very moment....


Do you have Skype and good speakers? ;-)

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 6:10:32 AM   
keylargowayne


Posts: 1
Joined: 3/16/2010
Status: offline 		to me  a masochist enjoys the pain humiliation and degredation for it's own sake while a submissive slave submits to a superiors discipline and torture for the sexual relief it provides.

i have been turned on sexually by pain since being spanked by my very strict father during puberty and the degree of submission has grown to accepting heavy pain to please a dominant man/sadist as well as my own needs

(in reply to LadyAngelika)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 6:53:17 AM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline 		A very narrow vision of what constitutes a 'sadist' in the OP.

I've been refereed to as a 'sadistic bastard' many times, and with good reason yet the level of pain I dish out is of no interest to Me, what pushes My sadistic buttons is reactions. I Own a maso, that doesn't mean she enjoys all pain, what it means is that she needs a certain amount of pain regularly in her life. Depending on mindset in that moment, she maybe enjoying it or she maybe hating every second of it, doesn't change the fact that she needs it. Also We have that holy grail.... compatibility. she reacts strongly when she is enjoying it, she reacts even more strongly when she isn't.... I can and do enjoy both her positive and her negative reactions to it. Plus if I am in the mood for positive reactions and she isn't in the mindset to handle 'brutal' I know her well enough to play in different ways, with sensual but slowly built pain which will always get Me the reactions I want.... Likewise when I am in the mood to chase a negative reaction, no matter how maso she is feeling there are kinds of pain she doesn't like "Its the wrong pain Grommit!"... I always get what I want, she gets what she needs, it works.


_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

(in reply to LadyAngelika)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 9:46:55 AM   
ownedbyPF


Posts: 126
Joined: 2/18/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I agree with Level, that sounds a lot like masochism to me. And no, you don't have to orgasm from pain to be a masochist. You don't even have to like it, but you just have to crave it.

- LA


I quoted LA, but am replying to both you and Level :)
Uh hmmmmmm..... gulp.... aileen this isn't exactly going well all of the sudden for us.... :)
I guess it's because you always hear people saying how they love the pain and how they subspace and how this is lovely and did I mention the part where they say they love the pain?   And they talk about everything it does for them. I haven't ever felt like that, any of that. I hate the pain, I'd like to say I didn't need it, but I do. Like I said, I crave it, need it. and hate it. I don't even know I'm wet because I'm so wrapped up in how aganozing it.

For me, it's all about being so utterly used and stripped down and having nothing about me matter. It's sufferring for him. I guess it's a mental thing without enjoying the physical thing? Probaby now I'm babbling! Is that masochism? I mean is needing it even though I don't enjoy it in the way alot of people seem to... masochism? Is need the qualifier in this? I guess it is. I just never identified as one because I don't have all the happy good stuff to say about it that others seem to say. Yep baaaaabbbbbllllliiiinnnnggggg
~s

(in reply to LadyAngelika)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 10:33:04 AM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedbyPF

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I agree with Level, that sounds a lot like masochism to me. And no, you don't have to orgasm from pain to be a masochist. You don't even have to like it, but you just have to crave it.

- LA


I quoted LA, but am replying to both you and Level :)
Uh hmmmmmm..... gulp.... aileen this isn't exactly going well all of the sudden for us.... :)
I guess it's because you always hear people saying how they love the pain and how they subspace and how this is lovely and did I mention the part where they say they love the pain?   And they talk about everything it does for them. I haven't ever felt like that, any of that. I hate the pain, I'd like to say I didn't need it, but I do. Like I said, I crave it, need it. and hate it. I don't even know I'm wet because I'm so wrapped up in how aganozing it.

For me, it's all about being so utterly used and stripped down and having nothing about me matter. It's sufferring for him. I guess it's a mental thing without enjoying the physical thing? Probaby now I'm babbling! Is that masochism? I mean is needing it even though I don't enjoy it in the way alot of people seem to... masochism? Is need the qualifier in this? I guess it is. I just never identified as one because I don't have all the happy good stuff to say about it that others seem to say. Yep baaaaabbbbbllllliiiinnnnggggg
~s


there are quite a few of us around actually - i know it blew my brains out too - i even started a thread on this very topic a while back, just to get my head around it-

in the end, the general concensus was that on some level or another i achieved a catharsis.  maybe the same for you too.

i have never reached subspace, i dont even get horny - im not even sure if i crave it.  but i do need it when im in a relationship -

the 'trouble' with us is that to some degree or another we need to be with a sadist or at least someone who enjoys enflicting pain and watching us struggle with it otherwise theres no point.  why go through something hellish for youre M when it leaves them cold or vaguely squicked out - but to endure high levels of pain from a sadistic partner can (and has for me) taken me way way beyond what im capable of to the point where ive had to back out of a relationship because i just couldnt deliver to that level on certain activities.

even for someone like me there is 'good' pain (i can handle it) and bad pain (i really really really really cant handle it beyond a certain point) - if youre with a sadist that 'certain point' is where theyre heading and that got too much of a mindfuck eventually.

i realised a while back that i dont need to be with an all out sadist, but i do need to be with someone who enjoys inflicting enough pain on certain parts of my body (that i can handle) for me to reach that struggle thing and even go beyond that struggle thing.

im just saying really - to any subs who identify with this at all.  be careful what you wish for you might just get it

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to ownedbyPF)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 6:50:00 PM   
Smutmonger


Posts: 995
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline 		This is why I don't feel a lot of guilt in infliciting this sort of thing on someone who really has a submissive need. I know that it leads to a from of resolution and closure when all is said and done.

_____________________________

I didn't get into an alternative lifestyle to explore new frontiers in conformity.

(in reply to lally2)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 7:08:03 PM   
Andalusite


Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline 		I dunno - sometimes I *do* just lay there and glow at him, sometimes I'm so deeply in subspace that I'm incapable of saying "red," or my own name, or walking, sometimes I feel primal and wild, sometimes I feel like I'm so tough, I can take this, sometimes I break down sobbing until snot is running from my nose, sometimes I scream, sometimes knifeplay and vampire gloves tickle and send me into hysterical laughter until I can barely breathe, sometimes I freeze and go inside of myself and kind of go numb, one time I fainted. I don't just have *one* reaction or response, and people seem to be talking as though a given submissive or bottom or slave will always respond the same way. My Master can almost always get the response *he* wants from me, but sometimes both of us get surprised.

(in reply to Smutmonger)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Calling All SADISTS ! ! ! - 3/16/2010 8:35:32 PM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline 		I'm a sadist and I find the idea of (true) non consentual sex repugnant. Hell, I'm a sadist, not a rapist. I'l take a girl, do what I want, use her as I desire, but she has to surrender.
For me, that's the heart of the whole eroticism-her ceding of the will-she must willing yield to what is to be done..

Funny thing sadism. There's a trillion ways to be sadistic, but it requires some imagination to think outside the box and I would argue,a twisted form of artistry, in its highest forms.
Sadism can be words, acts, planting fears, suggestions. It can also be whips, chains, screams, pain. It can be pain mental, emotional, spiritual or physical. I have yet to find a girl who is masochistic in all categories. Everybody has weak spots, vulnerabilities, places they don't like being hit.
So yeah, I do like masochists, they tend to wind up my gears, let my imagination and wicked tastes roam unfettered and free. and yeah, I have yet to find one I can't make suffer in some ways.

Now outside of BDSM, if someone does anything to me that bothers me to the point where I am following through with sadistic actions-you can bet your ass I'm going to enjoy their suffering.


_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to Andalusite)
Profile   Post #: 60
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