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LadyPact -> RE: his secret.. (3/24/2010 12:22:02 PM)
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I'm not bright eyed and bushy tailed, but I'm enjoying the discussion anyway. LOL.
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ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious
I return-all bright eyed and bushy tailed and logical thought juiced up :D
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ORIGINAL: LadyPact
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ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious
So if a friend of yours was unhappy in their sex life or their relationship and wanted to discuss that with you, you'd shut them down on the grounds that wanting someone to talk to meant they didn't give a damn? That seems painfully harsh to me-maybe we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.
Actually, it's the opposite. I happen to feel that the relationship that those two people have should be a priority over the friendship that I may have established. Anytime that I have a male friend that starts a new relationship, My first reaction is usually how happy I am that they found someone. My second reaction is, can this new person also be a friend, since I'm obviously on good terms with the male. If the personalities mesh, I'd like to be her friend, too. It would be great to include her. Not keep her on the outside. That's an absolutely lovely attitude to have. That's not the situation here, though-it's not that the sub in this context started the relationship *after* he started talking to the OP; or at least we haven't been told that. So it's not a case of an established friend starting a new relationship, it's a case of a new friend in an established relationship.
And what if your friend in the above situation needed someone to talk to, after you've met/become friends with their partner? Would you deny them that? I actually think you're right about that. In the case of an established relationship, I'm more the type to get to try to know them both. Not try to just be friends with the male half. Even in cases where I've gotten along better with the male half of a couple, I'll still try to include the female half.
On top of that, if the male still felt the need to have intimate discussions with Me, I would absolutely encourage him to talk to the person who is really the only person who can work with him in the relationship. That is the significant other.
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Considering that we're talking about a situation where the male in the OP's original seems to have other things that he's hiding from his Domme, it doesn't really sound like a case that he's been honest on a few things. He hasn't told his Domme that he cheated on her. Why would I think that he's told his Domme that he's been talking with someone else, sharing intimate details of their lives? The Domme probably doesn't know that her sub is talking to the OP at all. Due to not having this information, how was she supposed to say if it was ok or not ok. It might be that the Domme has said 'I'm not bothered about who you talk to, under conditions x,y,z.' That's what I would do. It's like going to a party-I don't need to know exactly where my other half is and who they are talking to, because I trust them to know where the line is, and to not cross it. If that trust is misplaced, as it is in this situation, then that's my responsibility and that of my other half-*not* whoever it is they are talking to. That's actually My process, too. However, I don't think conditions x,y,z were in place at all. What we have here is an OP who openly says that she isn't good with boundaries and obviously the person she was dealing with used that to his complete advantage. LaT is often known to have a saying that is very good for this situation. "Water rises to it's own level." It seems to Me that's exactly what we have here.
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Has the OP explicitly stated that the owner doesn't know? Because if she has I've missed it.
This is from post #5
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no I dont know her personally.
Now, that could mean that the OP doesn't know her in the world away from the screen, or that she doesn't even have even as much as as an electronic introduction to her. I'm actually going with the latter. Somewhere along this six month line, the male in this scenario started discussing things with the OP that were probably inappropriate. (I really don't believe that all of the conversation was casual for six months and then, WHAM, it all just poured out that there was all of this talk about the cheating and how unhappy the relationship was.) When the little things started coming up, which boil down to this person talking about his SO behind her back, the OP could have put a stop to it right there. So talking about problems and unhappiness is inappropriate? I think that's one of the major differences in our points of view here-to me that doesn't necessarily sound inappropriate-my friends talk about relationship issues all the time-I don't know that I would have 'put a stop to it', had I been in the OP's situation.I can only speak for Myself. For Me, yes, taking My problems about My sex life to someone of the opposite gender is inappropriate, if the person I'm involved with doesn't know I'm having the discussion. Where I come from, we call that 'airing your dirty laundry in public'. I'm also of the mind that, whoever you (generic you) are involved with, should be the person that you're able to talk to and bring your issues up. If it isn't, you're in the wrong relationship.
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If she really was his 'friend' she would have been encouraging him to talk to his Dominant about this, rather than the OP, in the first place. Isn't that what we want for our friends? For them to be as happy as possible and encourage them to do whatever it is that leads in that direction? It's quite possible that she did advise him to talk to his Dominant-again, she hasn't said either way-the fact that he hasn't done so doesn't mean that she hasn't suggested it. But I don't see that there is any 'rather than', here-he could talk to the OP *and* his Domme. We're three pages in now. If this OP had made that suggestion, I think she would have mentioned it by this point. Instead, all she's come back to do is be snotty in most cases because the majority of folks have called this as they've seen it. This male was someone else's sub when she started up talking with him, so either she contacted him first (which shouldn't have happened without going through his Domme) or he contacted her first and she didn't flat out say in the beginning that, as someone else's sub, he shouldn't be contacting her. Somebody here was being backhanded from the very beginning. Maybe both.
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It may well be that the sub in question has permission to talk to whoever he wants, without the knowledge/involvement of his owner-we don't know. I know you're high protocol, LP, but not everyone is, and I'm not sure it's the OP's responsibility to police that.
It may be. Then again, it may not be. While the OP doesn't have a responsibility to police another person's dynamic, she does have the responsibility to respect what should be the relationship that has the highest priority in her friend's life. I don't really think that's happened here.
I completely understand that some (if not most) folks are not high protocol. I'm all for it, in fact, because they are doing what works for them. At the same time, I ask that people do the same for Me. If someone can't handle the boundaries that I've set down, please, feel free to move along your merry way. However, if you didn't bother yourself to be educated on what is really the situation, then you have been nothing but a pawn in a manipulator's scheme. Which, quite frankly, I think the OP was.
I'm not at all suggesting that people should disrespect your boundaries-but I bet you've got procedures in place for if random Dominants message clip, right? I find it hard to imagine him talking to someone you don't know, without your knowledge or permission. So when I say I assume that a sub is free to talk to me unless they tell me otherwise, he falls under the 'people I would expect to tell me otherwise immediately' umbrella.
While it's possible that the sub in the OP's question is a manipulator, I refuse to live my life worrying about whether or not everyone is a manipulator-so I'm not going to bombard subs I chat to with questions about whether they are allowed to talk to me-I'm going to trust them to be honest enough to tell me if they aren't, unless they show me otherwise.
Does the male in this scenario strike you as a very honest type of individual? It doesn't come across to Me that way. The OP doesn't necessarily strike Me as a class act either. Not once in any of the follow ups has she said that she would have respected such boundaries had they been in place. Instead, she's come back several times to say that she'll talk to whomever it darn well pleases her. She comes across as disrespectful at best and a poacher at worst and I'm not the first person on this thread to hold that opinion.
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