RE: Aggression and submission (Full Version)

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Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:30:52 AM)

See definition.
4. boldly assertive and forward; pushy: an aggressive driver.

I get what I want because I'm "in it to win it" (I'm sure some will salivate over the use of "Win it") in certain situations. Some women like that some don't.

Aggression works great in business..It drives me to excel to push for the sale. It's helped me greatly in life..When others give up..There I am..Tenacious as hell..continuously pushing in the direction I want to go.

It's funny because I see a lot of talk from those who call themselves assertive and they never back it up..Always the first to give up and quit all the while trying to discredit those who actually get something accomplished.

I think they feel threatened. That to me reeks of insecurity.

I don't however find it attractive in a mate since I like doing the leading. I'm not Zen in this..

Ya know the type.."A leader, leads best when he follows first"..Next we'll be saying it's okay if the submissive leads the relationship because the Dominant says so..I can see it now.

The Dom is now subservient and the sub takes the reins..woohoo.




Lockit -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:43:37 AM)

ROFL! Why would anyone feel the need to prove anything to you? If they do, that is their gig, it sure isn't mine. What you think of me is clear and you have every right to think it, but I don't care. Challenge away, call it whatever you wish. You simply don't matter enough to me to make anything clear to someone who doesn't want anything to be clear unless it is his point of view and he has broken them into accepting it by his sheer brilliance.

Go fly a kite... you will have better luck with that, than challenging a face off for many pages of a thread with me. Not going to happen. lol




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:45:42 AM)

Wow tell me that was on point for feeling threatened...You must have thought that was directed at you?[;)]




Lockit -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:48:15 AM)

LOL... good try. [;)]




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:53:14 AM)

I just see you as a bitter person who's having trouble not transferring the hate you have for your ex onto other men that you think you see similarities in.

Your threatened I think by strong men..The guy you were married to must have been hard on you.




Lockit -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:55:04 AM)

ROFL... you are so brilliant! You know me so well.

You have a good day now!




BonesFromAsh -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:56:29 AM)

Just want to post this before my mind gets too discombobulated with everything else going on....


Icarys,

I love the dog analogy. I have cats that are very similar, 2 were abused and took time to learn trust and how to accept human love and 1 who is just a lover who has had no issues with humans therefore no reason to question their motives. She just needed a bit of “direction” ;-)

Funny you posted a definition for the word aggression. I had considered doing so in my op but decided to leave it up to others to offer their versions.
I found it interesting you should mention aggressiveness in a business sense. I was look at this link prior to posting that discusses leadership styles which colors my view of dominance… http://www.mindtools.com/pages/article/newLDR_84.htm

One of the styles mentioned is Transformational Leadership, which I’d like to offer an example of from the aforementioned article.

quote:


Having said this, however, there's one leadership style that is appropriate in very many corporate situations – that of Transformational Leadership. A leader using this style:
• Has integrity.
• Sets clear goals.
• Clearly communicates a vision.
• Sets a good example.
• Expects the best from the team.
• Encourages.
• Supports.
• Recognizes good work and people.
• Provides stimulating work.
• Helps people see beyond their self-interests and focus more on team interests and needs.
• Inspires.
In short, transformational leaders are exceptionally motivating, and they're trusted. When your team trusts you, and is really "fired up" by the way you lead, you can achieve great things!


With that in mind, do you see aggression as a positive or negative trait in a D-type? Do you see a difference between aggressive behavior and assertive actions and attitude?

Yeah, it's a bit off my original topic but I feel it still ties into the idea of styles, be they d-type or s-type.




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 11:57:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

ROFL... you are so brilliant! You know me so well.

You have a good day now!


Thank you..I have already. I hope you do too.[:D]

It comes through in almost everything you say..Look at your tag-lines. That's anger if I've ever seen it.




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:06:40 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BonesFromAsh

Just want to post this before my mind gets too discombobulated with everything else going on....


Icarys,

I love the dog analogy. I have cats that are very similar, 2 were abused and took time to learn trust and how to accept human love and 1 who is just a lover who has had no issues with humans therefore no reason to question their motives. She just needed a bit of “direction” ;-)

Funny you posted a definition for the word aggression. I had considered doing so in my op but decided to leave it up to others to offer their versions.
I found it interesting you should mention aggressiveness in a business sense. I was look at this link prior to posting that discusses leadership styles which colors my view of dominance… http://www.mindtools.com/pages/article/newLDR_84.htm

One of the styles mentioned is Transformational Leadership, which I’d like to offer an example of from the aforementioned article.

quote:


Having said this, however, there's one leadership style that is appropriate in very many corporate situations – that of Transformational Leadership. A leader using this style:
• Has integrity.
• Sets clear goals.
• Clearly communicates a vision.
• Sets a good example.
• Expects the best from the team.
• Encourages.
• Supports.
• Recognizes good work and people.
• Provides stimulating work.
• Helps people see beyond their self-interests and focus more on team interests and needs.
• Inspires.
In short, transformational leaders are exceptionally motivating, and they're trusted. When your team trusts you, and is really "fired up" by the way you lead, you can achieve great things!


With that in mind, do you see aggression as a positive or negative trait in a D-type? Do you see a difference between aggressive behavior and assertive actions and attitude?

Yeah, it's a bit off my original topic but I feel it still ties into the idea of styles, be they d-type or s-type.

I see it as a positive.
Aggression for me is just a higher degree of assertiveness.
People put negative connotations on the word because of personal experiences I suppose but an aggressive person can be all of those things you've listed as well.

Most times we picture highly aggressive people beating up others to get what they want and that's not to say it doesn't happen, yet it's not the case for all of us.

Some people will see bad no matter what because of past influences. Meaning they'll tie aggressive behavior in with physical violence or bullying in some way emotionally. Doing whatever it takes to get what you want which could include going against a code of conduct..or hell maybe they don't even have a code of conduct.

Just isn't the case

P.S. Don't buy into the word inspiration when applying to human beings but that's another discussion.




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:25:08 PM)

I know this is probably confusing some people because on one hand I'm saying it can be a positive and on the other hand I'm saying I don't find aggressiveness attractive in a mate, right?

Here's why: Although it is positive for me it rarely has been in a mate..not only that but I love the tender side of my female and enjoy the beauty that some women have to offer that is rarely seen from any other source. It's intoxicating.
Literally getting shivers thinking about it. I'm a tender person but it's a males tenderness...for me that's not the same as a I've seen some women be.

There's a beauty in those timid and shy personalities that's pure oxygen to me.




Twoshoes -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:29:33 PM)

Why is literally half this thread about ICarys?

I like assertive or aggressive women. Timid and shy wouldn't work.




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:34:10 PM)

Never have understood why people say that. How is it about me when I am but one person that posts on it?

Others make it about me by saying stuff like that I think. Which to me is telling about them actually.




BonesFromAsh -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:44:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Twoshoes

Why is literally half this thread about ICarys?



For me, it isn't. It's about his approach to the topic.




BonesFromAsh -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:53:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

I see it as a positive.
Aggression for me is just a higher degree of assertiveness.
People put negative connotations on the word because of personal experiences I suppose but an aggressive person can be all of those things you've listed as well.


True, which is why I held off with offering a definition in my original post. "Boldy assertive"....I got hung up on that. Do you see bold assertiveness as a positive trait in s-types or do you see it as a mainly d-type characteristic?

FYI...those questions are open to everyone...hint hint.


quote:


Most times we picture highly aggressive people beating up others to get what they want and that's not to say it doesn't happen, yet it's not the case for all of us.

Some people will see bad no matter what because of past influences. Meaning they'll tie aggressive behavior in with physical violence or bullying in some way emotionally. Doing whatever it takes to get what you want which could include going against a code of conduct..or hell maybe they don't even have a code of conduct.

Just isn't the case


I can see your point here, but I'm going to have to mull over it for a bit. I do know that the idea of going against my personal code of conduct to succeed with my goal doesn't sit too comfortably with me.


quote:


P.S. Don't buy into the word inspiration when applying to human beings but that's another discussion.


I might just have to bring up that discussion.




BonesFromAsh -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:56:26 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tantriqu

Yeah . . . no . . .
When I read a profile that yells 'You'll have to make me submit/take me down/out-dominate me', I yawn at the smell of a 'do me dom', smart-ass masochist or twitchy switchy in my delicate nostrils -- until I click on 'Next'!



Tantrique,

Because a person needs you to prove your dominance to them, does it follow that they would have switch tendancies? I’m asking this as a person who identifies as a switch. I don’t expect a partner to “prove” dominance, but I do need them to inspire submission in me before, and if, I give it…which is becoming more and more difficult, btw. Would you see that as the same?




Lockit -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 12:57:51 PM)

Here is a link that clearly shows how differently aggression can be viewed. I googled aggression and this was the first link. It has a number of different uses and applications for the word.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/aggressive




DesFIP -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 1:02:51 PM)

You seem to be saying that either people are doormats or they're aggressive. I hope I was neither. I hope I was a smart woman who wanted to know that his walk matched his talk. That I was smart enough to learn enough about him to know if we were compatible, if I could trust him, if I could be happy with him.

I wasn't offering up my throat for him to rip out nor attacking him with my claws to see if he could take me. Just two people learning about each other at a pace they both felt comfortable with.




BonesFromAsh -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 1:05:32 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

You seem to be saying that either people are doormats or they're aggressive.



Nope, which is why I said

quote:


Submission comes in many different styles, this much I’m aware of. I’d like to address one in particular...


Yes, the two examples I gave are directly opposite of each other. They aren't the be all and end all of what an s-type can offer, though.




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 1:12:41 PM)

quote:

True, which is why I held off with offering a definition in my original post. "Boldy assertive"....I got hung up on that. Do you see bold asseriveness as a positive trait in s-types or do you see it as a mainly d-type characteristic?

FYI...those questions are open to everyone...hint hint.

On a personal note: No I don't see it as a positive but again this is usually because of the reasons I have listed. It can be counter productive to my way of life. I want to be the one being aggressive. That's who I am and I desire to express it.


quote:

I can see your point here, but I'm going to have to mull over it for a bit. I do know that the idea of going against my personal code of conduct to succeed with my goal doesn't sit too comfortably with me.

Well I'm the same way..Not saying I'm a saint here but I also have a code of conduct that I hold above my desire to get somewhere in life..as a matter of fact..I wouldn't feel like I actually got there if I had to go against it.

To use the gaming analogy: It would be paramount to playing one of those competitive games and using a hack to get more points so you can "win"..You aren't as good as you think you are if you have to cheat.



quote:

I might just have to bring up that discussion.

It might be interesting. You have to be very special to inspire me on a personal level. I say that with the utmost humility I swear.




Icarys -> RE: Aggression and submission (11/11/2010 1:30:54 PM)

This is an interesting topic...Where's all that assertiveness?[8D]




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