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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:27:40 AM

Plasticine

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Cheers.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:29:12 AM

Plasticine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: marie2
Your "information" was horseshit. You did nothing but squirm around like a cold and dying sperm on someone's ass cheek.

Well at least you have a way with words.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:29:32 AM

brainiacsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Whiplashsmile4

quote:

ORIGINAL: brainiacsub
The very definition of Christian doctrine was determined by the Nicene Creed in about 300? 400? or so AD.

An unfortunate outcome of truely Bible proportions occured, the Ecumenical Council was correct in doing what again?

I never said their conclusions were correct. But historically, if you look at why the council was convened to begin with, was because Christianity consisted of so many varied and fractured belief systems that geo-political unity and prestige could not be achieved without some unifying purpose. Religion has always been a tool of geo-politics throughout history. Christianity has remained a very formidable force in the world since the Nicene Creed was adopted because it stabilized and unified the disparate groups.

I personally have no dog in this hunt. I could care less if Christianity becomes diluted by all the competing definitions and doctrines and scattered to the four corners of the earth. But for the purpose of these kinds of discussions, it helps to have a common understanding of the faith, one that 90% of the people reading this can agree on. People arguing fringe definitions aren't seeking clarity - the argument itself becomes the payoff. I have no interest in going there.

< Message edited by brainiacsub -- 6/22/2010 11:57:07 AM >

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:29:50 AM

tazzygirl

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Come on, keep attacking. Show me what a big man you are!

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:32:39 AM

marie2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Plasticine

quote:

ORIGINAL: marie2
Your "information" was horseshit. You did nothing but squirm around like a cold and dying sperm on someone's ass cheek.

Well at least you have a way with words.

:::takes a bow:::

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:37:04 AM

Jeffff

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Cold dieing gollywog......... but I digress.

A thread with this much warmth is certainly what the Gods would want.

The Old Norse Gods that is.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:38:11 AM

domiguy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

our logic falls apart because you believe that anyone can redefine the terms to fit their own belief system. That isn't how it works. You can't redefine what a Christian is and then claim to be one. Language would have no meaning at all if everyone did that.

You do realize that new religions come into being all the time.... many of them looking to Jesus for inspiration....

You have made a couple of faulty generalizations about Christianity on this thread already. I would suggest that you educate yourself on the width and breath of these belief systems before dismissing them.... it undercuts your positions...

Unless you do not care to learn about them, and if that is the case it would be best if you didn't debate about the topic

I am 100% on brainiacs side..You are using the extreme minority as if it carried substantial weight...No offense but who cares if the women of Tuvalu don't care for their young or if a small percent of Christians actually worship Jerry Springer?

This is bordering on finding the remote as if it is the ordinary and leading your charge from this vantage point.

It has little traction and I am somewhat surprised.

I previously posed this question to you...Since you lean towards taoism does this make you at all agnostic or an atheist? Just curious?

< Message edited by domiguy -- 6/22/2010 11:49:18 AM >

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:38:57 AM

tazzygirl

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The sadists around here are slipping lately.

~shrugs

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:40:25 AM

marie2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

The sadists around here are slipping lately.

~shrugs

The sadists around here are actually out whipping an ass. The masos are on this thread.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:45:55 AM

tazzygirl

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LOL

true true!!

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:48:17 AM

domiguy

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please don't humor yourselves like you have accomplished anything.

No one here is impressed.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:49:30 AM

brainiacsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: brainiacsub

The definitions you supplied support my claim, not yours. If you have successfully delivered a baby in the past, possibly multiple times, then you are not operating on faith (which means you have no evidence). Your conviction that you can do it again is reasoned belief.

Including this one?

Faith as underlying rationality: In this view, all human knowledge and reason is seen as dependent on faith: faith in our senses, faith in our reason, faith in our memories, and faith in the accounts of events we receive from others. Accordingly, faith is seen as essential to and inseparable from rationality. According to René Descartes, rationality is built first upon the realization of the absolute truth "I think therefore I am", which requires no faith. All other rationalizations are built outward from this realization, and are subject to falsification at any time with the arrival of new evidence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_and_rationality

I have no desire to get in to a semantic debate with you. I had enough of that with Firm already. You are not trying to gain or further understanding. You are just trying to get others to agree with your preconceived ideas. I fail to see what you are trying to accomplish here.

< Message edited by brainiacsub -- 6/22/2010 11:50:14 AM >

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:50:03 AM

tazzygirl

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No one cares if you are impressed. You do realize its not all about you, dont you? I mean, honestly, you do realize that.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:51:50 AM

Plasticine

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quote:

The sadists around here are actually out whipping an ass. The masos are on this thread.

If only the distinction were that easy.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:51:57 AM

juliaoceania

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quote:

I personally have no dog in this hunt. I could care less if Christianity becomes diluted by all the competing definitions and doctrines and scattered to the four corners of the earth. But for the purpose of these kinds of discussions, it helps to have a common understanding of the faith, one that 90% of the people reading this can agree on. People arguing fringe definitions aren't seeking clarity - the argument itself becomes the payoff. I have no interest in going there.

I am one of the people reading this.. and I have a big issue with you reducing other people's belief systems so that you can make your arguments easier...

That is the entire point of this entire thread, it is a strawman to paint those with theism in boxes... and here you are doing it for convenience sake, as if people aren't smart enough to know that there are different ways of being Christian

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:51:59 AM

tazzygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: brainiacsub

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: brainiacsub

The definitions you supplied support my claim, not yours. If you have successfully delivered a baby in the past, possibly multiple times, then you are not operating on faith (which means you have no evidence). Your conviction that you can do it again is reasoned belief.

Including this one?

Faith as underlying rationality: In this view, all human knowledge and reason is seen as dependent on faith: faith in our senses, faith in our reason, faith in our memories, and faith in the accounts of events we receive from others. Accordingly, faith is seen as essential to and inseparable from rationality. According to René Descartes, rationality is built first upon the realization of the absolute truth "I think therefore I am", which requires no faith. All other rationalizations are built outward from this realization, and are subject to falsification at any time with the arrival of new evidence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith_and_rationality

I have no desire to get in to a semantic debate with you. I had enough of that with Firm already. You are not trying to gain or further understanding. You are just trying to get others to agree with your preconceived ideas. I fail to see what you are trying to accomplish here.

And you are assuming yet again. If you look at past religion threads that i have posted on you will notice a huge shift in my thinking on this topic. I tried to gain more understanding today, and i actually believe i have in some aspects. You could also learn a few things from this thread as well, brainiac.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to brainiacsub)

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:52:54 AM

brainiacsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

And the definition of Christianity is someone who follows the teachings of Jesus.

No. Look it up.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:55:35 AM

Whiplashsmile4

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I'm passing around the Marshmellows and sticks, who wants to join in the paganistic ritual of strawman burning? Beer is in the cooler, hot dogs and hambers are on the grill.

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:57:33 AM

juliaoceania

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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

our logic falls apart because you believe that anyone can redefine the terms to fit their own belief system. That isn't how it works. You can't redefine what a Christian is and then claim to be one. Language would have no meaning at all if everyone did that.

You do realize that new religions come into being all the time.... many of them looking to Jesus for inspiration....

You have made a couple of faulty generalizations about Christianity on this thread already. I would suggest that you educate yourself on the width and breath of these belief systems before dismissing them.... it undercuts your positions...

Unless you do not care to learn about them, and if that is the case it would be best if you didn't debate about the topic

I am 100% on brainiacs side..You are using the extreme minority as if it carried substantial weight...No offense but who cares if the women of Tuvalu don't care for their young or if a small percent of Christians actually worship Jerry Springer?

This is bordering on finding the remote as if it is the ordinary and leading your charge from this vantage point.

It has little traction and I am somewhat surprised.

I previously posed this question to you...Since you lean towards taoism does this make you at all agnostic or an atheist? Just curious?

I have Unitarian friends. I have went to Unitarian church. It is actually a fairly popular form of Christianity.....I do not see this as obscure....

There are many people who call themselves "christian" yet they do not have any church they go to at all....

I think this is fairly mainstream concept for those who are Christian, and one that most Christians understand. I was raised to believe in the Bible, but we did not go to church... and I don't appreciate reducing people's beliefs for the ease of argument...

I answered the agnostic question earlier in the thread

http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=3271671

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

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RE: Why do people think it's ok to strawman an atheist? - 6/22/2010 11:57:57 AM

marie2

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