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RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 3:28:29 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Loki45

quote:

ORIGINAL: cadenas
Really? It seems to me that there are plenty of racists in the South who would like to implement such a law if the Constitution allowed it.


Really really doubtful. Sure, racists will always exist, but there's no way they could make blacks "not citizens" in 2010. Therefore, if that is indeed the reason for the 14th amendment as you claim, then it's outlived its usefulness and now only serves to grant automatic citizenship to those who do not deserve it.


Bullshit. Mississippi would revert to worse than Jim Crowe in a heart beat if given a chance. All the racists in Idaho might be able to pull it off as well. There certainly would be attempts.

(in reply to Loki45)
Profile   Post #: 161
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 4:22:04 PM   
popeye1250


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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Loki45

quote:

ORIGINAL: cadenas
Really? It seems to me that there are plenty of racists in the South who would like to implement such a law if the Constitution allowed it.


Really really doubtful. Sure, racists will always exist, but there's no way they could make blacks "not citizens" in 2010. Therefore, if that is indeed the reason for the 14th amendment as you claim, then it's outlived its usefulness and now only serves to grant automatic citizenship to those who do not deserve it.


Bullshit. Mississippi would revert to worse than Jim Crowe in a heart beat if given a chance. All the racists in Idaho might be able to pull it off as well. There certainly would be attempts.


All those U.S. birth citizenship tourism companies in Turkey who get $25k a "pop" will be crushed when we change this law.


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RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 5:35:19 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

That's your position. My position is that if you are an illegal alien, you can't use my country's laws to try and cover up your illegal deed. Period.


In my country you cannot make up your own laws.
If you do not like the constitution of my country why do you live here?

(in reply to Loki45)
Profile   Post #: 163
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 5:48:16 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

I stand corrected. (See how easy that was "I'm always right Godammit!" Thompson?)


Easy for you because you are wrong most of the time.
I am still waiting for you to prove me wrong on something I have said.

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 164
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 6:07:55 PM   
WyldHrt


Posts: 6412
Joined: 6/5/2008
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quote:

No, the thread is about children born on US soil. Anchor babies are a common myth thrown out by anti-immigration zealots; they are an invention. A lie if you will. There is no such thing as "anchor babies" since there is no immigration category that would allow parents to immigrate based on having a newborn US citizen child.

Yep, there's no such thing as an anchor baby, and women don't come to the US for the express purpose of having their kid born here so xhe will be a citizen, either:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/04/07/eveningnews/main4000401.shtml
http://www.eturbonews.com/15529/us-birth-tourism-becoming-flourishing-business
http://www.fileus.org/dept/citizenship/02-05-26-latimes-birth_tourism_asia.html
http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2010/03/birth_tourism_i.php
If you've never seen an 8 months pregnant woman waddling across the freeway at 3AM, you probably don't live close to the Mexico border.
quote:

Nearly every civilized country in the world grants citizenship to children born in the country.

Bullshit.
quote:


Countries that Grant Automatic Birthright Citizenship  Argentina, Brazil, Cameroon, Canada, India, Jamaica, Mexico, Pakistan, Spain, United States, and Venezuela. 
Countries that do NOT Grant Automatic Birthright Citizenship  Algeria, Australia, Belgium, Columbia, Czech Republic, Egypt, France, Germany, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Japan, Kenya, Korea, Kuwait, New Zealand, Nigeria, Norway, Philippines, Poland, Saudi Arabia, Sweden, Switzerland, Syria, Taiwan, United Kingdom, and Zaire.

Source: http://www.voiceforvoters.com/?p=47


< Message edited by WyldHrt -- 5/25/2010 6:08:44 PM >

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(in reply to cadenas)
Profile   Post #: 165
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 9:53:09 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cadenas

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Children born in the US are US citizens. Next question? What do you want to do, create a ghetto?


Nope, i want to stop the process of automatic citizenship based simply upon walking across the boarder and dropping a baby.


And put the US in the company of such backwards countries as Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Kuwait and Germany? Nearly every civilized country in the world grants citizenship to children born in the country. Germany is an exception - the German citizenship law goes back to Hitler's time and was never cleaned up after the war - and even Germany now does it in many cases.

The Germans can tell you about the problems that not granting citizenship causes. They have a huge population of (mostly ethnic Turkish) people who live there, by now in the fourth generation, don't even speak Turkish, and still don't have German citizenship.

And the US itself? The 14th Amendment was passed so that no crazy Southerner could pass a law that says "blacks aren't citizens".





quote:

ORIGINAL: cadenas

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
If I were to take my pregnant wife to France and she were to give birth I would not, and should not, expect my child to be a French citizen.


Funny you say that: your child would actually be a French citizens; you wouldn't even have the option to decline that. France (and almost all other Western countries) grants citizenship based on the place of birth.




You really have no clue what you are talking about. But Wyld did an excellent job informing you while i did my slave labor for a paycheck.

Thank you Wyld!

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Profile   Post #: 166
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 10:09:01 PM   
WyldHrt


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quote:

Thank you Wyld!

Just saving your place while you were gone, Tazzy.


_____________________________

"MotherFUCKER!" is NOT a safeword!!"- Steel
"We've had complaints about 'orgy noises'. This is not the neighborhood for that kind of thing"- PVE Cop

Resident "Hypnotic Eyes", "Cleavage" and "Toy Whore"
Subby Mafia, VAA Posse & Team Troll!

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 167
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/25/2010 10:11:35 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Awww

no such things as anchor babies? dont people read anymore?

ah well... guess not.

google is your friend... if you can spell... and if you put in the right phrases... and you actually bother to use it!

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to WyldHrt)
Profile   Post #: 168
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 4:07:41 AM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy
Why would you post reasons to question Obama about his citizenship?
Why?


Clarification, this board has a habit of only posting one side of an issue, someone has to keep things honest around here.

I didn't start the thread, nor am I the one who brought his citizenship into question, I just posted the real reasons some have for questioning Obama.

(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 169
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 4:37:32 AM   
Loki45


Posts: 2100
Joined: 5/13/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
In my country you cannot make up your own laws.
If you do not like the constitution of my country why do you live here?


This wouldn't be "making up" our own laws. It would "unmaking" one that others "made up."

Are you not aware of how the amendment process works and why it was put into the constitution?


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Profile   Post #: 170
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 4:54:09 AM   
Loki45


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Joined: 5/13/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
Bullshit. Mississippi would revert to worse than Jim Crowe in a heart beat if given a chance. All the racists in Idaho might be able to pull it off as well. There certainly would be attempts.


Oh? You took a poll in those states, did you? You know how the majority truly feels? Or might you just be talking out your ass?

It doesn't matter either way. Considering we're talking about amending the constitution on a FEDERAL level, I doubt they'd have much luck doing anything at the state level. Let's see -- 48 states have no problems with blacks; 2 (you claim) would try and make them non-citizens. Sounds to me like the 48 other states would be the majority.


_____________________________

"'Till the roof comes off, 'till the lights go out
'Till my legs give out, can't shut my mouth."

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Profile   Post #: 171
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 5:34:10 AM   
Sanity


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Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
Dk is pulling his facts and information out of his ass, as always. Last night Idaho Republicans nominated Raul Labrador as their candidate to go up against our Democrat congressman Walt Miniick in the November elections...



So how racist can we be.

http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/05/26/1206721/labrador-upsets-ward-eyes-minnick.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+IdahostatesmancomLocalNews+%28IdahoStatesman.com+Local+News%29&utm_content=My+Yahoo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Loki45

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
Bullshit. Mississippi would revert to worse than Jim Crowe in a heart beat if given a chance. All the racists in Idaho might be able to pull it off as well. There certainly would be attempts.


Oh? You took a poll in those states, did you? You know how the majority truly feels? Or might you just be talking out your ass?

It doesn't matter either way. Considering we're talking about amending the constitution on a FEDERAL level, I doubt they'd have much luck doing anything at the state level. Let's see -- 48 states have no problems with blacks; 2 (you claim) would try and make them non-citizens. Sounds to me like the 48 other states would be the majority.



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(in reply to Loki45)
Profile   Post #: 172
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 9:52:26 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Loki45

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
In my country you cannot make up your own laws.
If you do not like the constitution of my country why do you live here?


This wouldn't be "making up" our own laws. It would "unmaking" one that others "made up."

quote:

My position is that if you are an illegal alien, you can't use my country's laws to try and cover up your illegal deed. Period.


My point, that you chose to ignore, was your position quoted above.
You do not have the authority to tell the government what laws they may enforce.





(in reply to Loki45)
Profile   Post #: 173
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 12:03:14 PM   
cadenas


Posts: 517
Joined: 11/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

quote:

No, the thread is about children born on US soil. Anchor babies are a common myth thrown out by anti-immigration zealots; they are an invention. A lie if you will. There is no such thing as "anchor babies" since there is no immigration category that would allow parents to immigrate based on having a newborn US citizen child.

Yep, there's no such thing as an anchor baby, and women don't come to the US for the express purpose of having their kid born here so xhe will be a citizen, either:

NONE of the articles you list is about anchor babies. Every one is about the child becoming a US citizen (and the parents getting nothing, immigration-wise).

quote:

Nearly every civilized country in the world grants citizenship to children born in the country.

Bullshit.
quote:


Countries that Grant Automatic Birthright Citizenship  Argentina, Brazil, Cameroon, Canada, India, Jamaica, Mexico, Pakistan, Spain, United States, and Venezuela. 
Countries that do NOT Grant Automatic Birthright Citizenship  Algeria, Australia, Belgium, Columbia, Czech Republic, Egypt, France, Germany, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Japan, Kenya, Korea, Kuwait, New Zealand, Nigeria, Norway, Philippines, Poland, Saudi Arabia, Sweden, Switzerland, Syria, Taiwan, United Kingdom, and Zaire.


That list came from a right-wing blog and is plain wrong. One of my cousins became an Australian citizen that way. The legal term is "ius soli" (law of the land). The only accurate ones on that list that I could spot are Switzerland and the Arab countries. Germany actually introduced ius soli recently (on that, my information was a bit dated). France also has it.


(in reply to WyldHrt)
Profile   Post #: 174
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 12:27:54 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
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quote:

OK. The parents have committed a crime. The child has not.


The violation of most immigration laws is not a "crime," it is a regulatory offense. Being out of status or overstaying a visa is not a "crime."

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 175
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 12:33:49 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
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quote:

No, the thread is about children born on US soil. Anchor babies are a common myth thrown out by anti-immigration zealots; they are an invention. A lie if you will. There is no such thing as "anchor babies" since there is no immigration category that would allow parents to immigrate based on having a newborn US citizen child.


That is correct, the parents of a US citizen aren't eligible to apply for permanent residence until the child turns 21 years old. Right now ICE spends a lot of time removing the parents and spouses of US citizens and permanent residents -- effectively splitting up families.

The term "anchor baby" it totally misleading.

US authorities will remove the parents of a US child without blinking an eye, and its perfectly legal to do so.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 5/26/2010 12:35:08 PM >

(in reply to cadenas)
Profile   Post #: 176
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 12:39:14 PM   
cadenas


Posts: 517
Joined: 11/27/2004
Status: offline 		Read what? Here is what I read - the actual law. Look at Immigration and Nationality Act section 201, (b)(2)(A)(i) http://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/SLB/HTML/SLB/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-29/0-0-0-914.html

Not sure what you read, but it obviously does not agree with the law.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
no such things as anchor babies? dont people read anymore?



(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 177
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 12:44:37 PM   
cadenas


Posts: 517
Joined: 11/27/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
quote:

ORIGINAL: cadenas
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
If I were to take my pregnant wife to France and she were to give birth I would not, and should not, expect my child to be a French citizen.


Funny you say that: your child would actually be a French citizens; you wouldn't even have the option to decline that. France (and almost all other Western countries) grants citizenship based on the place of birth.


You really have no clue what you are talking about. But Wyld did an excellent job informing you while i did my slave labor for a paycheck.


Actually, the child would indeed become a French citizen. France does have a minor modification to ius soli: the child loses French citizenship at the 18th birthday if he hasn't lived in France for at least five years. In the context of what we are discussing here, that's of course immaterial. But it was apparently enough for that blogger Wyld cited to spread the misinformation that France didn't have ius soli.


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 178
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 3:11:35 PM   
Loki45


Posts: 2100
Joined: 5/13/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
My point, that you chose to ignore, was your position quoted above.
You do not have the authority to tell the government what laws they may enforce.


Actually, that's exactly how a democracy works. When the majority of a populace wants something changed, a bill is put before the necessary branch of the government and it's voted on. If enough people speak up about ditching the 14th amendment, it's ditched. Simple.

Did you not take government in high school?


_____________________________

"'Till the roof comes off, 'till the lights go out
'Till my legs give out, can't shut my mouth."

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Profile   Post #: 179
RE: Author of Arizona immigration law wants to end birt... - 5/26/2010 3:57:14 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Loki45

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
My point, that you chose to ignore, was your position quoted above.
You do not have the authority to tell the government what laws they may enforce.


Actually, that's exactly how a democracy works. When the majority of a populace wants something changed, a bill is put before the necessary branch of the government and it's voted on. If enough people speak up about ditching the 14th amendment, it's ditched. Simple.

Did you not take government in high school?




Gee, and all this time I thought "the govt" worked for "us!"
How do we get "the govt" to just enforce the laws that are on the books now?
Government by the minority doesn't have a very good track record.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to Loki45)
Profile   Post #: 180
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