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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 1:16:00 PM   
RealSub58


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quote:

Every day is a gift.
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


Now wait a minute julia......  did you see that plaque on my wall and decide to use it????  

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 1:37:09 PM   
Toppingfrmbottom


Posts: 6528
Joined: 6/7/2009
Status: offline 		Probably that submission isn't the gift, the trust you give him is.
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I am trying to discern what your point is...




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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 1:42:14 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RealSub58

quote:

Every day is a gift.
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


Now wait a minute julia......  did you see that plaque on my wall and decide to use it????  



I am psychic

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 2:12:41 PM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

a little fed up with the cliche".


Well, he is not the only one who is fed up with it, it is a common pet peeve



I have heard that. Personally I am not sure why it would matter to anyone what someone else calls it. It's a personal relationship between two or more people and up to the ones involved how they define it. While I have never referred to my submission as a gift, it really doesn't effect my life if someone else does.


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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 2:14:14 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		Can't stand the terminology. It's for the those that have to make this something more than it is. They read.... "The Gift of Gor" and they love it.

This has to be something bigger than life because I am living it.


My friends are gifts. What about that time Sharon Ziegler fucked your boyfriend? She was really a peach then.

Everyday is a gift....really what about a day that you do nothing. A day you can never recall. Some gift.

How many have turned down your gift of submission? I am sorry it doesn't fit and it makes me itchy.

You fuckers and your romantic phrases. It is what it is. It is not a gift. Not everyone accepts it and certainly not everyone wants it.

It is conditional, it is earned and it is not a surprise. It can be taken back at anytime and Kmart won't give you shit for it when you try and return it.

Read your books on Gor. Join the SCA. Dress up like a vampire. Make this something that it is not.


Name a gift that is conditional, can be taken back without a word, is discussed at length and in order to be recieved you have to give something in return?

There is none. You know why? BECAUSE IT IS NOT A FUCKING GIFT!!!!

Get it through your thick fucking skulls.


Don't make me stop this car!

< Message edited by domiguy -- 9/12/2010 2:16:07 PM >

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 2:25:31 PM   
NuevaVida


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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy


Everyday is a gift....really what about a day that you do nothing. A day you can never recall. Some gift.




Actually a day in which I could do absolutely nothing would be a wonderful gift!!  Sign me up, cuz that hasn't happened in ages!


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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 2:33:42 PM   
DesFIP


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

Not that you're saying that, but it's why I don't see submitting, or trusting, or any other part of myself as a gift to the man.  I can't go around saying, "I'm going to be true to myself with you and you should see that as a gift."  Because that's what "my submission is a gift" would be to me.



There are damned few people who do get to see my authentic self, who get trusted with my vulnerability. The few who do get it are getting something that most don't. It is a gift, to have someone place that much trust in you. I treasure it from him and from those few others and if those few didn't treasure it from me as a rare gift then they wouldn't continue to receive it.

I never said it was without strings. But hell, lots of gifts come with strings.


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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 2:36:16 PM   
domiguy


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Status: offline 		You will get nothing and like it.

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 2:38:08 PM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
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Status: offline 		Sometimes getting nothing is the best possible gift.


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Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.



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Profile   Post #: 69
RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 3:59:32 PM   
AquaticSub


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Joined: 12/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

Can't stand the terminology. It's for the those that have to make this something more than it is. They read.... "The Gift of Gor" and they love it.

This has to be something bigger than life because I am living it.


My friends are gifts. What about that time Sharon Ziegler fucked your boyfriend? She was really a peach then.

Sometimes gifts break. I had the good times with her. I view it as a gift.
quote:


Everyday is a gift....really what about a day that you do nothing. A day you can never recall. Some gift.

Relaxing days are AMAZING gifts. I'm still alive, my Dad didn't abandon me, I still have Internet... Yeah, I call it a gift.
quote:


How many have turned down your gift of submission? I am sorry it doesn't fit and it makes me itchy.

Actually none but so what? Cause someone doesn't want a gift doesn't make it less of a gift.
quote:


You fuckers and your romantic phrases. It is what it is. It is not a gift. Not everyone accepts it and certainly not everyone wants it.

Of course not everyone wants it. Nowhere in the definition of the word gift is the phrase "everyone has to want it".
quote:


There is none. You know why? BECAUSE IT IS NOT A FUCKING GIFT!!!!

Get it through your thick fucking skulls.

Perhaps you should read the definition of the word gift. It's not a gift to you, we all get it. But none of the things you are saying are in the definition of "gift".
quote:


Don't make me stop this car!

Please do. I'll stick with Mister Webster.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 9/12/2010 4:00:14 PM >

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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Profile   Post #: 70
RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 4:00:37 PM   
AquaticSub


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Joined: 12/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

Sometimes getting nothing is the best possible gift.



Now that I completely agree with!

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Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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Profile   Post #: 71
RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 4:38:59 PM   
domiguy


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Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		Aqua, I like that you skipped the part about that it can be taken back at anytime and that something is always given in exchange for this gift.


It is not a gift....If you sat on Mr Webster I am sure you would stick....But that has nothing to do with the definition of "gift."

Show me where Mr Webster talks about the gifyt be taken back at any point or that something must be always given in return in order for the gift to be offered.

It's not a gift. If you decide to continue to use this terminology it is only because you choose to ignore the actual definiton of the word.

I hate bdsm'ers.

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 4:52:55 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

I like that you skipped the part about that it can be taken back at anytime and that something is always given in exchange for this gift.


How about the "gift of music" or being "mentally gifted"...

The word gift is thrown around in different contexts and in different ways. You have a very narrow view of the term "gift". Read anthropological literature about "gifts"... namely one book called Inalienable Possessions and another called The Gift. Both deal with what gifting is, what it means, how different people do it, and how it is often viewed as a social transaction. You gift me with 100 fat cows, and I give you my fattest daughter.

I would agree that people often use the term Gift of Submission to make what we do seem more important, better, and somehow more romantic than our vanilla counterparts, which of course is more than fucking silly to think that because I liked to be spanked I am more true and real and deep than other people.... but to say that it is invalid to view love, life, our parents, friends, and an enjoyable day as a gift... well excuse me, I call bullshit on that, to me those things are gifts which no one can take back, because the time I had with those people and those experiences I have had already fucking happened....

It is kinda like if I sucked your dick, I couldn't take it back...Even if I tried to deny it happened, we would both know that wasn't true

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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Profile   Post #: 73
RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 4:55:33 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		Didn't skip it just didn't see it.

And nope, there is nothing in the definition of gift that says it can't be taken back. I linked to the definition in this thread already. But here you go, to save you having to look. Cause I'm nice like that.

": a notable capacity, talent, or endowment
2
: something voluntarily transferred by one person to another without compensation
3
: the act, right, or power of giving"

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gift

Nothing about "has to fit in a box, must be given without conditions, can't ever be taken back, must be wanted by everyone" etc.

I get that you don't like the term. It *is* a romantic one. But face it... it doesn't violate the dictionary definition.

Edited to add: Even better, the definition of the transitive verb gift:

": to endow with some power, quality, or attribute
2
: present <gifted her with flowers>"

Nothing about boxes, must be desired, must be unconditional, etc. there. Giving submission endows power over the submissive.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 9/12/2010 4:59:04 PM >

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 5:42:03 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

I like that you skipped the part about that it can be taken back at anytime and that something is always given in exchange for this gift.


How about the "gift of music" or being "mentally gifted"...

The word gift is thrown around in different contexts and in different ways. You have a very narrow view of the term "gift". Read anthropological literature about "gifts"... namely one book called Inalienable Possessions and another called The Gift. Both deal with what gifting is, what it means, how different people do it, and how it is often viewed as a social transaction. You gift me with 100 fat cows, and I give you my fattest daughter.

I would agree that people often use the term Gift of Submission to make what we do seem more important, better, and somehow more romantic than our vanilla counterparts, which of course is more than fucking silly to think that because I liked to be spanked I am more true and real and deep than other people.... but to say that it is invalid to view love, life, our parents, friends, and an enjoyable day as a gift... well excuse me, I call bullshit on that, to me those things are gifts which no one can take back, because the time I had with those people and those experiences I have had already fucking happened....

It is kinda like if I sucked your dick, I couldn't take it back...Even if I tried to deny it happened, we would both know that wasn't true


How dare you not agree with me!!! You two are perilously close to being seven point three sixed.

I will concede that you can use the word "gift" any way you like as long as you do not take away the memories of all the blow jobs that I have received.

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 5:43:51 PM   
poise


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Attachment (1)

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 5:45:21 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

How dare you not agree with me!!! You two are perilously close to being seven point three sixed.

I will concede that you can use the word "gift" any way you like as long as you do not take away the memories of all the blow jobs that I have received.



Oooo..... no one has 7.3.6ed me yet!!!! A cherry that I didn't know I still had! So this is a good day after all.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 6:00:07 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

I will concede that you can use the word "gift" any way you like as long as you do not take away the memories of all the blow jobs that I have received.


I have ways of making you forget....lol

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 6:12:05 PM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
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Status: offline 		Hah!
Gifts are things freely given...as in with no strings attached.
All win, no cost.
I don't know much, but I do know that when I accept a woman's surrender, there's a whole heckuva lot responsibilities that go along with that acceptance.
Submission is the furthest thing from a gift. If anything, it's a (wonderful) burden.


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Profile   Post #: 79
RE: gift of submission? - 9/12/2010 6:17:00 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		As we just went through, that is a personal definition of gift, not the actual definition. Gifts are given with strings all the time. Take engagement rings. Those are a gift but it's understood that if the woman breaks up the engagement, she returns either the ring or the value of the ring. This is even upheld in the courts most of the time.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 80
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