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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/12/2010 9:18:19 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

in fact he was examined by a psychologist that says he isn't a pedophile, but never mind that, and never mind that doctors that research pedophilia try to educate people on what pedophilia is and try to keep that word from being inaccurately tossed around


A diagnosis made many, many years ago. Many things have changed, as you pointed out, laws themselves. So has diagnosis criteria. Psychology experts have repeatedly stated that it doesnt require a single incident of actual abuse to be diagnosed as a pedo, a fact you wish to overlook.


They also say that a single action does not make someone a pedophile... yet you seem to avoid that aspect a lot...



So you wish to err on the fact that he had one incident? Can you prove he had only one incident?

~ETA


But even that isnt the point.

He plead guilty. He admitted he did have unlawful sex with a minor, the other 5 counts dropped to gain that one. He could have been done and gone, instead he ran. Thats what this is all about now. A flight from justice. Not any different than someone who slips past the guards in a jail and runs.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 7/12/2010 9:21:41 PM >


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Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/12/2010 9:21:18 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

The charge... flight from justice... can carry its own charge. Think after all this time, if he ever returns, they wont toss the whole bookcase at him?



you do not have to agree with me, it is nice that the world works that way, but there is room for disagreement here....

I don't want him back in California. I don't believe him to be a threat. I do not want to release other people to house his ass....I live here, you don't. I am the one that may pay the ultimate price for the fact they might let some seriously dangerous mutha out to make room for him. Our jails are overcrowded, we have no room for elderly sex offenders in France that there is no evidence of their re-offending... Most data shows that the older the sex offender, the less likely they are to offend. He is not a risky person in my mind. The French want him, they can babysit his ass, i don't want to.


_____________________________

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(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/12/2010 9:24:46 PM   
tazzygirl


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Yes, lets return to yesteryear when women were considered to have "asked for it". As Whoopi said.. it wasnt rape-rape.

My stance is that he is a flight from our justice system and that never should be tolerated on any level.

Make of that what you wish, julia. But, in my mind, you are advocating the dismissal of charges against a man who raped a 13 year old girl.

That says alot about you.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/12/2010 10:11:44 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Yes, lets return to yesteryear when women were considered to have "asked for it". As Whoopi said.. it wasnt rape-rape.

My stance is that he is a flight from our justice system and that never should be tolerated on any level.

Make of that what you wish, julia. But, in my mind, you are advocating the dismissal of charges against a man who raped a 13 year old girl.

That says alot about you.


It says a lot about you that you are creating strawmen out of this and painting me as having positions I do not hold... Go you tazzy!

Seriously, that says a lot about you...

Opinions are permissible in this world, and not everyone will agree with you, demonizing someone for disagreeing with you is something I have seen you do more than once... if that is what you reduce a discussion to in the real world, you must be a lonely person

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/12/2010 10:23:29 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

It says a lot about you that you are creating strawmen out of this and painting me as having positions I do not hold... Go you tazzy!

Seriously, that says a lot about you...


Just following in your footsteps dear.

If you dont like it happening to you, dont do it yourself.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/12/2010 10:38:42 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

It says a lot about you that you are creating strawmen out of this and painting me as having positions I do not hold... Go you tazzy!

Seriously, that says a lot about you...


Just following in your footsteps dear.

If you dont like it happening to you, dont do it yourself.


Hmmmmm..... are you still posting on those religion threads, doing this?


Like I said, I was presenting an opinion that did not agree with yours, if that is reason enough to attack me personally, which you have done several times on this thread... go to it!

I will not be posting to you on this thread, Tazzy, so next post you can have the last word, it seems to be very important to you....

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/12/2010 10:49:26 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

This girl was past puberty, now you want to re-argue this, fine


You have no proof she was past puberty, yet you insist she was.

quote:

I think that anytime we lump the prepubescent with children the waters get muddied.


Yet you also say she was prepubescent.. which is it?

quote:

The person in this case was past puberty, no matter what the legal definition is, she was not prepubescent. Now you can try to throw out every definition of this that you can muster, but it does not support him being what researchers call a "true pedophile", which is someone that has ideations of romantic relationships with prepubescent kids... targets them, etc....


Puberty can begin at age 12.. for some, as young as age nine, in rare cases, as young as age 5. That doesnt mean they are past puberty, it means that is when the process begins.

quote:

If you were really worried about your daughters you would be checking megan's list and worrying about what you find out about in your own backyard instead of fearing a man that is afraid to come back here for a 3 month sentence


You assume i dont check. Another starwman argument on your behalf.

quote:

go to Megan's list and type in your zip and see what I mean


Again, you assume facts not in evidence.

quote:

Go to Megan's list and worry... that is what concerns me, not some old pervert that is in another country who has never committed another sex crime


And yet again more assumptions.

quote:

Like I said, I would recommend you invest this much passion into keeping sex criminals in prison in this country... you would have a cheerleader in me if you were advocating that.


Again, more assumptions.

quote:

His victim doesn't want him to do one more day, but you already said you don't care about that...

You do not speak for all "victims"


Again, victims dont have a say. a domestic violence conviction doesnt require the cooperation of the victim, only the police officers.

quote:

Is that how you would feel if she wanted his balls on a platter? I bet if she wanted "justice" you would be saying something very different about her opinion, but since it does not agree with yours, you have discounted it. I believe that a victim should have a right to have their opinion heard and respected, whether they want to throw away the key, or they want leniency.


Nothing i ever stated, in any posting, nor anything i have ever felt. But you sure want others to believe this because it makes your argument stronger. A bit more strawmanning here by you, dear.

quote:

So you don't care what the actual victim feels about this, only how you feel, gotcha


Again, something i never once said.

quote:

in fact he was examined by a psychologist that says he isn't a pedophile, but never mind that, and never mind that doctors that research pedophilia try to educate people on what pedophilia is and try to keep that word from being inaccurately tossed around


You posted a Wiki article, i posted a psychiatric journal... and the two definitely did not agree. Sorry, i tend to believe the experts on such matters.

I dont need the last word, dear. Your posts above stands for themselves and you have proven your ability to strawman an argument quite effectively.

But, if you were hoping that i would run away and hide from the big bad julia,like you try to do to so many others, think again.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 9:06:00 AM   
slvemike4u


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It is beyond rediculous that dollar one of public money has been spent in trying to return this old man to the juristicion of California.
The Swiss were correct in their judgement.....extradition at this point in time serves no purpose.

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Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 9:11:58 AM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

It is beyond rediculous that dollar one of public money has been spent in trying to return this old man to the juristicion of California.
The Swiss were correct in their judgement.....extradition at this point in time serves no purpose.


I totally agree it would be a waste of time and money. That said I can't believe there are posters who think it ok to drug and rape a 13 yr old and try to defend that position by pointing out that some 13 yr olds have large boobs and look older. WTF


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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 9:24:02 AM   
slvemike4u


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I'm certainly not taking,nor defending that position boi.....but as a parent I am curious as to why the mother who served this young girl up to Polanski wasn't prosecuted for her crime.
Why do the parents who place their children at the disposal of the rich and seriously fucked up get a free pass....and in some cases(see Michael Jackson) a hefty payday?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 11:20:42 AM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

It is beyond rediculous that dollar one of public money has been spent in trying to return this old man to the juristicion of California.
The Swiss were correct in their judgement.....extradition at this point in time serves no purpose.


I believe their are some crimes that money and time should not be considered...and crimes against children are one. Old men abuse children as well as young ones. Now please explain why you think extradition would serve no purpose? Is justice just for the young and poor?

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Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 11:22:48 AM   
DCWoody


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

It is beyond rediculous that dollar one of public money has been spent in trying to return this old man to the juristicion of California.
The Swiss were correct in their judgement.....extradition at this point in time serves no purpose.


I totally agree it would be a waste of time and money. That said I can't believe there are posters who think it ok to drug and rape a 13 yr old and try to defend that position by pointing out that some 13 yr olds have large boobs and look older. WTF




No-one is defending it. The point made is that describing all underaged sex as paedophilia is inaccurate and extremely unhelpful, and certainly doesn't apply in this case. Not all sex crimes are paedophilic.

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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 11:30:49 AM   
DCWoody


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Re extradion serving no purpose: The current situation is that he can't come into the usa....and doesn't dare visit a few other nations either. If he was extradited he'd possibly serve 48 (or whatever) days in prison, and then be free. According to the article he then be asked to voluntarily recuse himself from visiting the us, but given his ignoring the wishes of the usa justice system so far, and his substantial film career...you can't be anywhere near certain he'd take that offer up.

I don't personally think it would serve no purpose, if (and it seems a fairly big if) he really didn't complete his sentence..then it's the principle of the thing, he should be brought to justice.....but, the idea that it's better to have him as now, unable to enter the usa, than have him serve a short stint then be free to roam...is a legitimate viewpoint.

Although the apparent unlikelyhood of him reoffending makes it a fairly paranoid one in my view, if he were able to enter my nation again (UK has strong deportation agreement with usa)...I really wouldn't worry about him being any kind of a threat.

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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 11:31:28 AM   
kdsub


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The definition of pedophilia is not important don't you think... I mean the crime says it all...he raped a 13 year old...Why do you think there should be a time limit on prosecution?

So do believe capital crimes should be forgiven without restitution just because time has passed? I mean it’s not like no one tried to get him extradited before.

Butch



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Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 11:33:46 AM   
DCWoody


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

The definition of pedophilia is not important don't you think... I mean the crime says it all...he raped a 13 year old...Why do you think there should be a time limit on prosecution?

So do believe capital crimes should be forgiven without restitution just because time has passed? I mean it’s not like no one tried to get him extradited before.

Butch




I don't think there should be a time limit on prosecution, I DO think the defintion of paedophilia is very important.

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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 11:58:10 AM   
BitaTruble


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


They also say that a single action does not make someone a pedophile... yet you seem to avoid that aspect a lot...



quote:

So you wish to err on the fact that he had one incident? Can you prove he had only one incident?

~ETA




He also had a sexual relationship with Natassja Kinski when she was 15 (he was 40 to 45 or so at the time) but in Germany, while it is a crime, the authorities will not prosecute unless the minor presses charges which Kinski didn't.

edited to fix quotes

< Message edited by BitaTruble -- 7/13/2010 12:00:07 PM >


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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 12:25:37 PM   
kdsub


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Why is it important?...Is it not enough he drugged and raped someone...hell forget his age...forget her age. There are 35 pages of her testimony you should read it. I can’t tell you how many times she asked him to take her home and leave her alone...over and over she said stop even as he decided to butt fuck her because he did not want a baby.

One more point... you think there is no purpose to come back a serve a few days... Well he knows and I'm sure his attorneys have told him that fleeing is a crime in itself... The sentence could be changed and he could be made to serve the full extent of the allowed sentence for rape.

At least I'll bet that is a wonderful possibility.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 7/13/2010 12:32:06 PM >


_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 12:56:42 PM   
calamitysandra


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

... That said I can't believe there are posters who think it ok to drug and rape a 13 yr old and try to defend that position by pointing out that some 13 yr olds have large boobs and look older. WTF



The Fuck?

From what post did you come away with this?

Nobody, absolutely nobody argued that what he did was O.K. . He did drug and rape a 13 year old girl. And that is disgusting, no what or if about it. The only thing argued about was the applicability of the label pedophile.

However, his crime did not carry the hallmarks of a pedophile act. Pedophilia is the sexual attraction to prepubescent children. Looking at the pictures of his victim it is pretty clear that she had already entered puberty, even if it is not easy to ascertain how far into puberty she was. Onset of puberty renders a victim spoiled goods to a pedophile.

He is a disgusting, vile, rapist slimebag, and as I see it, that is enough. Is it necessary to tag pedophile on also? Is rape alone no longer terrible enough?


Now, while I would love to see him serve a just sentence, I will concede that it would most likely be a waste of time and money that should better be spent elsewhere.
It is disgusting how he is still adulated, how excuses are made for him. He should be ostracized, not be fawned over.


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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 1:01:40 PM   
domiguy


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She wanted it.

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RE: Lousy Swiss…dumb assed French - 7/13/2010 2:17:34 PM   
DCWoody


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"Why is it important?...Is it not enough he drugged and raped someone...hell forget his age...forget her age."

That is my point. Tazzy is/was shouting paedo paedo earlier on in the thread, which is why that came into it.

"One more point... you think there is no purpose to come back a serve a few days... "

No, you've misunderstood me.....I just said that the viewpoint expressed by others:that it's better to leave him where he is, is entirely logical, if a little paranoid....but is NOT my viewpoint.

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 100
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