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RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 2:09:34 AM   
ExSteelAgain


Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline 		The best aftercare is to let her suck your cock until she feels better.

Okay, seriously, it is a bonding time and giving after care is something I enjoy.

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RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 2:14:44 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lizi

The OP is posting about a man that she is involved with in a day to day relationship who regularly leaves her wanting while being aware of her needs because he doesn't feel like putting himself out for her. At the objective end of the spectrum I'd call that a basic relationship mismatch...which I did. At the subjective end I'd call the guy a dickhead for the dichotomy of having an ongoing relationship as opposed to something casual, and not being willing to put in some extra effort to ensure his partner is being taken care of. It doesn't seem to me that willful negligence is in the same category of people making mistakes nor is anyone who makes a genuine mistake a dickhead.


lizi, I'm going to disagree with you.  I would not call him a dickhead for not meeting a serious need.  I would however call him one for weaseling out of doing it by telling her that it'll happen next time - and, oh, let's see if we can get you to not need it.

Not meeting a need --> bad communication.
Lying and making promises that are not intended for keeping ---> dickhead


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RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 2:33:41 AM   
crazyml


Posts: 5568
Joined: 7/3/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jujubeeMB

London, huh? It rained the whole time I was there


Sheesh, you had to bring up the weather.

Honestly, some people are just impossible to please.


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Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 4:24:32 AM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline 		so, im trying to imagine this and parrallel it with something i went through.

my ex Master floored me once, totally annihilated me, i became a drivelling, snivelling mess, though im not an emotional massochist and would normally avoid anything like that, he was doing it for my own good on something.  so it wasnt a scene, but it left me in a mess.  now...,

this is the part im trying to imagine.  had he just got up and walked away leaving me in that bad place i would not have benefitted from what happened at all, i would have started to feel i might need to protect myself from him over any other issue he decided to take me to task on.  so thats a risk right there for the OP, i would imagine in time she would need to start holding back on herself, i know i would.

instead he talked me down, reassured me afterwards and though it wasnt aftercare, he did make sure i came out of it in a positive way.

aftercare for me doesnt need to involve hugs and cuddles but niether do i want to be walked away from completely.  its ranged from talking to me, to wrapping me up in a blanket or just curling up on the bed or sofa afterwards together.  nothing overt but definitely not completely absent.  after a few minutes im back to fine anyway.

clearly OP, and from what some others have said, youre Dom is in his own headspace afterwards and his headspace isnt about aftercare.  so you have a disparity probably more than anything else.  i dont think you should earn aftercare, if he's capable of providing it if youve earned it then its a bit contradictory of him anyway.



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Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 6:01:21 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		I'm not going to say he's an ass for not wanting to give aftercare. I will say he's dishonest. You've talked about what you need and he's agreed but still won't do it. He's told you he doesn't want to do it and wants you to not need it. But you do and he knows it. And worst of all, he should have told you on the first meet, the coffee one, that there would be no aftercare, that you had to put yourself back together by yourself no matter what. He didn't do that because he knew you wouldn't meet him again if he had been honest. So he lied. And he's still lying.

He hasn't said that you two are incompatible on this issue because he isn't going to change. What he's done is prevent you from finding someone compatible by lying to you, by claiming he will do it next time. He isn't and by now you know that.

Wish him good luck and move on. As to finding someone else who does exactly what this guy does? I hope you don't. You shouldn't go out there saying you want someone just like your ex. You shouldn't tell the next guy that he doesn't do it the way your ex did. You should take time to heal and to mourn this relationship and then go meet people. And when you meet someone wonderful you'll find that with him you'll crave what he prefers to do the same way you've learned to crave what this guy prefers to do.


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Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 6:10:17 AM   
VirginPotty


Posts: 11624
Joined: 7/16/2008
From: Virginville
Status: offline 		I can take it or leave it.  When it is provided it's pretty simple, cuddling real close & he'll caress my back but I'm not big on cuddling so after a short while I'm ready to just move away & go to sleep! I love it when he leaves.....I get the bed to myself!

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RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 6:42:07 AM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jujubeeMB

quote:

ORIGINAL: AQuietSimpleMan
Also if you read what I DO do as aftercare, I wonder if you would still be saying what you are, I am just not there to coddle someone for hours, I have me to take care of as well and ignoring my space to over indulge hers leave to a very unstable mental state for the TOP in this situation, or are you one of those people who ignores the TOP as being alowed to have needs?


Maybe I can help clarify a little. I'm looking for like 10-30 minutes of aftercare from my Dom. I never need care in the middle of play, and I am a firm believer that Doms should be cared for (or take care of themselves) as well. So... stop yelling at LafayetteLady


You don't have to justify yourself to him or anyone else. You're the one asking questions here. You've described feeling sub drop if you don't get aftercare. Stop trying to figure out a way around this. There isn't one, this is something you need.

For me personally, I need aftercare. The presumption that people are making here that one type of play doesn't versus another is just silly. It's very individual and depends on how you deal with any of them physically and psychologically. The presumption that S&M play isn't psychological is also silly. It can be very psychological depending on whom is doing it and what they are doing.

Like you, if I don't get aftercare, including basic necesities, water, food, etc. as well as TLC, I will feel very badly for at least a day afterwards, maybe more depending on what the play was.

To expect to be able to really degrade someone then walk away is just ridiculous in my opinion. It would be a dealbreaker for me and has been in the past. I guess I would really try to talk to him again with any hesitation that this is something you absolutely need and cannot compromise on.

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RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 8:00:14 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

Domspace need Threads, mostly because most Dom's don't see it as something they need, I agree that I am slightly different in that respect.


Maybe that is because they are in the position to demand it from their subs...maybe submissive sorts are more reliant on the dominant sort to identify that as a need. If my former lover wanted something, he took it, there was no need to complain about what he wasn't getting

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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 8:01:39 AM   
Jeffff


Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline 		Dom space = nap

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RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 8:45:36 AM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jujubeeMB

Ok, been in Europe not thinking about D/s for a couple of months, but I'm back and this one is making me crazy:

How do people feel about aftercare? I do a lot of very intense psychological stuff with my Dom, and while during play I feel like the luckiest, most incredibly blissful person on the planet, when I don't get a good "it's ok, I care about you. Come back to yourself" session afterward, I wind up feeling god awful. My Dom agrees that we need to find aftercare that works for me, but so far I can never get him to do it, and in trying to I wind up feeling obnoxious and needy and whiny on top of my already pretty crappy feeling. He has also lightly suggested that over time he'd like to change my psyche so that I don't need it as much, and that perhaps I could "earn" or "lose" aftercare by being particularly good or bad. Those ideas leave me a bit taken aback.

Are there any Doms out there who do NOT like to do aftercare? Are there any subs who desperately need it but have had to stifle the need because their Dom wanted them to "get over it"? Everyone else - do you need aftercare? Do you loathe aftercare? Think it's silly? Love it?

Inquiring minds want to know.


I'm a big proponent of *on-going* care and I don't experience what I gather is subdrop for many. I do my hysterical laughing or crying (sometimes both at the same time) just like a lot of others who are experiencing the endorphin drop/chemical change that takes place but the on-going care I receive, the frequent affirmations of his desire for me to be in his life are, mostly, all the care I need. I do, however, need physical wound care on occasion since he likes my backside better than my front side and I can't reach those areas. If he didn't take care of the wounds he created, I'd have a problem with that.. as *that* would show me he didn't care about his property being damaged. I don't need cuddles and kisses after a scene nor any sort of validation that I'm not a useless piece of meat because I get those sorts of things a lot.. a whole lot and that is very important for the health of our relationship. Just the way it works for us. We're very lucky. We get to live together, love together, laugh and play together and provide that on-going care to one another so that heavy scenes, physical or mental are just enjoyed for what they are and then they are done. He knows that I love, respect and appreciate him.. he knows I don't think he's a monster for the things he likes to do to me and I let him know just how much I enjoy it and appreciate it.. so, he doesn't need much after care either although he also needs physical care once in a while especially as he has some health issues. Overall, after a heavy physical scene, he needs a hell of a lot more care than I do and as I am almost always energized by play rather than exhausted by it, I'm in a better position to take care of him than he is to take care of me anyway.

I hope that you can get some on-going care one way or another and that if you do it will make a difference in how you feel after intense play. Best of luck to you.






< Message edited by BitaTruble -- 7/1/2010 8:46:40 AM >

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RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 9:10:38 AM   
jujubeeMB


Posts: 723
Joined: 1/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ExSteelAgain

The best aftercare is to let her suck your cock until she feels better.



Know what's funny? He suggested that. I think he was 50% kidding.

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Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 9:16:38 AM   
jujubeeMB


Posts: 723
Joined: 1/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

Domspace need Threads, mostly because most Dom's don't see it as something they need, I agree that I am slightly different in that respect.


Maybe that is because they are in the position to demand it from their subs...maybe submissive sorts are more reliant on the dominant sort to identify that as a need. If my former lover wanted something, he took it, there was no need to complain about what he wasn't getting


This is completely true. My Dom actually said to me recently that he was in no mental condition to want to take care of me right after an intense play session - that what he needed was to go off and be on his own. What it seems like to me is that he wants to prolong what he's just gotten for as long as he can before I start getting upset (a day later) and he has to start being sort of nicer. He definitely doesn't willingly come down from the position he likes to be in - I think he wants me to just bounce from intensive play session to intensive play session and stay down in subspace in between.

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Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 9:46:21 AM   
ItsAProcess


Posts: 62
Joined: 3/29/2006
Status: offline 		I agree with AQuiet in the fact that the idea that Aftercare is something only a Submissive needs is wrong. I've known Dominants who needed their own form of it. And now and again I find myself needing reassurance that I have not gone too far and taken advantage of her deep subspace and thus done damage because of my own sadistic tendencies.

But personally I find the idea of having to 'earn' aftercare. Or the statement that any aftercare beyond a short period of time is simply a Submissive being whiny makes my skin crawl. I have before, and will in the future provide aftercare for as long as it is needed to ensure my girl is in a stable and happy mental and emotional state. In every instance where I and a partner have engaged in deep, or dark psychological play I've fond that Aftercare is not only a good thing, but a necessity.

Personally I believe that Doms who don't like to give aftercare are still stuck in the mindset of Men Don't Show Their Soft Emotions! That somehow being able to express the parts of you which are anything but strong/controlling/fierce makes you weaker. That, or they're simply selfish.

I also happen to know, /know/ for a fact that if I refused to give aftercare to my girl after our sessions she would likely end up emotionally unstable. Simply because she is deeply emotionally tied to me. It would ruin what is otherwise a fantastic relationship. I enjoy being able to give her reassurance that I still love her, still care for her, even if she is my dirty little whore. But even if I did not enjoy that prospect if it came to a choice between being kind and reassuring to her or Losing her, let alone /harming/ her?  I'd still side with Aftercare every time.

My girl is still relatively new to her submission.Thus she is still having some trouble accepting that I can call her a whole host of normally degrading, insulting names and still find her just as attractive. Still enjoy her just as much. If I took her into deep subspace and then refused to give her aftercare? It would literally do her harm.

I refuse to harm someone whom has entrusted their emotional and physical wellbeing to my whims. Such is a betrayal of the ultimate creed. And quite frankly I don't think I could Trust any Dom who stated with certainty that Aftercare was /not/ something they would do. I'd be wary of letting my girl near them.

But then, I'm a protective, possessive bastard as is.

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Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 9:56:35 AM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AQuietSimpleMan

LL,

Main Entry: hyp·o·crite
Pronunciation: \ˈhi-pə-ˌkrit\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English ypocrite, from Anglo-French, from Late Latin hypocrita, from Greek hypokritēs actor, hypocrite, from hypokrinesthai
Date: 13th century
1 : a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion
2 : a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings

— hypocrite adjective

To suggest that a persons need for aftercare should be addressed, but that my needs are not as important is Hypocritical.

jujubee you have mail hopefully you will be able to see past your nose to see how I feel. It is obvious that she won't.

QSM



Well, isn't it nice that you know how to look up a definition. Now please point out where I ever said that your needs are not as important. Did I comment on the fact that you are more concerned with YOUR needs than your bottom's? Yep. But did I, or anyone else, ever say the dominant's needs were less important? No.

What I did say is that in a relationship, there are times when one person's needs must supercede the other's. To the extreme, when you are very into a sadistic scene and purely by accident, you cause a serious injury, your need to continue the scene or "come down" from your head space becomes quite irrelevant because the safety of your partner must be addressed first.

You obviously will find a way to argue about that as well, but that's the way life works. Continue to present the concept that as the dominant/top/sadist/master or whatever you choose to identify yourself, it is all about you and everyone involved in nothing but objects for your enjoyment. Life doesn't successfully work that way.

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 9:56:58 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jujubeeMB

What it seems like to me is that he wants to prolong what he's just gotten for as long as he can before I start getting upset (a day later) and he has to start being sort of nicer. He definitely doesn't willingly come down from the position he likes to be in - I think he wants me to just bounce from intensive play session to intensive play session and stay down in subspace in between.


We all come at this from different places. For ME, it isn't about feeling powerful over a woman, I have never felt weak so it isn't a thrill for me to experience power. However, I did not grow up feeling desirable, so feeling desirable IS thrilling. SO, making a woman into less isn't hot for me, tearing her down and leaving her there doesn't do it for me. I need a duality because tearing down is hot but ONLY if I KNOW that that woman is not the worthless little hole I am using her as. Its the fact that the glorious woman before me is so turned on by ME that she becomes a worthless little hole, that my tormenting her cunt with a knife makes her hot is what does it for me.

So, some newbie watching you and your dom playing and me and a partner playing might SEE the same things go on, but the underlying dynamic would be radically different because the motivations underlying that play are radically different.

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Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 10:21:12 AM   
AQuietSimpleMan


Posts: 1410
Joined: 11/15/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady


Now please point out where I ever said that your needs are not as important. Did I comment on the fact that you are more concerned with YOUR needs than your bottom's? Yep. But did I, or anyone else, ever say the dominant's needs were less important? No.


Actually you did by implying that after I have made sure that they are Physically Okay, and have been given water, a blanket, and found to be Physically okay, that I would go and take of me was SELFISH. That was your word. To imply that after checking and making sure she is OKAY that I would want to remove myself to take care of me is Selfish is to imply that one persons needs are more valid or important than anothers. Answer me this? If i am in a BAD head space, or in one where I am not 100% Together, how can I provide accurate Aftercare? Also I address all play scenes for DAYS after, not just the moments directly after a scene. Like I sent to the OP in Private, I do not believe in tearing someone down on the Psycological level that she is, and I don't think anything I could say or do in 20 or 30 minutes could actually rectify that, so I believe it would take days anyway. LL, I think most of the problem here is you are talking about the OP's SPECIFIC situation and I am speaking of what I experience and my point of view, In all honesty I would hope to never be in the situation that the OP is in, I do agree however that the denial of something that has been presented as a NEED is neglectful, and therefore I agree unacceptable.... to me anyway.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

What I did say is that in a relationship, there are times when one person's needs must supercede the other's. To the extreme, when you are very into a sadistic scene and purely by accident, you cause a serious injury, your need to continue the scene or "come down" from your head space becomes quite irrelevant because the safety of your partner must be addressed first.


And my point is that without taking care of myself I am not CAPABLE of taking care of their need at that exact moment. This is the part you are unable to comprehend. What good am I to someone who is floundering if I an still lost in the idea of tearing them down? My Mind is set in that world, it isn't a switch that can be turned off and on it is a mindset and for a Sub as SMART as the OP, if it were as simple as Humiliate call her names then I don;t think it would work for her anyway. I Need to be in the Right Head Space and that does not happen right away.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

You obviously will find a way to argue about that as well, but that's the way life works. Continue to present the concept that as the dominant/top/sadist/master or whatever you choose to identify yourself, it is all about you and everyone involved in nothing but objects for your enjoyment. Life doesn't successfully work that way.


You don't even know me, you have NO IDEA how I am with my partners and yet you have labeled me so easily as to who I am and how I see life.

You don't know about my beliefs beyond the VERY LITTLE I have posted. If you Judge people so EASILY, Friend or not I would suggest the OP get second Opinions about people because you don't need much to damn someone to unworthyness do you?

Seriously what more can you tell me about myself? What other things have you written me of as?

Life, is to the one who experiences it, Your path isn't mine, I take the Path less Traveled by.

QSM

< Message edited by AQuietSimpleMan -- 7/1/2010 10:24:46 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 10:25:14 AM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael


The reality is most of us want some of this, some of that, oh, and a bit of that too. Learning to talk about, explore together, and have the time of your life turning her into a pathetic cum eating hole while running her a bubble bath, bringing her breakfast in bed after having raped her ass takes time to learn.

But it is sure fun when you get there!


This. But of course, and here is the problem, very few people are actually able to understand what you just said. The OP does, that is what she wants, I want and probably of ton of others want.

We understand, but finding a compatible partner who gets it, that one is able to communicate the above to, therein remains the issue.

It is not even about aftercare; it is about relating to someone on multiple levels and understanding that Doms and subs are humans first and all those varying needs/desires can be accomodated with the right person.

< Message edited by sexyred1 -- 7/1/2010 10:26:30 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 10:49:22 AM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline 		First, you have judged me the same way, so you are obviously just as hypocritical as you claim me to be.

Yes, I focus on the OP's specific issue. Why? Because this post isn't about YOU. It is about HER and what SHE needs.

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

What I did say is that in a relationship, there are times when one person's needs must supercede the other's. To the extreme, when you are very into a sadistic scene and purely by accident, you cause a serious injury, your need to continue the scene or "come down" from your head space becomes quite irrelevant because the safety of your partner must be addressed first.

And my point is that without taking care of myself I am not CAPABLE of taking care of their need at that exact moment. This is the part you are unable to comprehend. What good am I to someone who is floundering if I an still lost in the idea of tearing them down? My Mind is set in that world, it isn't a switch that can be turned off and on it is a mindset and for a Sub as SMART as the OP, if it were as simple as Humiliate call her names then I don;t think it would work for her anyway. I Need to be in the Right Head Space and that does not happen right away.


Now see, your response to my example would tell me that you might not be a safe person to play with, because accidents do happen. If you are not able to flip that switch, but need that "time to yourself" to get your head together while your partner lies injured on the floor (the example I gave), you are not able to protect your partner from harm because you can't get your head together fast enough in case of an accident to do what needs to be done. I completely comprehend what you are saying. I just think it is shitty. Grow up and deal with it.

I used to make my living by being able to quickly read people and make a determination about who they are, and I was quite successful at it. I said you would find a way to argue with me some more and I was correct in that "assumption."

There are many paths "less traveled by." I make my judgements based on the response to an OP. Your first response was that her needs were silly and whiney bullshit. NOW, you want to backpeddle and say how you don't get involved in the kind of play she does and admit that the care she is seeking would be necessary and you would be incapable of doing it. But that doesn't negate your first statement where you basically negate her needs and whine how no one cares about a "dom's needs" being met.

(in reply to AQuietSimpleMan)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 10:53:13 AM   
ModTwentyOne


Posts: 2504
Status: offline 		Let's try to focus on the OP and her situation in this thread.  If someone wants to start a "Doms need aftercare" thread, that is certainly up to them.

Thanks.

ModTwentyOne


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Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Aftercare - 7/1/2010 11:02:37 AM   
AQuietSimpleMan


Posts: 1410
Joined: 11/15/2009
Status: offline 		LafayetteLady,

You do not Read what is written you decide for yourself what is Ment.

This Original Post was about AFTERCARE , she asked AND I QUOTE

quote:

Are there any Doms out there who do NOT like to do aftercare? Are there any subs who desperately need it but have had to stifle the need because their Dom wanted them to "get over it"? Everyone else - do you need aftercare? Do you loathe aftercare? Think it's silly? Love it?


The Underlined Portions are what I have been responding to BECAUSE THAT IS THE QUESTION SHE ASKED!!!

YOU have posted about what is SPECIFICALLY going on with the Original Poster because you have inside knowledge, Knowledge that no one else has. You can look down your nose all you want, I was staying on topic not going with the derail of a thread.

As for my being safe to play with, well you are welcome to your opinion, but again you have failed to read my words instead you made up your mind about me and no matter what you are unwilling to let that waiver, Instead you look for reasons to dislike me even if that includes making it up all on your own.

I Said I would not get in this kind of scene because I do not feel a need to tear someone down, I play with Masochists who enjoy pain and THAT is why they play, I have no desire to make a human being feel like Trash, Feel Worthless, Uncared for, because there is enough of that alreadyin the world. I only get involved in scenes where there is Mutual enjoyment, not ones that leave someone Broken on the floor.

And again you don't listen to the fact that I DO make sure they are STABLE, before walking away to take care of me, to get me back together, apparently you are perfect and don't get that involved in your scenes, I do, I install fail safes that work for me, I am there for what is AGREED ON. I am Not there to be a Therapist, I am not there to Psycologically REBUILD someone because although I enjoy Psycology a lot, I am not qualified to deal with what equates to a comeplete break down, or wherever the Op has done to her.

Seriously, paint me how you like, I know me, I know where those in my ward fall, I also know my limitations, Taking someone to such a low level that they require being rebuilt just to be okay isn't a playground I play in.

I Tend to stick to the ones where they get off on being beaten and I get off on beating them.

QSM

_____________________________

Guy Stud =Vs= Girl Slut ~~ Debate ENDED!

"If a Key opens many locks, then it is a Master Key, If a Lock is opened by lots of keys, then it is a Shitty Lock"

(in reply to jujubeeMB)
Profile   Post #: 60
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