RE: Iran - You Make the Call...

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RE: Iran - You Make the Call... - 4/21/2006 7:35:32 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
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quote:

The mullahs seized power in Iran through the discontent caused by the oppresive practices of the US-supported Shah.

Wrong opinions are fodder for good debate. Wrong facts just facilitate an argument with a shaky foundation.

The mullahs took power in Iran because the US, under the administration of Jimmy Carter, STOPPED supporting the Shah. It was alleged the Shah's "human rights" practices didn't meet Carter's standards. He knew as much about the Iran situation as he did about the economy. His policies did more to unsettle the region than any administration prior or since. Under him, the US looked impotent to take care of it's people at home or abroad. It's a same he didn't start building houses with his brother Billy as soon as he got out of the navy.

If the Iraq situation has proven anything it's that the people living in that region REQUIRE a firm hand to rule them. Without a dictatorship or a government run by pragmatic fundamental religious group schisms within the Muslim religion will kill each other. Democracy is not a part of the mentality of the people. Democracy can not be forced upon them. "Human Rights" have a totally different definition. The only "right" is that you must obey the person or party in power. Don't comply any you not only lose your freedom, you lose a hand, eye, tongue, or if you 'lucky' your life. It is the way it is.

Which is why the Iran solution is simple and should be applied through the region. Let them alone to kill each other. Without a common enemy, the US, they'll be busy doing just that. Join with Russia and China in open trade of military goods and services. Clear the shelves of all the expired biological weapons. Slightly used F14's can move at 'cost'. Bring all the military home, close the bases, close the embassies and say good luck., have a nice time. Don't reduce the military personal, station them to replace the minimum wage idiots currently "guarding" our borders and manning the airport security stations. I know TSI personal aren't paid minimum wage, but the used to in their prior position where asking "do you want fries with that?" was required.

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RE: Iran - You Make the Call... - 4/22/2006 8:29:56 AM

MistressDREAD

Posts: 2943
Joined: 1/1/2004
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quote:

You've obviously never played double-obliteration tag.

Is that when You empale em up against the camel with the arrow, then run up and stab em
over and over again hoping the camel falls on top of em? Or is that Bamboo ?

My call to make is, Im getting out the bikes and make sure the tires are up cause its gonna be
a longgggg war with oil valued more then people in the end and I need to get back in shape in
order to ride that damn bike when the gas pumps are dry.Im gettin out the 55 gal drums and start
saving extra rain water for the times when the public water utilities dont have fuel to run and water is cut.
Im saving all glass containers for underground food storage and drinking water for when the electric company
can find the fuel it needs to run. Im gonna start hoarding up medical supplies again especially those needed
for flu, sterilization, and healing, not to mention ordering ahead those prescriptions the Dr. wants Me to take.
Im opening up that old underground cellar and starting to buy in bulk those can goods again. Extream ?..No.
When dealing with people and countries who beleive its of more value to die and live in another world then this
one, and have been taught finatically to beleive such, No its not extream to shore up for the worse case senario.
The Government is not speaking about a pandemic as tho its in another mans world but in terms of how its going
to effect Our world. Thats enough cause for preparing for worse case senario when you put all the crap going on
in the world together and think of terms where all of it ends up in your back yard. Oh yea cant forget those extra
supply of bullets, knifes, machettes, matches and flintstones.
Thats My call.

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RE: Iran - You Make the Call... - 4/22/2006 8:51:20 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
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Most wars are started through misinterpretation and miscalculation and they don't always end up with the desired result in mind. A good leader is one who doesn't need to fight an unnecessary war. Some calm reflection is necessary. What a leader says is not necessarily what they mean. One has to differentiate between rhetoric for domestic consumption and actual actions.

Sun Tzu ' The Art of War 500BC
" There is no instance of a country having been benefited from prolonged warfare."

" It is only one who is thoroughly acquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on."

"Supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting.
Thus the highest form of generalship is to baulk the enemy's plans;
the next best is to prevent the junction of the enemy's forces;
the next in order is to attack the enemy's army in the field;
the worst ploicy of all is to beseige walled cities."

Old language but with a little imagination this still holds true. The tactics of failure are thinking tactics of war are the only option.

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Post #: 63

I agree with bin Laden - 4/24/2006 3:32:22 PM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
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I think the UN should heed bin Laden's warning and advice regarding the Darfur region. This region of the world may be familiar to some. The Sudanese government allowed bin Laden reside there in the 1990's until a US president allowed him to emigrate to Afghanistan.

quote:

The al Qaeda leader, in an audio tape broadcast on Al Jazeera television, said the United States and Britain, by pushing for a U.N. force in Darfur, were plotting to dismember Sudan. He urged his followers to rise up against them.
"I call on the mujahideen and their supporters in Sudan ... and the Arabian peninsula to prepare all that is necessary to wage a long-term war against the Crusaders in western Sudan," bin Laden said
Source: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/24/AR2006042400887.html

What is Darfur?

quote:

Nearly three years into the crisis, the western Sudanese region of Darfur is acknowledged to be a humanitarian and human rights tragedy of the first order. The humanitarian, security and political situation continue to deteriorate: atrocities continue, people are still dying in large numbers of malnutrition and disease, and a new famine is feared. According to reports by the World Food Program, the United Nations and the Coalition for International Justice, 3.5 million people are now hungry, 2.5 million have been displaced due to violence, and 400,000 people have died in Darfur thus far. The international community is failing to protect civilians or to influence the Sudanese government to do so. Read more.
Source: http://www.savedarfur.org/situation/

Who is Darfur?

quote:

The fighting in Darfur pits Muslim against Muslim. It began in 2003 when mostly non-Arab tribes rose up against the government, accusing it of neglect.
The Sudanese government retaliated by arming Arab Janjaweed militia, which unleashed a campaign of murder, rape, arson and plunder that drove more than 2 million villagers from their homes into squalid camps in Darfur and neighboring Chad. Khartoum denies responsibility.

I'll assume that very few would support US or UN intervention. I've "learned the Iraqi lesson" and concur. Maintaining the status quo would maintain the current situation. The region is a peace loving religious people having a disagreement about beard length and proper burka color. Why should we interfere?

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RE: I agree with bin Laden - 4/24/2006 7:43:28 PM

DelightMachine

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Joined: 1/21/2006
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quote:

The region is a peace loving religious people having a disagreement about beard length and proper burka color. Why should we interfere?

Because an enormous number of people could die.

I don't know about you, but the God I believe in tells me I should love them, so if we can help save a lot of people from being massacred, we should.

Actually, I don't know that we have the resources to interfere, given our other responsibilities right now.

One thing we might do is blockade Sudan's ports. Mine 'em and stay on patrol in the Red Sea. That will get the attention of Sudan like nothing else because oil is their money tree. That will also get the attention of the Chinese, who buy oil from Sudan and, I think, may have been investing in efforts to get more oil from there. Once we have the attention of the Chinese, we might keep the mines in place until we get more cooperation with Iran.

Would any of this work or could we do any of it? How the hell should I know?

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Post #: 65