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RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 6:48:06 PM   
Zevar


Posts: 801
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

while i agree that you are right that i need to grow more of a back bone, i felt that i did what was best at that moment, which was do nothing. if i had acted on just my emotions, he would no longer be owned by me for throwing a fit and storming out of my house. acting on impluse has produced far worse results than good, and because i have a long standing relationship with him, i didn't want to start turning things more upside down than they already are.


Greetings MissAsylum:

What I am saying to you is not so much for you to gain a sense of “backbone” yet instead to do what works in way of increasing in your ability to stand firm in your decision making. In all decision making there will be times when doubt may attempt to encroach on the final decision. These are the times when one can become strengthened if the choice to learn the lesson that is needed in order to enhance a sense of internal self confidence is not rejected.

I also noticed in your reply that you noted that you had “felt” like you did what was best at the moment. Understand that I am in no way judging your choice. What I am doing is asking for you to consider that when one makes a decision and then references the decision to the term “felt” that does refer to emotions. Further, in part, you indicated in your reply that you do not want to “start turning things upside down than they already are” as you have a “ long standing relationship with him.”

It sounds like perhaps you do have some form of internal fears that prevent you from fully asserting yourself in this “long standing relationship.” It is worth giving yourself time to honestly consider why you allow this sort of behavior by someone who you claim to be the leader of and then over compensate for him when he has acted in a totally inappropriate manner?

I know for myself there would be a rather long and serious talk in line if this were something that I encountered. I encourage you to rise up and lead and not allow your inner concerns to hold you back from what you claim to be.

If this “sub” is acting out then by all means do the right thing and draw the line. Set the structure for a sincere discussion with him regarding his recent conduct. Set the ground rules. Enforce them! Else this pattern that you presented here regarding his conduct will be silently reinforced and worse he will lose all respect for you, thus this conduct is in essence controlling the entire relationship.

How productive can it be for you to continue reinforcing this inappropriate conduct of his? Why would you reinforce his conduct when it disrespects your dignity? What is in order is in order. Behave like what? Excuse me? Who is ruling who? Raise your standards woman! Be Strong!

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 6:49:43 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

well Des has suggested that he wants to be equal to my boyfriend. while i do have a special place for him in my heart- its just not on the level as my boyfriend. end of the relationship probably is unavoidable, but thats life.


this here response pretty much answers your problem.

You wanna know why he doesn't feel he should pay?

Because why should he when the end is unavoidable and "that's life"?

You don't care so why should he bother?

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 6:52:24 PM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

while i agree that you are right that i need to grow more of a back bone, i felt that i did what was best at that moment, which was do nothing. if i had acted on just my emotions, he would no longer be owned by me for throwing a fit and storming out of my house. acting on impluse has produced far worse results than good, and because i have a long standing relationship with him, i didn't want to start turning things more upside down than they already are.


No argument there.  As a D type, you need to have self control.

That said, you've been waiting for him to contact you again.  Sounds like he's sulking.


_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 6:57:22 PM   
BonesFromAsh


Posts: 1362
Joined: 6/17/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

while i do have a special place for him in my heart- its just not on the level as my boyfriend. end of the relationship probably is unavoidable, but thats life.


I would suggest, if you should decide to take on another private submissive partner again, that you give some thought as to the power structure, if any, and what not only your expectations are but those of the sub and your boyfriend, for that matter, if he's in any way involved.

It seems you wanted an equal split and yet admit that he's not on the same "level" as your boyfriend.  You also stated...

quote:


He's not "in the lifestyle" but enjoys the sexual aspect of it.


which leaves me wondering if he sees himself as more than a "friend with benefits" (one that is also friendly with your boyfriend) which could lead him to assume more than what is really there.  I know I'm confused just reading all of this.

Clear and precise boundaries and expectations might be helpful next time.

< Message edited by BonesFromAsh -- 7/20/2010 6:58:14 PM >

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 7:47:30 PM   
LadyMondenschein


Posts: 88
Joined: 12/1/2009
Status: offline 		LaFayette Lady,
I am NOT looking for a BOY TOY to foot the bills of MY life, nor am I looking for multiple amounts of men to do so. I PAY the bills of MY life with MY OWN money, thank you very much. But, yes , I do bill MYSELF out as a ProDomme and any relationship on the side has naught to do with it. And while I'm acting as a Pro Domme, I  do expect that the  men who come to me, WANTING multiple forms of disgust from ME shall have that disgust at a price. "Cuz nothin' is free. All overhead is included in the cost of the session including the dungeon rental, and the gas I must put in MY car that I bought, not some sniveling worm, nor did I buy it with the funds from some sniveling worm.
And just what specifically did you mean when you said, "like everything else"? Do you profess to know ME that well? You don't know Jack about Me, ignorant woman. Don't pretend like you do!!
My relationships are never with subs. Only with Equals.

Lady M.

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 8:52:02 PM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

Obviously you are among those dominant women who are looking for a boy toy to foot the bill for your life. I'm sure that like everything else, you find men willing to throw money at you for the pleasure of your disgust with them, but for most in RELATIONSHIPS, the princess looking for the free ride is really too humorous to talk about.


And what about submissives and slaves that are financially provided for? Would the Keeper's provisions be viewed with disdain or acceptable given the dynamic?

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 8:59:03 PM   
CynthiaWVirginia


Posts: 1915
Joined: 2/28/2010
From: West Virginia, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: peppermint

Wow, you are the type of Domme the male submissives dream about, a freebie fetish delivery system.  You get to buy the toys.  You get to buy those sexy but oh so necessary for his fantasy outfits.  You probably supply the play space.  He gets his itch scratched.  He's gotten used to the free ride.  Of course he wants to continue with the free ride.  You and your boy friend get to buy and pay for the cross to which your submissive dreams of being tied.  Sounds logical if you look at it from your submissive's point of view. 

However, to answer your question.  There are no rules.  You do what works best for you.  If you are comfortable in paying for the cross then do so. 


This is directed to the OP, and not to peppermint.  I merely thought this was so good that it needed to be brought up again.  I agree with this.
 
MissAsylum, you have been with him for three years and he has brought you cupcakes on your birthday and treated you to a restaurant once?  He makes 50K per year and is cheaper with you than vanilla guys have been with me...guys who have made a teensy fraction of what he earns. 
 
You know the hundreds we spend on subs that they are not even aware of.  (Recently I spent around $300 in Trak phone calls.)  I did this because I decided to afford it...and decided that he was worth it.  Each of us have some hard limits when it comes to what we can afford, and when we can afford them. 
 
I cannot get over that he asked for this and expected you to provide this, and threw a tantrum when you wouldn't. 
 
If he had been a paying client and wanted you to provide something in your dungeon, that's different...but instead of the tantrum, if you didn't have what he needed he could just find another pro-domme who had all the lovely fetish cr*p he wanted. 
 
I can see from the solution you came up with that you bent over backward to be fair to everyone involved.  It's my opinion that you are too nice and too fair.  You have probably provided a lot for him over the years, and he just now let you know in no uncertain terms that you are not worth this small sacrifice on his part. 
 
If he had been a friendly vanilla bootie call, he would have spent more than this on you just buying you the occasional flowers or chocolates on your birthday or whatever, and from cheap restaurants and rental movies...over the past three years. 
 
He is not your stay-at-home wife, and I have known males as well as females to take on this position, nor your live at home full time submissive...he has no right to expect you to buy him whatever expensive toys he wants. 
 
Whatever other issues you and he have are not for me to address, as you only asked for our opinion on this one issue.  He is yours and both of you will talk about what led up to this and if there are any ghosts that triggered this behavior that need to be layed to rest, etc.
 
Someone's reply to your question offended me a great deal...but your postings never have. 
 
Another opinion of mine, wishing for a sounding board from other kinky people is a far cry from wanting them to make your decisions for you.  I'll bring up my favorite Star Trek show as an example...the captain may ask for the opinions of everyone in his ready room, or even of other more experienced captains...but in the end, the decision is always his:  nobody presumes that the captain has no backbone just because he asks others for advice.
 
A lot of people brought up unique perspectives that I see has value.  Thank goodness for these people...I respect them and enjoy coming here because of them.  You are brave to start up a thread to ask this question, and I enjoyed hearing most of the answers.  Best wishes to you and yours.
 

< Message edited by CynthiaWVirginia -- 7/20/2010 9:02:39 PM >

(in reply to peppermint)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 8:59:24 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

i had read that its easy to build one. however, i suck at putting things together, and a chest of drawers that my boyfriend was supposed to put together last year remains in pieces. but no, he never offered.


Actually Lass It be so simple to assemble one from scratch that even Mickey Mouse could do it with one hand tied behind his back. Mind you I'll go so far as to bet that between you and your man (BF not sub), could find someone who would be willing to make you one if you paid for the timber and hardware with the case of a slab of beer as a fee. probably better for you to add the tie points  yourself after to disguise it's true purpose. Pity you are not nearer, I'd run you up one for the cost of materials..


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/20/2010 9:00:52 PM   
Andalusite


Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline 		I think he was overreacting by getting so huffy.  I agree that it's not worth fussing over.  If he asks about it again, tell him that you and your boyfriend have decided that it isn't in your budget.  Carrie, I believe the one who is "not in the lifestyle but enjoys the sexual aspects" is Miss Asylum's boyfriend, not her submissive.  Lafayette Lady, I didn't have the impression she was complaining about the submissive not paying for sessions.  Since she is a pro-Domme as well as lifestyle, I had the impression she wanted to clarify that he is not a client.  Also, it seemed relevant, since her submissive said when she asked him to help with buying the cross he had asked for that she was supposed to spend money on him, not the other way around. 

(in reply to porcelaine)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 5:59:28 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

I'd run you up one for the cost of materials..


Counts my pennies cause the idea of Mr. Iron Bear running me up one is just too good to pass up................... 

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

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Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 7:05:52 AM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

I think he was overreacting by getting so huffy.  I agree that it's not worth fussing over.  If he asks about it again, tell him that you and your boyfriend have decided that it isn't in your budget.  Carrie, I believe the one who is "not in the lifestyle but enjoys the sexual aspects" is Miss Asylum's boyfriend, not her submissive.  Lafayette Lady, I didn't have the impression she was complaining about the submissive not paying for sessions.  Since she is a pro-Domme as well as lifestyle, I had the impression she wanted to clarify that he is not a client.  Also, it seemed relevant, since her submissive said when she asked him to help with buying the cross he had asked for that she was supposed to spend money on him, not the other way around.


I posed the question because there's this idea about the princess that some have that tickles me pink. I've heard similar sentiments echoed elsewhere and the claims are often made by women or disgruntled men. I do find it interesting that the idea that some men enjoy providing for their women in a financial capacity is so off-putting. But what's even funnier is when the charges come from fellow submissive persons that denounce the practice and suggest she's really a pillow princess instead. What I find most amusing by persons bearing that mentality is the commonality in their countenance. It is little wonder why their spoils are of the physical sort and never involve his coins.

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to Andalusite)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 7:15:47 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		I heart Porcelaine.

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]



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Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 7:56:51 AM   
BonesFromAsh


Posts: 1362
Joined: 6/17/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

Carrie, I believe the one who is "not in the lifestyle but enjoys the sexual aspects" is Miss Asylum's boyfriend, not her submissive. 


Andalusite,

In looking back over everything this morning I can see you're right.  My apologies to the OP for the misunderstanding.

That being said, I stand by what I said about being clear on boundaries and expectations. 

(in reply to Andalusite)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 8:18:06 AM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

I heart Porcelaine.


Aww thankie *squish*

I may do a thread one day about the mean submissive BDSM syndrome.

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 8:31:46 AM   
Rochsub2009


Posts: 2536
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

sunshine- i agree that there is a deeper issue at hand. he currently is not speaking to me. i'm simply waiting for him to come around in his own time.


M.A.,
I haven't read the entire thread yet.  I will respond more fully when I finish.  But this part here made me pause.

I know that you're young, and still learning.  But this is unacceptable behavior from a sub.  Who is in charge here?  He's not speaking to you, and you're waiting for him to come around in his own time?!!!  Really???!!!

I "might" be able to understand why you would tolerate the behaviors that you've described from a paying client, but not from a long-term "sub".  What am I missing here?

I don't know the details of your relationship, but from what I've read so far, it sounds like he is the Dom, and you are the sub. 

Think about it.  He asked you to buy a piece of equipment that he wanted.  You asked him to pitch in to pay for it, and he said "no".  He stormed out in a huff, and you did nothing.  He is now refusing to talk to you like a spoiled child, and you are patiently waiting for him to come back.

If this is your idea of dominance and submission, then I think you may have the two concepts confused.

BTW, you know that we've always gotten along well.  I don't mean to sound rude or insulting.  But I've just gotta be honest about this one.  You don't sound particularly dominant in this situation.  He sounds like he definitely is calling the shots, and you are serving him.

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 8:39:16 AM   
sirsholly


Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

No, there is no "rule". But cheapness just is NOT pretty. Does this character know how much a pair of shoes costs, let alone corsets, TOYS, and all the stuff that you buy to use with HIM? Yeah, I can see why he wouldn't want to chip in on a piece of furniture that will stay with YOU, but WTF? You can BUILD a cross far more cheaply, did he even bother to offer that?

We have subs in my area who build that stuff for their dominants all the time. It's called "service".

That right there.

No, I wouldn't expect the sub to chip in on the cross if you are buying it.  I'm guessing it's going in your home and that's where it's going to stay.  There's no real guarantee that the sub will be using it if next month you decide to release him. 


this...

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Profile   Post #: 76
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 9:27:20 AM   
Rochsub2009


Posts: 2536
Status: offline 		Okay, I just finished reading the entire thread.  From what I've read, you have a real problem.  But the problem isn't really the sub (although he's part of the problem).  The problem seems to be you.

You say that you are both a lifestyle Domme and a pro Domme.  Yet, in most of the situations that you describe on here, the characteristic that is generally missing is dominance.  Are you certain that you actually have  a dominant personality/psyche?

IMO, being a Domme is not about kinky sex, or tying someone up.  That's just.....kinky sex.  D/s is about power exchange.  It's a mental state.  And many/most of the situations that you describe have the trappings of D/s (leather, latex, whips, ropes, St. Andrews Cross, etc.), but they lack the actual substance of D/s.  In the majority of the situations that you write about, the consistent theme is that you are not in charge.  You generally seem to be the victim, rather than the one calling the shots.  You may want to think about that for a while.

Perhaps it is a generational thing, but I think that your expectations are too low.  You have a sub who you say is "owned", yet he can apparently talk to you in any way he feels like.  And he can also stop talking to you anytime he feels like it.  And in both cases, you just sit back and wait for him to come around.  Huh?

Also, he has bought you a cupcake on your birthday, and one lousy dinner.  In THREE YEARS!!!!  Really?  C'mon, I don't know many vanilla women who wouldn't kick a boyfriend to the curb for that.  A cupcake on your birthday????  Seriously??  One dinner in 3 years?  Really???!!! I am not one who thinks that Dommes (or women in general) need to be materialistic, but your standards are waaaaaaaayyyyyy too low.

If you were my VANILLA girlfriend, I would get you much more than a cupcake for your birthday.  Over the course of 3 years, we would have gone on literally hundreds of dinner dates, and I likely would have paid for them all.  I would also have paid for movies, concert tickets, etc.  That's just how I was raised.  Men pay to take their women out.  If she decides to treat sometimes, that's fine.  But in general, I take HER out.

I usually don't reveal specifics of my personal life here on CM.  I just don't think that my private life is anyone else's business.  But in this case, I'll make an exception.  This weekend (well, it's actually longer than a weekend, but let's call it a weekend), I am going on vacation with a Domme.  The vacation was her idea/request.  She named the place that she wanted to go, and told me the date that she wanted to go.  Guess what?  I am paying for the accommodations at the resort.  I am also paying for her travel expenses.  I am also paying for all of our meals while we are away.  I will probably take her shopping while we are there.  And I will bring her a gift when I arrive to pick her up.  And guess what?  I am not owned by her.  I hope that things can eventually progress to that point.  But right now, we are just seeing how things go.  And I don't feel the least bit used.  In fact, I feel honored that she is allowing me to take her on vacation.  I feel that it is a privilege to do this for her.

Perhaps I am in a different financial bracket than your 3-year sub.  But nevertheless, if I can do that for someone who isn't even officially my Domme, then El Cheapo can at least get you a full birthday cake, rather than a $#^@&* cupcake.

It's time for you to grow up and start wearing the big girl panties now.  Don't just say that you're a Domme, BE A DOMME.

End of rant.  Hope you don't take my comments the wrong way. 

You know that you're still my girl.  But damn.  I want to see you be so much better than you are right now.

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 9:33:38 AM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		i understand what you are getting at, and no- this is not my idea of what a D/s relationship. I simply did not want to overreact. my boyfriend was amazed i didnt jump down his throat- which was my inital thought. i judt didnt want to worsen the situation. i'm waiting for him to call me because i'll be damned if i'm going to call somebody who disrespected me and my household. when he gets his head on straight and comes with an apology in hand, then i'll listen.

_____________________________

I hate when I'm wearing my apple bottom jeans, but i can't find my boots with the fur.

(in reply to Rochsub2009)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 9:48:04 AM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		and my situations are a result of me not wanting to lose my temper. i'm typically very patient, but when i get to the end of my rope- i'll explode on somebody....or pour hot coffee on somebody's lap.

< Message edited by MissAsylum -- 7/21/2010 9:54:39 AM >

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I hate when I'm wearing my apple bottom jeans, but i can't find my boots with the fur.

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Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Is there something wrong with splitting the costs? - 7/21/2010 10:18:42 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		Had it been Me, there would have been no loss of temper.  I tend to have a very matter of fact way about Me, as you may notice in some of the responses that I have given during some of your threads.

Subjects such as these don't call for long, drawn out debates.  You're not dealing with a situation that should get emotional.  It's a very simple proposition that wasn't complicated to answer.

The sub came to you with an idea.  That being, to buy a cross.  My way of doing things is, I would be in possession of the item.  If this is something that he wants, I can buy the materials and he can make it.  That is My decision.  If he can not build it, I have no issue with him being on his own devices on how to make this happen.  Help from another sub friend who has built one or whatever.  It is like any other task.  It is now his job to complete it.

Otherwise, it comes down to a very simple word.  "No."  Telling the sub no is not going to harm him.  This is a grown man that you are dealing with, supposedly under your control.  It's a very simple use of your authority.  That is what the answer remains, at minimum, until something changes.  (In other words, he becomes willing to build the cross.)  It's a very simple decision that really does take less time than I've taken here to type it out. 

That is how I would have handled it.




_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to MissAsylum)
Profile   Post #: 80
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