quote:

ORIGINAL: slavekal

There are times that dommes need to be told that there is a difference.

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

Hi All

Some of you may think I'm ranting a bit here and well, you may be right. However, I'm trying to figure out what I did wrong and since I have too few encounters for statistical significance, I'm asking if any of you have had similar experiences. It's possible that female supremacist is purely a red herring, and that I just haven't hung around enough dominant women to expect this kind of treatment. But from my perspective so far- it's a bit out of bounds. And if you're looking for something salacious- sorry, nobody even gets undressed in this tale...

So here goes-

After a relatively brief email exchange, I arrange a date with an individual I met on this site. Per the thread title, she strongly identifies as "female supremacist." She traveled to the suggested restaurant and discovered that there was a line out the door- just a good local pizza joint since we both seemed to like pizza. She'd arrived quite early and gave me a call to inform me of this state of affairs, and could I suggest an alternative? I did- we met, and had what I thought was an enjoyable meal. Well, I enjoyed it, and I enjoyed her company as well. When the time for dessert came around, I half jokingly suggested that I had truffles at my place about 20 minutes away, and being a hot evening, suggested we could go skinny dipping as well. To my surprise, she seemed to like the idea and we set out. When I walked her to her car, I suggested she might want to follow me, but she had faith in her GPS. One of the topics during dinner was driving- she informed that when she was a pro-domme (she has since retired), she was used to men sending limousines for her. (I have no reason to doubt her.) But she was unhappy with the parking situation near the restaurant I had chosen, and didn't like my laughing at her observation that parking really sucked. From my perspective, any town with good restaurants has a parking problem- it's the nature of beast. My thought process was that she wasn't really comfortable driving. (And yes, I offered to drive her both to my house and back in the morning, but her car wasn't in overnight parking- and in her shoes, I'd want my car handy.)

So to make a long story longer, she never shows up. I talked to her that evening and she'd gotten lost and frustrated and turned around. However, she said that dinner had been enjoyable and that we'd try again next week. Well, I'm sure you've guessed the punch line- no response since. I've tried long missives and short invites- no rancor. She reads them, but doesn't respond.

I must admit, I think this behavior is quite boorish. If you've changed your mind or gotten cold feet- say so. It's one thing to ignore unsolicited emails (although I will point out that I think this behavior breeds contempt and one line rude responses) but if you've already met somebody and agreed to a second date- have the decency to at least respond with a polite no thank you. (yes, it's a little painful, hence the semi-cathartic post, but maybe I can learn something here.) I can't tell whether she likes the teasing aspect, or whether I'm being annoying and she's hoping I'll go away. There is a block function for that, don't know whether she know how it works. From my perspective- it's time to move on. Trying to carry out a relationship with this individual is doomed to failure.

So here's the question at long last...

Is this type of behavior typical of a "female supremacist"? Or is this just an aberration? Or is this type of behavior more common than I think, and I just haven't run into it before?

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

The topics at dinner chosen by her revolved around BDSM and the limitations of various websites, dating services etc. It was a pretty frank discussion, and actually rather unusual for a first date.
Sounds entertaining. She was leading the interaction... Now do you let her?

My topics ranged from profession to heritage, and we spent far less time on them.
Contrary to popular belief, women do not want you to "impress them" by bragging outright. They want to be impressed by your demeanor and your skills. She'll figure out the size of your wallet and your background on her own. Infact, she already judged you for the lack of limousine.
This was your cue to either challenge her with a playful remark ("No helicopter?") or to offer skills (like sailing or cooking) or connections (like you know the guy who runs the yacht club) you can offer her humbly. I'm guessing a Domme likes to view her man as subservient and eager to please (which is you, right?).

It was certainly a rather different first date, although what I've noticed is that women who were pro-dommes and visible in the profession, have a great deal of their identity wrapped up in their sexuality.
Women who "have their identity wrapped up in their sexuality" will flirt with you and others even when they aren't that interested. Because that is how they project their "self" into the world for you and everyone else to see. The aura that attracts us like flies they can whack at.

---

For the next part, I'll assume she wasn't outright annoyed or offended with you leading the interraction and trying to seduce her and was abit intrigued to see how you'd manage.

For most dates, I would agree that a serious suggestion to go skinny dipping would be out of line- but on this date, it fit the tenor- at least I thought so.

If you don't act that way normally, why are u trying to act like you're a self-confident but lovable jerk (like Jeffffffffff) or a self-confident alpha male stereotype (like Focus50)?

Besides, the offer was proferred half jokingly, it was a bit more flirtatious than serious. Hence, I was surprised when she responded in the affirmative.

Flirting and joking definately very useful. I am not at ALL suprised she responded positively; she was teasing you to see where you'd go with it. That's what people with dominant personalities do to measure others' reactions and test how confident/dominant the other person is. (It's more polite than giving an order and watching what happens.)

I definately would have put the offer off for later on and/or added a condition or two, because a sure thing is not as exciting as a possibility. Sure things deserve no second thought. Goals are excellent in influencing someone to want to do something. What you did was you gave no goal, no conditions, nothing for her to comply with.

She wanted dessert- I offered the menu of the restaurant where we were, an ice cream joint a few blocks away, and my place with home made truffles. She chose the latter so I don't think she was offended by the suggestion.

Don't hammer it in - It's not offensive, it's repetative. "You know what, I think you deserve only fresh-made truffles, so some other time, let's just go for the ice-cream now."

It's quite possible I misread the signals, but what I'm catching from these posts is that if there are a set of rules for dealing with women like this, I'm not the only one in the dark about them.

You mean female supremacists OR self-confident women who are looking for someone even more self-assured? I think you were using an approach for the second one, while interacting with the first one. She probably was already reasonably satisfied with your looks and lifestyle to give you a chance so all you had to do is be fun, humble, graceful, intelligent and willing to please when demonstrating your personality.

Also- if you were a guy on this board, you'd know that it takes a lot to get a date with a woman on here- it's not a trivial process.

So, with all the bitchy posts along the lines of "I met this guy, and he immediately started talking about a hotel room and wouldn't stop", was your approach really results-based?

Even, if you read the signals correctly, the tone was right and she was willing to let you seduce her, you still have to do what you're implying - the seducing. Alot of men choose to avoid this approach especially with highly compatible matches, because of how risky it is and how easy it is to crash and burn. (Which is why it can be so thrilling). Women must of picked up on this, which is why they correctly assume that anyone trying to sleep with them sees them as easily replacable.

The difference in a woman's mind between a honest confident guy leading her towards what she wants and a creepy guy hoping he gets what he wants is a really fine one that you might not want to mess with. Haha. Words like "my place" and "hotel room" are powerful emotional triggers that can activate certain memories in the brain and set off the creep alarm.

Also, you're never, ever going back to your place with a woman, if you two haven't been comfortable enough to kiss yet. It's so damn obvious, which why I decided to question if you should be trying to seduce any women on a first date to begin with. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with a patient approach if that is more natural to you.

Endless needy txts sealed the deal. If you want to give her a chance to change her mind, end the sentence with "feel free to let me know". Although, with her being a Domme, maybe an apology and self-critiscism might have done it too. Vulnerable can be sooo enticing. :)"

Think about the fact that you were trying to sell yourself as an alpha male to a "female supremacist" and you might realize how much you actually had to prove. You weren't even close to accomplishing that. Does that make sense to you? I hope you have a good laugh about it.

Rejection, think of it this way: you had a fun time with her on your date. She was a good date and not impolite, a bore or a vengeful psycho who keyed your car. If you keep this in mind, and you'll be happy with what attention she was able to give you.

Getting rejected by her almost sounds... pleasant.

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

But she was unhappy with the parking situation near the restaurant I had chosen, and didn't like my laughing at her observation that parking really sucked. From my perspective, any town with good restaurants has a parking problem- it's the nature of beast. My thought process was that she wasn't really comfortable driving. (And yes, I offered to drive her both to my house and back in the morning, but her car wasn't in overnight parking- and in her shoes, I'd want my car handy.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

To clear up some misconceptions- there was clearly a grace period for her to respond and she was showing up on this board, so the opportunity to communicate appears to have been there, just wasn't taken.

quote:

ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

To clear up some misconceptions- there was clearly a grace period for her to respond and she was showing up on this board, so the opportunity to communicate appears to have been there, just wasn't taken.

Woah woah woooooooooah there cowboy-she reads the boards?! And you're talking about her on them? Without her consent?

Oh dear.

quote:

ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

To clear up some misconceptions- there was clearly a grace period for her to respond and she was showing up on this board, so the opportunity to communicate appears to have been there, just wasn't taken.

Woah woah woooooooooah there cowboy-she reads the boards?! And you're talking about her on them? Without her consent?

Oh dear.

quote:

What I meant by "set her straight" is that some dommes think dominant means having no manners, being really late or not showing up at all, being rude to people in general, etc.  There are times that dommes need to be told that there is a difference.  Of course if she never responds to messages, that will be impossible to do.

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct


AAkasha- we may have some geographical differences as well as I'll fully admit to not traveling in the limousine set. But most of the restaurants I frequent more than once don't have valet parking, and the ones that I've been to that do often have lousy food. I tend to like restaurants that are in the "hip" parts of town, i.e. somebody does some renovating and a run down place gets trendier. Odds are at some of these places you'll find good food, whether its Manhattan, Boston, Annapolis, or New Orleans.- Often in the absence of things like Zagat or Readers Choice reviews or similar ilk- I pick restaurants based on my nose. But struggling restaurants rarely can afford valet parking- my observation- YMMV. If there's a need to discuss further, we can start a different thread in the OT section.

In terms of my laughter- I'll admit to being nervous and that's where it came from. From my perspective- I've suggested a well known pizza joint that's also known for being crowded- a line comes with the turf. She could have said she didn't like lines initially, but she didn't. So here I am, driving to the place which I had picked since it was close to her (my guess, didn't know exactly where she lived), when I get a phone call saying come up with plan B, from someone I've never even met in person. So I came up with a plan B, and to a guy who's nervous on a first blind date, I think I did pretty well. I also suggested that she park in the municipal lot which would be easy to find and would be a short walk to the restaurant. (As mentioned earlier- it's even cheap.) But she doesn't like paying towns for parking-so she searches to find a free space. So her comment to me that parking sucks in this town does seem a little ironic- it's really not that hard, she just made it harder on herself.

My guess is that we were both nervous, we just showed it in different ways. She got snappish about something inconsequential, and I laughed as an attempt to diffuse the situation. Someone more skilled in seduction wouldn't have laughed. Or I can take it as a worrying sign that she doesn't share my sense of humor.


Cheers,

Sam

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

Oops- my bad. Slip of the keyboard in the wee hours.