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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 4:26:43 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

Mormons have their own books, The Book of Mormon and the Pearl of Great Price, and believe that those books are primary over the Bible in the event of conflicts.
i don't want to start a debate about Mormonism vs Christianity vs Judaism...but i thought the Mormons followed the Old Testament as do Jews, but then add the teachings of Joseph Smith?

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 4:58:50 AM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

As usual Beck is full of shit...Romans killed him (assuming the story in the Bible is correct).


What I don't understand is why people get so worked up about it. Anyone who believes he died for our sins should understand that in order for him to die, someone else had to kill him. What difference does it make if it was the Romans or the Jews. It was all part of the plan and "Jesus was acquitted for my sins" just doesn't have the same ring to it.  If they don't believe in the bible then who the fuck cares who killed some random carpenter 2000 years ago. Personally I think people use it, to justify their hatred toward others.


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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 5:00:31 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

As usual Beck is full of shit...Romans killed him (assuming the story in the Bible is correct).


What I don't understand is why people get so worked up about it. Anyone who believes he died for our sins should understand that in order for him to die, someone else had to kill him. What difference does it make if it was the Romans or the Jews. It was all part of the plan and "Jesus was acquitted for my sins" just doesn't have the same ring to it.  If they don't believe in the bible then who the fuck cares who killed some random carpenter 2000 years ago. Personally I think people use it, to justify their hatred toward others.

GEEZ......do i agree with this!!!!!!!


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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 8:10:42 AM   
vincentML


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quote:

Personally I think people use it, to justify their hatred toward others.


Yes, there is a lot of truth in what you say. Unfortunately, it is only a half truth because of your use of the generic word "people." Unintentionally, I presume, or maybe because you don't know the truth of the matter, you gloss over the history of the persecution of the Jews by the Christian Church and so absolve it from its crimes. We were all taught about the Jews of Spain who were forced to convert or emmigrate.

That was not a one off, however. There were many pogroms against the Jews by Christians especially in medieval times, and the charge of deicide has run the course of the history of Christianity. The first Jewish ghetto was constructed by Pope Paul IV in the 16th Century near the foot of Vatican Hill on the Tiber River. The Jews lived in misery in that walled enclosure, required to wear an identifying patch on their clothing, forced to attend lectures by Churchmen and coerced into baptism.

"In 1543, Martin Luther wrote On the Jews and Their Lies, a treatise in which he advocated harsh persecution of the Jewish people, up to what are now called pogroms. He advocated that their synagogues and schools be set on fire, their prayer books destroyed, rabbis forbidden to preach, homes razed, and property and money confiscated."

Throughout the history of Christian Europe most occupations were proscribed to Jews. The seeds of the Twentieth Century Holocaust were planted in the long persecution of the Jews by the Christians. That's why, to answer your first question, people get so worked up about it.

quote:

What I don't understand is why people get so worked up about it.


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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 8:59:07 AM   
rfd1


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Status: offline 		1 Thessalonians 2:14-15  14For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews:  15Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 10:40:34 AM   
thornhappy


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Status: offline 		You do realize that those letters were written well after Christ's death, and there was a major pissing contest going on between those that held to the Judaic laws ("Judaizers") vs those who said you didn't have to keep to those laws?  The "trial" didn't even conform to Jewish law:

"Jewish laws on capital trials are found in texts almost two centuries after the death of Jesus (M. Sanh. 4-11), so it is not known whether they reflect first-century practice. By these norms the trial in Mark is not legal, since according to the Mishnah capital trials could not be held at night or on the eve of a Sabbath or feast day (M. Sanh. 4:1). The sentence of death could not be pronounced on the same day as the trial (M. Sanh. 4:1); prior examination of witnesses, as well as independent agreement of their testimony, was required (M. Sanh. 4:5; cf. Deut. 19:15-18); the charge of blasphemy required the explicit pronouncing of the divine name (M. Sanh. 7:5); and trials were to be held in the official chamber, not in the house of the high priest (M. Sanh. 11:2; cf. Mark 14:54). Also uncertain is whether the Sanhedrin had the power to execute for capital offenses during Roman occupation (see John 18:31). If so, Jesus should have been stoned, which was the Jewish penalty for blasphemy."

This came off Usenet, but I've got the same material in hard copy from another source.

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 10:47:04 AM   
DomYngBlk


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Status: offline 		All the booze and drugs killed his brain cells. Yet, a millionaire, only in america

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 10:54:44 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

All the booze and drugs killed his brain cells. Yet, a millionaire, only in america
huh?

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 10:58:44 AM   
DomYngBlk


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Status: offline 		Glenn boy has been in rehab a plenty. Sort of a theme with these born again right wing talkers. Limbaugh is just as bad.

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 11:01:24 AM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		He is ,I think, referring to Beck......not Jesus,who as far a I know was never purported to be an alcoholic,nor  a drug abuser.

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 11:03:52 AM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		Oops,DYB answered before I posted....but once again my reading of this situation was spot on.What a burden it is having to explain all of this shit to all of you folks .

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 11:04:11 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

He is ,I think, referring to Beck......not Jesus,who as far a I know was never purported to be an alcoholic,nor  a drug abuser.
I do enjoy believing he smoked a bowl or 3 in his time though.

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 11:09:55 AM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		Of what ?....I myself have "smoked a bowl or 3" in my time.....not always the same substance in the bowl.So many choices....so little time

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 12:15:09 PM   
thishereboi


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Status: offline 		So christians aren't people? I hate to break this to you sparky, when you are trying so hard to appear superior, but there are assholes in every religion. There are even some that are atheists. No one has a monopoly on hate.

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 12:16:28 PM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

Glenn boy has been in rehab a plenty. Sort of a theme with these born again right wing talkers. Limbaugh is just as bad.


Do you hate everyone who has ever fallen victim to drug addiction, or is just the right wingers?


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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 12:17:31 PM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

He is ,I think, referring to Beck......not Jesus,who as far a I know was never purported to be an alcoholic,nor  a drug abuser.


Oh I don't know, there was that whole turning water into wine thing. I bet he got invited to all the good parties.


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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 12:45:12 PM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

So christians aren't people? I hate to break this to you sparky, when you are trying so hard to appear superior, but there are assholes in every religion. There are even some that are atheists. No one has a monopoly on hate.


So, you are saying here that Martin Luther was an asshole and Pope Paul IV was an asshole. Knew them that well, did you? And no one has a monopoly on hate? Maybe not today but the Christian Church did throughout most of the history of Europe. Being flippant about it as you are only serves to render all the suffering as inconsequential. If you are ignorant of the history of the Church's long, systemic persecution of the Jews, there are plenty of books to be read on the subject. Attributing the persecution to just a few assholes reveals the shallowness of your knowledge.

Hey, I am not making this stuff up and I am not trying to appear superior. If you think that then you have a little problem with your own self esteem. See if you can't come up with a more substantive reply .... sparky.

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 1:07:45 PM   
Arpig


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Status: offline 		Ask the Canaanites how they felt about gentleness of the Hebrews


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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 1:16:56 PM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Ask the Canaanites how they felt about gentleness of the Hebrews



Is your comment meant to justify Christian persecution of the Jews?

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RE: Glenn Beck Reminds Us That Jews Killed Jesus - 7/16/2010 1:46:10 PM   
Arpig


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Status: offline 		No Vincent, more to add  a touch of levity and to point out that every religion was intolerant and vicious when they had the upper hand. The Buddhists of Sri Lanka oppress the Hindu minority and waged a brutal war against them. The problem isn't Christian oppression of Jews, its religious oppression period. Every religion has experienced oppression at some point and every religion has practised oppression (well except the Ba'hai, I don't think they have oppressed anyone, but they haven't been the majority religion anywhere yet...their time will come).



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