RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub?

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub?

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub?

Page: << < prev 1 2 [3] 4 5 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 6:52:34 PM

Jeffff

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

And if everyone recovers...... no harm. no foul

_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Profile

Post #: 41

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 6:53:49 PM

Smutmonger

Posts: 995
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline

I think that if you alter yourself to be with someone-that person is the one in real control.

_____________________________

I didn't get into an alternative lifestyle to explore new frontiers in conformity.

(in reply to Jeffff)

Profile

Post #: 42

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 6:58:33 PM

Jeffff

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

But define "alter". There is the rub.

I would never wish to be so inflexible as to not be able to learn and grow. So much depends on the people involved

Not even the Anteater knows it all

_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

(in reply to Smutmonger)

Profile

Post #: 43

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 6:59:30 PM

nancygirl34652

Posts: 291
Joined: 3/10/2010
Status: offline

*gasps at Jeffff*...i find that difficult to believe!

(in reply to Jeffff)

Profile

Post #: 44

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 7:00:50 PM

Jeffff

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

Yes I know... it is a hard thing to confront.

If it makes you feel better, I can't remember the last time I was wrong

_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

(in reply to nancygirl34652)

Profile

Post #: 45

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 7:04:49 PM

nancygirl34652

Posts: 291
Joined: 3/10/2010
Status: offline

i'm sure someone will...lol

(in reply to Jeffff)

Profile

Post #: 46

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 7:05:49 PM

Jeffff

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

LOL... no doubt

_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

(in reply to nancygirl34652)

Profile

Post #: 47

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 7:07:38 PM

Smutmonger

Posts: 995
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline

Become someone you wouldn't talk to in your current state. Sort of like Rush Limbaugh becoming Elton John.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

But define "alter". There is the rub.

I would never wish to be so inflexible as to not be able to learn and grow. So much depends on the people involved

Not even the Anteater knows it all

_____________________________

I didn't get into an alternative lifestyle to explore new frontiers in conformity.

(in reply to Jeffff)

Profile

Post #: 48

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 7:53:23 PM

Jeffff

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

Ok.. that's "Altered". I can agree with that

_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

(in reply to Smutmonger)

Profile

Post #: 49

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 7:58:23 PM

Smutmonger

Posts: 995
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline

I see a lot of supposed "D/s" becoming literally "the tail wagging the dog." I've never seen so many pussy whipped men-until I came out in a bdsm community and watched what "submissives" did to "Dominants."

Hell of a price to pay for kinky sex, and a *fantasy* of being in control. Good lord-you better be the perfect Dom-or you get to be the "predatory abuser" to everyone she knows when she goes stomping off.

Anyone who has been around for any time knows this stereotype. Only newbies and gossipy drama queens take it very seriously.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

Ok.. that's "Altered". I can agree with that

_____________________________

I didn't get into an alternative lifestyle to explore new frontiers in conformity.

(in reply to Jeffff)

Profile

Post #: 50

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 9:00:36 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

FR

This debate has gone on time and time again. The ball is still in the court of a Top whether or not to adhere to that agreed upon safeword. We are discussing control, not ethics.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to Smutmonger)

Profile

Post #: 51

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 9:03:23 PM

lucylucy

Posts: 612
Joined: 3/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterK13
I watched a CSI epispode where the moral was that because a sub can end the relationship/session at any momment he or she wants that makes them the ones in control what do you think of this?

How does a sub end a session? By using a safeword, usually. And does the safeword CAUSE the Dom to stop things? No, the Dom stops of his own volition, so to me, he's the one in control. He can choose to ignore the safeword, making him an asshole, sure, but an asshole in control.

_____________________________

“There are those who give with joy, & that joy is their reward.” Gibran / "Those who are willing to be vulnerable move among mysteries." Roethke / "Let the beauty we love be what we do. There are hundreds of ways to kneel & kiss the ground." Rumi

(in reply to MasterK13)

Profile

Post #: 52

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 9:13:31 PM

OrpheusAgonistes

Posts: 253
Joined: 3/29/2010
Status: offline

At any given point in time, whomever absolutely needs it more is in the weaker position and whomever is more capable of walking away is in the catbird seat.

(in reply to MasterK13)

Profile

Post #: 53

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 9:26:27 PM

Kana

Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterK13

I watched a CSI episode where the moral was that because a sub can end the relationship/session at any moment he or she wants that makes them the ones in control what do you think of this?

Yeah. Ok.
As has been pointed out, she ain't the only one who can cut things off with a word.
I may or may not be in control (Control being such a nebulous thing. I mean really who controls their own life. We all operate under the control of some sort of external situations to some degree or another. Then there is the whole religion thing. Is God in charge? Yahweh? Allah?All I can tell is that sometimes I surf life and sometimes the wave eats my lunch) , but I can promise you one thing-she sure as hell isn't in charge of our relationship.
And that's the way we both like it.

Hell, I wanted to get topped from the bottom, I'd just get a girlfriend.

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to MasterK13)

Profile

Post #: 54

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 10:16:54 PM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

In BDSM relationships, I would argue that "authority" is more important than "control." As applied to Simply Micheal's car analogy, I would say its the driver who has authority over the car, and the car is rather brainless in the relationship (unlike a person.)

Good authority figures don't obsess over controlling others, because they already know they don't control anyone. In lieu of control, the authority figure pays attention to earning respect, instilling discipline, and setting goals for those seeking leadership. To me a Dom/Domme is more like coach or teacher, and less like a boss, warden or policemen.

In BDSM control definitely lies with the sub (who decides what he'll do) but the authority is with the Dom (who sets forth a disciplinary structure.)

In the end there is a fruitful commingling and humility from each: The Dom needs a follower and the sub needs a leader.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 3/29/2010 10:22:13 PM >

(in reply to MasterK13)

Profile

Post #: 55

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 10:29:04 PM

LadyAngelika

Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

In BDSM relationships, I would argue that "authority" is more important than "control." As applied to Simply Micheal's car analogy, I would say its the driver who has authority over the car, and the car is rather brainless in the relationship (unlike a person.)

Good authority figures don't obsess over controlling others, because they already know they don't control anyone. In lieu of control, the authority figure pays attention to earning respect, instilling discipline, and setting goals for those seeking leadership. To me a Dom/Domme is more like coach or teacher, and less like a boss, warden or policemen.

In BDSM control definitely lies with the sub (who decides what he'll do) but the authority is with the Dom (who sets forth a disciplinary structure.)

In the end there is a fruitful commingling and humility from each: The Dom needs a follower and the sub needs a leader.

That just might be the first post of yours that I appreciate, cloudboy. Kudos. I strongly encourage you to make more of these thought provoking posts and less of the critical ones. They show your intelligence.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to cloudboy)

Profile

Post #: 56

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/29/2010 10:58:40 PM

candisa

Posts: 127
Joined: 1/7/2008
Status: offline

I absolutely agree with this post, excellent writing, cloudboy.

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

In BDSM relationships, I would argue that "authority" is more important than "control." As applied to Simply Micheal's car analogy, I would say its the driver who has authority over the car, and the car is rather brainless in the relationship (unlike a person.)

Good authority figures don't obsess over controlling others, because they already know they don't control anyone. In lieu of control, the authority figure pays attention to earning respect, instilling discipline, and setting goals for those seeking leadership. To me a Dom/Domme is more like coach or teacher, and less like a boss, warden or policemen.

In BDSM control definitely lies with the sub (who decides what he'll do) but the authority is with the Dom (who sets forth a disciplinary structure.)

In the end there is a fruitful commingling and humility from each: The Dom needs a follower and the sub needs a leader.

_____________________________

respectfully,
candisa

Freely we serve, because we freely love, as in our will
To love or not; in this we stand or fall.

(in reply to cloudboy)

Profile

Post #: 57

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/30/2010 1:59:13 AM

ranja

Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline

Anybody who thinks that they are in control, whether they be sub , slave, Dom or Master, Mistress or even plain vanilla, are lost in an illusion, nice as that illusion might be,
nobody is ever truly in control of anything, maybe you manage to manipulate another to your satisfaction for a while, but that is about it.

Relationships are about compromises, cooperation and compassion, not so much about control

i think it is more like a game and if everybody plays nicely no matter how rough, it should be a lovely game and there will be no losers.

People are only at the top or the bottom because they like to be there and the other lets them be there.

(in reply to candisa)

Profile

Post #: 58

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/30/2010 2:56:20 AM

Focus50

Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

I find it interesting that so many people threw "safewords" into the mix when the OP said nothing about safewords.

Why is it relevant whether the OP mentioned safewords? You've been around for nearly 10 thousand personal posts and you've never once heard of a safeword being used as an example of the submissive having control....

quote:

I also think the quoted statement is hogwash. Every relationship except the one you have with yourself involves another person staying in it and therefore agreeing to its terms, and neither has control over the other person, just over themself.

while I agree about the "quoted statement", it's also just a nonsense to say "neither has control over the other person". Unequal control status is precisely what distinguishes a D/s or M/s relationship from your typical vanilla/egalitarian relationship.

Since neither Dom/me nor sub can function in their respective role without the existence of the other, both have EQUAL power and value to the other. But the *relationship* only works if the Dominant party is controlling the submissive.

Focus.

_____________________________

Never underestimate the persuasive power of stupid people in large groups. <unknown>

Your food is for eating, not torturing. <my mum> (Errm, when I was a kid)

(in reply to CalifChick)

Profile

Post #: 59

RE: Who's really in control the Dom or sub? - 3/30/2010 3:07:54 AM

JonnieBoy

Posts: 1468
Joined: 4/22/2009
From: Cymru
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

I find it interesting that so many people threw "safewords" into the mix when the OP said nothing about safewords.

Why is it relevant whether the OP mentioned safewords? You've been around for nearly 10 thousand personal posts and you've never once heard of a safeword being used as an example of the submissive having control....

quote:

I also think the quoted statement is hogwash. Every relationship except the one you have with yourself involves another person staying in it and therefore agreeing to its terms, and neither has control over the other person, just over themself.

while I agree about the "quoted statement", it's also just a nonsense to say "neither has control over the other person". Unequal control status is precisely what distinguishes a D/s or M/s relationship from your typical vanilla/egalitarian relationship.

Since neither Dom/me nor sub can function in their respective role without the existence of the other, both have EQUAL power and value to the other. But the *relationship* only works if the Dominant party is controlling the submissive.

Focus.