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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 10:32:47 AM

pahunkboy

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shovel ready~~~!!

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 10:41:49 AM

domiguy

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just a huge magnum condom.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 10:47:15 AM

TheHeretic

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With an oil tanker for the reservoir tip.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 11:06:36 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

It's not all coming from one place; it's coming from the wellhead, the riser, and points in between. Not like you could just drop a big oven hood over it.

Drilling any type of well takes a lot of time. It's horrendously tough work. You're down a mile before you even start, the reservoir's another 18000 feet down and you also have to try to get close to the original well. I'd bet 6 months to get this under control.

If the ROV's haven't been able to shut the flow via the blowout preventer, it was probably damaged in the blowout. It's happened in the past - you can't anticipate all circumstances when you design that gear.

I'm inclined to agree for the most part; but at the same time, the fact that this has happened in the past is all the more reason they should have been better prepared. Does anyone remember the Ixtoc I leak in 1979? The second largest oil spill in history? The details of that disaster were remarkably similar to this - a deepwater well in the Gulf of Mexico, explosion and fire on the drill rig, the rig collapsed, the platform sank (breaking the pipe in several places and damaging the wellhead), and the shear rams failed to work. The details and the sequence of events was almost identical to this event, and here we are 30 years later, with the exact same situation, and apparently nobody learned anything useful from the first one. And that one took 9 months to shut off.

If this one takes the 3 months that BP is claiming it would take to drill the relief well, it will have vomited out a minimum of 90,000,000 gallons of oil, the second largest oil spill in history. And that's assuming the current rate of flow remains constant, which is by no means guaranteed. In fact, the rate of flow may be worsening, possibly due to the sand that's mixed in with the oil abrading the pipe as it rockets through at high velocity. It's essentially sandblasting the inside of the pipe and the wellhead, and if it blows that out completely, the worst case could be mind-boggling. BP's Thunderhorse platform, not far from this one, produces as much as 150,000 barrels a day. If the capacity of the Horizon well is comparable to the Thunderhorse, and the wellhead goes out completely, this would easily be the worst oil spill in history.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 11:13:10 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Which is to say, you loath capitalist propaganda, the likes of which we've been getting for over 60 years.

It wouldn't surprise me and I also wouldn't put it past them if BP or their hirelings...did it themselves to help prop up the price.

They'd have to be totally insane, Mr. R. By the time this is over, the State of Louisiana will essentially own BP. This will cost them billions, maybe even into the tens of billions before it's over.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 11:19:10 AM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

It wouldn't surprise me and I also wouldn't put it past them if BP or their hirelings...did it themselves to help prop up the price.

It wouldnt suprise me if you didnt make a post as absurd as this again, either.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 11:24:57 AM

pahunkboy

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I wonder if AIG is the insurance company. Certainly it cant be good for the insurance industry.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 11:40:32 AM

Jeffff

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The government has legislated seat belts, air bags, drugs and a plethora of other things.

How is it that a poorly designed oil well is allowed?

I am a capitalist, but this was done in the name of profit and someone should pay.

The only thing that bothers Me is that I am sure I will be the one paying. For the clean up and at the pump

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 11:42:57 AM

CynthiaWVirginia

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(fast reply)

Thanks for all the education, guys. I went to the links and now understand this is no easy fix. This will be in the news a lot longer than I thought...I doubt they will handle this in 3 months, as at least 9 months seems to be the norm. This is so depressing.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 12:12:44 PM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

It's the multiple leaks that seem (to me anyway) to make this do-able, Thorns. They don't have to deal with the full pressure of the leak all in one place, all at one time.

I think you'd need something in a custom dome, instead of an oven hood at those pressures though. If only there were places along the Gulf Coast where they shaped big pieces of steel to make boats or something.

Part of the problem is that the main thing (possibly the only thing) restricting the flow of the oil at this point is the bends and kinks in the pipe. Sort of like the kinks in a garden hose. I'm just speculating here, but it could possibly be that they're concerned about breaking the pipe completely, and letting it all shoot out unrestricted. I just read an article a few minutes ago that says BP's estimate of the maximum volume of an uncontrolled blowout on that well is 162,000 barrels a day. They may be calculating that the chance of damaging the pipe is greater than the chance of containing the oil, and making a judgment that they're better off with the devil they know.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 12:20:57 PM

pahunkboy

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The valdez went on for many months.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 12:44:25 PM

flcouple2009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

It's not all coming from one place; it's coming from the wellhead, the riser, and points in between. Not like you could just drop a big oven hood over it.

Drilling any type of well takes a lot of time. It's horrendously tough work. You're down a mile before you even start, the reservoir's another 18000 feet down and you also have to try to get close to the original well. I'd bet 6 months to get this under control.

If the ROV's haven't been able to shut the flow via the blowout preventer, it was probably damaged in the blowout. It's happened in the past - you can't anticipate all circumstances when you design that gear.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Here is the diagram they are running with

I just don't see why it is so difficult to be capturing what's coming out, or at least a significant percentage of it, in a much shorter time frame.

Beyond the government commissions and blame passing, I think there should be a hefty cash prize, say 10 million, to the deepwater salvage co. that can come up with a way to do it. Not that I expect using the free market and the profit motive to solve a problem would even occur to this administration...

It doesn't have to get close to the other well, it has to hit it. They drill exactly across where the other well is, into the pipe in the hole, and then start pumpng in mud and concrete to close it up.

The Timor Sea blow out was about 7 months ago. It took somewhere around 2 1/2 months to get it closed. It was a huge eco disaster in that part of Australia. Your looking at about the same time line of 2 to 3 months to drill a relief well here.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 12:49:14 PM

pahunkboy

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Where is the taunting Osama tape to warn against the Great Satan? lol

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 1:22:23 PM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

The valdez went on for many months.

True, but the total spillage from the Exxon Valdez was about 11,000,000 gallons. If this goes on for months at the current rate of flow, we'd have one Exxon Valdez every 10 days. If the wellhead blows out completely, and it truly does go to approximately 160,000 bbl. per day, we'd have an Exxon Valdez every 30 hours or so (just doing it in my head). An Exxon Valdez every 30 hours for 2 or 3 months would be nothing short of catastrophic, both environmentally and economically. Prince William Sound still hasn't recovered from just the one Exxon Valdez, and that was over 20 years ago. Multiply that by 50 or so, and it's safe to say that much of the Gulf will never be the same in my lifetime.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 1:40:24 PM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Here is the diagram they are running with

I just don't see why it is so difficult to be capturing what's coming out, or at least a significant percentage of it, in a much shorter time frame.

Beyond the government commissions and blame passing, I think there should be a hefty cash prize, say 10 million, to the deepwater salvage co. that can come up with a way to do it. Not that I expect using the free market and the profit motive to solve a problem would even occur to this administration...

Well, it looks as though they are going to give it a try.

quote:

BP's new strategy: Containment boxes will be placed over spilled oil in Gulf

It'll take about a week, but they're going to give it a shot. Let's all cross our fingers.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 1:48:19 PM

Brain

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I'll try to remember how to use it. I don't know HTML.
Bill

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 3:15:15 PM

flcouple2009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Here is the diagram they are running with

I just don't see why it is so difficult to be capturing what's coming out, or at least a significant percentage of it, in a much shorter time frame.

Beyond the government commissions and blame passing, I think there should be a hefty cash prize, say 10 million, to the deepwater salvage co. that can come up with a way to do it. Not that I expect using the free market and the profit motive to solve a problem would even occur to this administration...

A wild guess here but maybe it has something to do with being 5,000 down?

Everything that has been discussed and might be tried has never been done at that level, only in much shallower water. I am not sure why you think is so easy.

There are companies that specialize in sealing wells and securing blow outs. Everybody is already working on it. If you really want an idea of what did and didn't work you can look over what happened in the Timor sea just a few months ago.

It's a lot different trying something that worked in a few hundred feet of water and transferring that to 5,000 feet.

Geeeez, you really think if it was that easy everybody would jsut be standing around letting it spew?

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 6:00:41 PM

TheHeretic

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No, Coup, I don't think it is easy. I do think we need to be constantly seeking innovation and new ways of doing hard things. I get the dangers of trying to patch the leaks and shut off the flow completely, so what I'm asking is about directing where the leaking oil goes.

Guessing from Panda's link (thanks, Panda!

), I might not be completely off base here.

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 6:08:08 PM

opendelight

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spend money in that shitty fucking country??

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RE: BP responsible. - 5/2/2010 6:20:26 PM

thornhappy

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On of the petroleum companies operating in the Santa Barbara Channel put what look like tents over part of the sea bed off Coal Oil Point Reserve, but it was to capture gas, not oil, and the depth was much less. They get 350,000 cubic feet/day. When I first heard about the project, they were going to trade the gas for pollution credits (you'd be surprised how much smog you can see in and offshore of Santa Barbara.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

It's the multiple leaks that seem (to me anyway) to make this do-able, Thorns. They don't have to deal with the full pressure of the leak all in one place, all at one time.

I think you'd need something in a custom dome, instead of an oven hood at those pressures though. If only there were places along the Gulf Coast where they shaped big pieces of steel to make boats or something.

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