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RE: letting go - 6/11/2010 9:05:55 PM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

Letting go is easy especially if there is a Jump Master to boot you out the fall is fun as long as you have a parachute which works. Enjoy the ride and land soft.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 21

RE: letting go - 6/11/2010 10:21:13 PM

porcelaine

Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2

im curious now about how others have reached whatever point of letting go they are most comfortable with, in all aspects of submission, from play to TPE. was there a eurekka moment for you, did it take a time, was it fairly immediate, was it easy or hard. what process, mental or emotional did you go through if any. what were youre struggles and hurdles that you had to overcome.

I view that as a continual process of personal evolution. Sometimes we hold on to things unknowingly and only realize we're doing so when situations arise or other issues give way and we're able to see what's lurking beneath. I believe in connectivity. That generally means when I have a problem determining whether its root cause is physical, mental, or emotionally inspired is necessary. Sometimes it's a combination of the three. I try to figure out what's going on. Merely trudging ahead doesn't do it for me. I'll undoubtedly bump into the problem at a later date and I'd rather be done with it in all truth.

For me, letting go involves trust, honesty, acceptance, and articulation. Trusting that I'm in good hands. Being honest when things bother me rather than hiding or wearing a brave face instead. Accepting that triumphs in one area will leave others undone and understanding that a work in progress is a good thing. In terms of articulation, I own my truth and I'm willing to share it with the other person. I don't believe in prettying it up or camouflage either. I believe he's strong enough to handle whatever it involves and I'm confident we'll work through it together.

My eureka moment came when I realized that I caused myself more hardship and internal suffering by holding on. I stood on the edge pondering everything that might occur when I really needed to leap. It was a period of angst ridden anxiety and I finally said, "enough" and allowed myself to fall. That was the first. I've had many more since that time. It is much akin to a spiral staircase. Each level brings its own challenges and the climb gets a little bit steeper. Most recently I had another one and I think this is probably the most profound to date. It addressed areas that were hindering me that I needed to release to deepen my kneel and move in the direction I wished to go.

I don't think that was too hard. What I've struggled with is impatience and bending. I've wavered on what's enough or too much for each. I think I'm finding a happy medium but it's probable I'll do a bit more tweaking. I know when I'm leaning too far in either direction by internal signals. I don't see this as something that will be immediate at all. Not what I'm addressing. It's a bridge of sorts that must be crossed to allow a 24/7 dynamic or it just won't happen.

The physical changes require accountability and an unwillingness to make excuses. The timetable is imperative and I can't waver. For the most part I've had to deal with this without any support, but thankfully that's changed. At the very least I have a couple of people that I feel comfortable discussing my struggles with. Mental fortitude and flexibility encompass the bulk of what I'm pinpointing in that area.

In terms of emotions it's important that I'm open, approachable, and free of the past. Remnants can inspire fear, skepticism, judgment, and paralyze our ability to move forward. It's necessary that I'm not bringing those things into a new dynamic. The slate must be free and clear. Unfortunately, that is not the case and it is a major stumbling block that I have to surmount. The hardest part thus far has been accepting that I've allowed it to continue because I want it there. The admissions have led to internal dialogues that pose questions that yield answers that leave me surprised, disheartened, and wondering what's wrong with me on occasion. I've begun to accept that it will take time. Because it hasn't gone away as of yet.

So that's where I am at present. Letting go in itself is easy for me. I've been doing it for a very long time. But I'm always looking for new areas that remain untouched or haven't been offered to the dominant. I aspire to give all of myself and make an earnest attempt not to hide behind things that are challenging or uncomfortable in any manner. His full possession of my person is what I desire most.

~porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 22

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 4:36:55 AM

CaringandReal

Posts: 1397
Joined: 2/15/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

For me, it is always hard to let go emotionally of a relationship in which I had invested a good part of my heart.

That's the hardest part about "letting go" for me, too. :( I feel personal ties very strongly, I feel a strong cord between me and somebody close to me, connecting us. And even when they are dead I'm still clinging to their finger like a tenacious little crab.

But regarding the submissive struggle....

For me, it was never much about PAIN=LOVE=PAIN=LOVE except in the heat of passion. The everyday struggle had a more insidious backbeat: EGO>LOVE=PAIN, EGO>LOVE=PAIN, and so on.

I like this one a bit better for a mantra: it has a good rhythm to it:

Control...
Acceptance...
Pleasure!

(Lally, thanks a lot for putting that anicent Paul McCartney song in my head. :/ I'll be hearing it all day now.)

_____________________________

"A friend who bleeds is better" --placebo

"How seldom we recognize the sound when the bolt of our fate slides home." --thomas harris

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 23

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 6:55:32 AM

ownedbyPF

Posts: 126
Joined: 2/18/2010
Status: offline

Gosh, this is a good one! I know I was always open to letting go because I wanted to be able to, but the fear came, for me, in making certain I was letting go to a Man worthy of letting it go to. I wanted to be wide open, splayed, vulnerable, seen utterly and completely, but really, who do you trust that to? I don't think I put up walls. No, I did put up walls and make it harder on myself once upon a time. At some point though I realized that I couldn't want one thing and block it at the same time. So instead I broached it from being actively willing to let go, while evaluating who I let go to. I asked better questions. I evaluated answers, actions, and my responses. I tried to always be honest with that person and with myself.

When I met my Master I was at a good place. I knew what I wanted and what I offerred. So we talked, and talked, and talked. I remained always open... open both to Him, as well as open to the possibility that He may not be all He was cracked up to be. I put things out there, guaged His response, felt safe and moved on to the next level/moment of vulnerability. Open, yet realistically braced :) It was a process. I kept taking the next step, making sure that the floor beneath my feet really was made of concrete, not a sheet of paper that would leave me in a free fall. He held my hand the whole way, kept reassuring me the floor wouldn't give way, and at some point I realized that the floor really was as solid as He claimed it to be. I stopped stepping cautiously and just kept moving.

I have found there is a second part of letting go that would never have occurred to me. There are moments, even now, after a few years of living together and being all in, where I suddenly discover I've let go of something I didn't even realize I was holding onto. It's amazing. Suddenly I feel some layer slough off and I can stand there and think... wow, I didn't even know that was there. I couldn't see it until it was peeled off of me and left on the floor for me to look at in bewilderment.

I can't recall a defining moment, but I do know that at some point I realized it was my responsibility to at least be brave enough to put my foot out and take the step. It was His responsibility to make sure I didn't regret that step.
~s

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 24

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 7:06:37 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

What a wonderful post. Thank you for opening up and sharing. Aye it takes courage to let go and it is good that you realised that you had to be brave enough to take that first step. It is so true that a master should accept the responsibility to ensure that you didn't regret it too.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to ownedbyPF)

Post #: 25

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 8:41:39 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedbyPF

. I remained always open... open both to Him, as well as open to the possibility that He may not be all He was cracked up to be. I put things out there, guaged His response, felt safe and moved on to the next level/moment of vulnerability. Open, yet realistically braced :) It was a process. I kept taking the next step, making sure that the floor beneath my feet really was made of concrete, not a sheet of paper that would leave me in a free fall. He held my hand the whole way, kept reassuring me the floor wouldn't give way, and at some point I realized that the floor really was as solid as He claimed it to be. I stopped stepping cautiously and just kept moving.

I have found there is a second part of letting go that would never have occurred to me. There are moments, even now, after a few years of living together and being all in, where I suddenly discover I've let go of something I didn't even realize I was holding onto. It's amazing. Suddenly I feel some layer slough off and I can stand there and think... wow, I didn't even know that was there. I couldn't see it until it was peeled off of me and left on the floor for me to look at in bewilderment.

I can't recall a defining moment, but I do know that at some point I realized it was my responsibility to at least be brave enough to put my foot out and take the step. It was His responsibility to make sure I didn't regret that step.
~s

the first para that i quoted and the bit that i highlighted in red was so perfectly described 'Open but realistically braced' - brilliantly put!

since reading everyones post here, a few things popped into my head. that yes i think it is instinctive - because its what we want and is therefore part of how we are wired and so when it falls into place it is that wow moment of 'how easy, how great is this!!'. also about trust, thats huge, there has to be trust in order to fully open and relax.

ive also realised that with each guy ive been with that process of letting go has been different. the first time and i suppose the defining time for me was just in a quiet happy moment walking hand in hand in the sunshine, letting him lead me around by the hand, feeling which way he was going and keeping in step until it felt almost meditative to me. another guy broke me, totally smashed through various walls over the period of a weekend. i trusted him and i knew his motives were sound. i actually said 'please stop i dont have any resistance left' and he just smiled this big smile and everything stopped. and now i have this kinda knowing inside of me with my new guy that there is no need for resistance or struggle. ive learnt how, i feel safe and its all good.

not saying resistance wont creep in from time to time but being willing and able to open and let go isnt that scary thing anymore. Open but realistically braced - i love that, i might have to pinch it for my siggy line

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to ownedbyPF)

Post #: 26

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 8:49:46 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

icarys, the thing about being inspired, there was a whole thread on it some time back, but basically it isnt about someone waiting for inspiration and putting the onus on the Dom to perform some godly sway through our subconcious souls - in fact, really alot of the work is done by the sub or slave in terms of realising that to reach the release of submission they have to let go of their self protective walls, insecurities and doubts within themselves. it is about trust and maybe its the trust that inspires us to let go, or a mix of things.

just the other day i had something really unsettling arrive in the post. i kept it inside of me, not sure what to do with it. when i told Him about it his response was 'just go for it - ill be here to push you and support you when you wobble' - that was just Him being Him but it inspired me and spurred me on to see this thing more positively and strongly. that being an example of feeling inspired

caringandreal - id forgotten about the ego bit

- and i had no idea there was a song from paul macartney - least id forgotten it anyway.

< Message edited by lally2 -- 6/12/2010 9:05:42 AM >

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 27

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 8:57:28 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

i think also it is about trusting myself - like laurell says - that and being Open but realistically braced

, go together to help the process along.

justanothersub - i think i felt a bit like you after my exSir and i have to admit i wasted a couple of guys time trying to find my way back there, haunted totally by the memory of how it felt with him - but i think it is different with everyone, obviously, because everyone is different. the thing you cant do is look back or compare with how it was then with him, and it isnt about closing the door on the past but more about opening the door to someone you trust at a pace you can handle.

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 28

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 9:01:36 AM

lally2

Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12

My letting-go moment came when Sir asked me about what i liked sexually. I already knew what he liked, and i was tempted to give him the old "whatever you like" routine.

I actually came out and said exactly what i liked - which for me was HUGE. I had been a people pleaser all my life, so being assertive and stating what i liked was way out of the ordinary - but, i wanted this relationship to work! Really work, for both of us, and for me the key was being honest about who and what i was. No hiding, no saying "but i was trying to make you happy", no trying to guess what he wanted. Just flat out stating what i liked.

My letting go of my fears , and trusting him to cherish me was what made our relationship so good.

It was very scary and very freeing at the same time, and i can't see going back to old behaviours now. Free at last, free at last!

i had to giggle at this - reminded me so much of me - i can waffle away happily about any sort of nonsense, but pin me down to admit anything about myself and for that information to be focused on and digested is just 'ooooh ahhh eeeek, change the subject'

and then for them to spend time pursuing that thing can make me feel like im taking up too much of their time and i really wobble with that. still do infact

< Message edited by lally2 -- 6/12/2010 9:07:46 AM >

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to kiwisub12)

Post #: 29

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 10:14:44 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2

icarys, the thing about being inspired, there was a whole thread on it some time back, but basically it isnt about someone waiting for inspiration and putting the onus on the Dom to perform some godly sway through our subconcious souls - in fact, really alot of the work is done by the sub or slave in terms of realising that to reach the release of submission they have to let go of their self protective walls, insecurities and doubts within themselves. it is about trust and maybe its the trust that inspires us to let go, or a mix of things.

just the other day i had something really unsettling arrive in the post. i kept it inside of me, not sure what to do with it. when i told Him about it his response was 'just go for it - ill be here to push you and support you when you wobble' - that was just Him being Him but it inspired me and spurred me on to see this thing more positively and strongly. that being an example of feeling inspired

caringandreal - id forgotten about the ego bit - and i had no idea there was a song from paul macartney - least id forgotten it anyway.

Lally, that may be what it is for you but I assure you..It's not that way for everyone.

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to lally2)

Post #: 30

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 10:24:32 AM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine
I view that as a continual process of personal evolution.

*nods* There's always more ego and self hanging around in there somewhere. There's always more trust (and trustworthiness) to be had. I, for one, don't plan on giving up this journey any time soon.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to porcelaine)

Post #: 31

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 10:26:20 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

quote:

At some point though I realized that I couldn't want one thing and block it at the same time. So instead I broached it from being actively willing to let go, while evaluating who I let go to.

All of this with emphasis on the bold part. Excellent!

Most people are sure they know who they are but haven't the first clue what's really going on inside. They are cock sure they are ready to dive into a relationship and are healthy enough emotionally to do this. It just isn't so for a large majority.

You have to be in a place of surrender before you can surrender. Much like the catchphrase is tossed around about a Master mastering themselves that's so popular. It works both ways.

Hold onto something too tight and you loose the ability sometimes to give it away.

< Message edited by Icarys -- 6/12/2010 10:57:41 AM >

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to ownedbyPF)

Post #: 32

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 10:40:45 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

Icarys I think the number might be quite a bit higher than you think.

I don't have a hard time letting go once I get there. However the process it takes for me to get to that place where I really trust myself in the hands and mind of another can be painstakingly tedious for them. After massive amounts of communication and sometimes even talking about the same thing more than once, I reach my comfort zone and it's all easy after that. I think I must be a bit off though because so many people here say meet someone within a few phone calls. I just can't see the point to that at all. If I haven't gotten to the mental and emotional trust stage, meeting would do nothing to get me there and would most likely just frustrate them more.

I'm sure it is.

Why does it have to be so hard though? You can come to the realization that someone is trustworthy fairly easy..It doesn't take that long if you pay sole attention to their actions and words lining up.

Edited: I can usually tell if a person is trustworthy in as little as a week or so..There are ques people give without even realizing it.(I aint about to give up my Debit card pin at that point but...)

< Message edited by Icarys -- 6/12/2010 10:46:20 AM >

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 33

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 10:41:30 AM

Andalusite

Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline

Icarys, in my last two relationships (3 years as a submissive, 1 year as a slave), I was able to let go and trust and do activities that scared me, that I didn't like or want to do, or that I had previously had difficulty with, fairly early on. There wasn't any struggle against him, only sometimes against myself. Occasionally I needed baby steps, say two or three tries over time before I was able to get where he wanted me to go. To some extent, I did have to be vulnerable and willing to surrender up-front, but it very much was inspired by my interaction with them as specific people. I wasn't actively seeking someone to surrender to, though, I was open to a lot of different possibilities, depending on the interaction with the specific person. I'm one of those "dirty switches" according to your post on page 1, though.

(in reply to Icarys)

Post #: 34

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 10:46:22 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

It took a lot of time with him. Time to learn that he wouldn't ask things that would be bad for me, that he did consider the results on me of things, and learning that if in fact things did start to go bad he would stop it immediately. But that's years of shared history and good decision making teaching me that I am safe with him.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 35

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 10:53:32 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

Icarys, in my last two relationships (3 years as a submissive, 1 year as a slave), I was able to let go and trust and do activities that scared me, that I didn't like or want to do, or that I had previously had difficulty with, fairly early on. There wasn't any struggle against him, only sometimes against myself. Occasionally I needed baby steps, say two or three tries over time before I was able to get where he wanted me to go. To some extent, I did have to be vulnerable and willing to surrender up-front, but it very much was inspired by my interaction with them as specific people. I wasn't actively seeking someone to surrender to, though, I was open to a lot of different possibilities, depending on the interaction with the specific person. I'm one of those "dirty switches" according to your post on page 1, though.

First part is necessary don't you think?

Yes you are and I know that! It was a little tounge in cheek

Of course our ideas of what constitutes surrender are probably at polar opposites. I find that even in a world of weirdos and extremists I am still an odd man out.

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to Andalusite)

Post #: 36

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 11:05:29 AM

Andalusite

Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline

If I hadn't been willing to obey, willing to yield, and be vulnerable, and surrender control, it would have been pointless and even dishonest for me to agree to be someone's submissive or slave. In the first one, I had never been a submissive before, so I really wasn't sure what to expect, and I was very up-front with him about that. I felt that he was ethical, reasonable, trustworthy, and caring, so I was able to develop trust in him fairly quickly. The very idea of opposing his will made me feel distressed, almost to the point of being sick. I very much wanted to do his will, almost as an extension of him.

I've seen some of your other threads, and I didn't have the impression that we have polar opposite views of submission and surrender, but I could be mistaken. I figured the "dirty" part was just teasing, although some people refuse to get involved with switches for various reasons.

(in reply to Icarys)

Post #: 37

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 11:15:23 AM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys
You have to be in a place of surrender before you can surrender.

That would not match my experience. Carol was not in a place of surrender. Because she is submissive by personality rather than relationship orientation, the ability to surrender was built-in. I just had to go digging for it. She fought that digging tooth and nail. For her, she was quite rightly afraid of losing her very self in the process. For me, when I think of "surrender" it is not "do this thing", it is a much more invasive and internal thing.

< Message edited by leadership527 -- 6/12/2010 11:20:22 AM >

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to Icarys)

Post #: 38

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 11:17:14 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

If I hadn't been willing to obey, willing to yield, and be vulnerable, and surrender control, it would have been pointless and even dishonest for me to agree to be someone's submissive or slave. In the first one, I had never been a submissive before, so I really wasn't sure what to expect, and I was very up-front with him about that. I felt that he was ethical, reasonable, trustworthy, and caring, so I was able to develop trust in him fairly quickly. The very idea of opposing his will made me feel distressed, almost to the point of being sick. I very much wanted to do his will, almost as an extension of him.

I've seen some of your other threads, and I didn't have the impression that we have polar opposite views of submission and surrender, but I could be mistaken. I figured the "dirty" part was just teasing, although some people refuse to get involved with switches for various reasons.

I'm sure more than a few will read those first few lines and think..."Well I'm willing to obey" and so on yet I caution that those who would think that ask themselves do their actions line up with those words? Here's another place where it's just not good enough to say the words without action backing it up.

I've met enough females to know that my ideas may be a tad "over the top" although I think there right in-line with what I need them to be. After reading your post..Who knows..we might have a few similar views..I guess it's bound to happen

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to Andalusite)

Post #: 39

RE: letting go - 6/12/2010 11:26:56 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys
You have to be in a place of surrender before you can surrender.

That would not match my experience. Carol was not in a place of surrender. Because she is submissive by personality rather than relationship orientation, the ability to surrender was built-in. I just had to go digging for it. She fought that digging tooth and nail.

I'm betting your idea of her fighting tooth and nail wouldn't match mine either, Jeff.

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 40

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