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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 3:14:18 PM   
freyjasdottir


Posts: 253
Joined: 8/29/2006
From: PA
Status: offline 		If someone hated my family or the people I associate with I think I would know fairly early on. The Sperm Donor had a bit of a shock when he first met some of my cousins as they are biracial, he either got over it quickly or had the good sense to keep his mouth shut over it if he didn't.

(in reply to lovingpet)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 4:38:01 PM   
WolfyMontgomery


Posts: 234
Joined: 9/28/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet
Something like racism is very pervasive.  I can't be hidden for long, unless of course we cover our eyes, plug our ears, and choose not to acknowledge it's existence. 


Oh, you mean like how 90% of our society does on a daily basis? =P

On topic... No, I wouldn't be with a racist guy. Jokes on the verge of racism, whatever - I like almost all humor, from sexist to everything else. I'm weird like that. But for someone who actually thinks LESS of a certain race of people than their own?
Na-uh. No.
I don't see race in most contexts, I don't care about it. If I was ever with someone who did care about it and was racist, we'd be butting heads all the time, because I'd be continually asking/telling him, "WTF is your problem? He's human, you're human. You both have dicks. You're both assholes. Get over yourself."

In something of a swinger's context - it also confuses the fuck out of me when I'm asked about doing other races and they're all, "Oh yeah, isn't it EXCITING? You're doing a black guy!" Or whatever... and the only thing I can say in reply is, "Umm... it's just a dick. What's the difference? It doesn't actually taste like chocolate or anything."


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-A Wolf of a Different Color

Fear me and my Gleaming Metal Chompers of DOOM!
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(in reply to lovingpet)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 4:58:56 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		I wouldn't be his sub.

Why would I want to be in a relationship with someone that I have such diversely different morals and values?

This one really puzzles me. I just don't understand it at all.


(in reply to lovingpet)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 5:00:31 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SAMHAIN09

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

That would not be a person I would associate with, much less in such an intimate interaction.  It's really that simple for me.

lovingpet

What if it's something you find out after being with them for a few years like oh you find a KKK ring in their things or Nazi symbol in their stuff.



This I don't get either. How are you with someone for years and not know they are a racist and have sympathy for the KKK?

I mean to me I would think my partner wasn't paying much attention to me!

(in reply to SAMHAIN09)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 5:30:50 PM   
Twoshoes


Posts: 1218
Joined: 7/27/2010
Status: offline 		Man, people hate on the poor garden gnomes and smurfs all the fucking time, man. Tis not the season for this, not the season at all, man. Fucking garden gnome racism, man. Fucking blue smurfs, man. Unbelievable.

(in reply to littlewonder)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 5:49:27 PM   
hausboy


Posts: 2360
Joined: 9/5/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SAMHAIN09

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

That would not be a person I would associate with, much less in such an intimate interaction.  It's really that simple for me.

lovingpet

What if it's something you find out after being with them for a few years like oh you find a KKK ring in their things or Nazi symbol in their stuff.



Quite honestly--I'd ask him/her about it.  Why do they have it? What does it mean to them?

One of my Doms has a copy of Mein Kampf--I saw on my first visit to the Household--I was dusting the bookshelf.  I questioned him about it--he majored in German Studies/German language, it is a part of his studies and it is a part of his career.  That was acceptable to me, and after discussing things with him, I felt comfortable to continue.  If I had found out (or if I ever find out) that he is a nazi sympathizer, antisemetic or racist-- it's over. end of story.  deal breaker.  I choose to not associate with people holding those beliefs.

(in reply to SAMHAIN09)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 5:52:33 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		I don't think you can hide being a racist. How do you hide not wanting to go to a Denzel Washington movie because he's black? How do you not mention things in the paper or comment on the interracial couple seated next to you, or sniff and won't eat there because of that.

Bigotry is not something that can be hidden. And it's not something I find attractive.


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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 6:07:51 PM   
Darkfeather


Posts: 1142
Joined: 3/13/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SAMHAIN09

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Typically, if someone is racist, it is pretty evident. It is also someone that I dont want to hang around with. Peoples is peoples. Don't matter if theyre white, black, brown, green or purple. (OK, maybe green is wierd as long as it isn't St paddy's day.)

Purple you ask? that's just a happy masochist.


Hey now!!! What's wrong with us green folks?

Yeah? Also what if they hide it because they are afraid you will leave them?



Hatred is one of those emotions you just cannot hide. Human beings are emotional creatures, we thrive by them, feed off them. Some we can control, suppress from others. But the more primal it is, the more a part of our true nature it becomes. And one of the hardest things to do, is hide one's true nature

(in reply to SAMHAIN09)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 7:04:36 PM   
gungadin09


Posts: 3232
Joined: 3/19/2010
Status: offline 		Sigh. i don't know. A lot would depend on the circumstances, but most likely i wouldn't do anything about it, besides expressing my opinion from time to time.

i've had friends and coworkers who were racist. i've never had a romantic relationship with anyone who was racist, but i guess i can't say that i never would. A lot would depend on how obnoxious they were about it, how it affected me, as well as how strong the other factors of attraction were. If everything else was going well, would i break up with Someone for being racist? Probably not, unless they were out bombing churches, or something. On the other hand, i would certainly break up with them for lying about it, hiding it from me.

i believe in accepting the whole person. i don't expect the people i'm close to, whether they be friends, lovers, family, whatever, to believe the same as me, act the same as me. In fact, many of them have very different views that i do, in terms of religion, politics, personality, interests, whatever. So, i guess i'm more tolerant of those kinds of differences. i think if someone is your friend (or lover, or Dom, or family), then they're your friend. They're not your friend (lover, Dom, family), only if they meet certain conditions.

i think people who are racist are often also stupid. And i'm not attracted to stupid people. But i've met a few racists who i thought were smart, good people, aside from the fact that they were racist. And i'm hesitant to cut them loose for that reason alone. Except for lying to me, i think there's no one thing that a person could do that would make me stop being their friend. And the same holds true for a Dom, although i don't have much experience, i've only had one Master, and not for very long. However, i think it's safe to say that the only single thing that would be a dealbreaker would be the violation of a limit.

Sigh. i think i'm gonna get roasted for this. But i stand by what i said. It is possible for people with wildly different political beliefs to be involved with each other. It is possible to like somebody, or even love them, when you don't agree with everything they think, or do, or say. And i think if you only associate with people who believe as you do, then you're doing yourself a grave disservice.

pam

(in reply to SAMHAIN09)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 7:25:56 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SAMHAIN09

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

That would not be a person I would associate with, much less in such an intimate interaction.  It's really that simple for me.

lovingpet

What if it's something you find out after being with them for a few years like oh you find a KKK ring in their things or Nazi symbol in their stuff.



Seriously? Leave. Don't look back. How do you not know after years that you are with a hood wearer for god sake?


_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



(in reply to SAMHAIN09)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 7:30:03 PM   
Daddysredhead


Posts: 23574
Joined: 11/6/2005
From: Northern (yet still part of the South) Virginia
Status: offline 		I do not handle people who have racist tendencies well at all, and wouldn't be in a relationship of any sort with them.  If they managed to keep it from me somehow, and I found out later, I'd leave.  It's just that simple.  I don't want an explanation, any kind of "reasoning" for it, nothing.  My kids are mixed, my great-nephews and great-niece are mixed, my ex husband is from overseas and he is one of my best friends, and DB is black, so I don't think anyone who knows me even a little bit would dare "go there" with me.

I had the occasion to share dinner (in a group setting) with a woman who was new to everyone but one of us in the group.  We were talking about this and that, and the new woman made a comment about a lady who was renting a room in her home.  The comment was that the lady was "lazy and black."  (yes, she whispered "black")     I almost flipped my chair over, trying to look her in the face.  I made it clear that I was not amused, showed her pictures of DB and my kids. 

In case there was any question in her mind about how repulsed I was, I waited a couple of days and sent a well-thought-out email to her stating that she should get to know her audience before she makes statements such as she did that night.  I wished her well, but can say that she will not be invited to another function where I have control over the guest list.

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(in reply to gungadin09)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 7:40:11 PM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline 		I can't imagine someone who is racist wanting to be friends with me let alone be intimate.  That is so far beyond my reality that I don't think I can wrap my mind around it. 

You see, pam, racism manifests itself in small little ways as well as big ways.  How unobservant would *I* be if I didn't notice the behavior and attitudes of someone I'm becoming close to?  There is a difference between preferences and prejudice.  I generally prefer people of a different culture than my own, but I don't feel prejudice about my own culture.  Anyone who was racist in anyway would just... I can't even write it boggles my mind so much.  LOL....

On the other hand, what is racism?  I saw the movie the Aristocrats and laughed my head off.  I was actually crying because it was so flipping funny.  Other folks would be offended by it because it is "racist, sexist, looksist, religionist, etc.".  But I didn't find it so.  I found it to be one of those things where the very open minded people can laugh at themselves and the people they love out of enjoyment rather than belittling.  "We aren't prejudice, we make jokes about everybody!"

That is the diffference I suppose for me - appreciation of difference rather than distaste of same.

best,
sunshine

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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 7:50:56 PM   
anniezz338


Posts: 1183
Joined: 8/17/2010
Status: offline 		From the people I've known in my life, the racism seems to come with how they were raised. Passed down from the generations. Desegregation was only about 60 years ago....lots of 60 somethings still running around and passing it down.

And then from bad experiences, blaming the race instead of the person responsible.

I feel racism is a learned behavior. Learned behaviors can be changed. It doesn't make them a bad person. Just as it doesn't make me a better person because I am not a racist. It's just a learned behavior.

I wouldn't instantly dismiss someone because of that without seeing if that is a behavior they would be willing to work on changing.

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(in reply to Aynne88)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 7:53:16 PM   
petmonkey


Posts: 1053
Joined: 7/7/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SAMHAIN09
what if they hide it because they are afraid you will leave them?


i agree with what people have said here: i consider it a reprehensible point of view as well as think there was a major lie of omission--dumping them is justifiable.  i've seen racism often include the terrible folly of shifting blame to an outside source which is also a red flag about their overall personality and also a possible justification for dumping someone.

If, however, the above question is taken as fact then perhaps there is a tiny part of them that sees it to be a reprehensible point of view as well, it speaks to the idea that they potentially understand another person's viewpoint on racism; not just as an unpopular, politically incorrect one and therefore something to keep under wraps to avoid flak.

Through exposure to other people, other people's ideas and other people's subcultures ignorance can change into understanding.  i've seen this occur with sexists, with homophobes, with patriotic chauvinists . . .why not a racist?
I conceivably could view it as an opportunity to help a Dom/me become a less hate-filled (and therefore less stress-filled), more educated person (never a bad thing, in my opinion).  i'd ask them to try on a new way of being for a change, at least, if i had been with them for years and had somehow stupidly missed this important piece of information (i mean, my bad after all, i can only guess this scenario could occur if  i had refused to acknowledge signs of it). 
If they absolutely refused to try it out? If they absolutely refused to see any value in what i exposed them to? If they declared me to be topping-from-the-bottom by offering them new experiences?
"Lo siento, hasta luego mi corazon."

All speculation, sorta' moot.  The overall point:  Unacceptable lies of omission?  Defining value systems in conflict with each other? Situational misunderstandings? Converse to clarify then firmly make your choices.


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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/14/2010 7:55:32 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gungadin09

It is possible for people with wildly different political beliefs to be involved with each other. It is possible to like somebody, or even love them, when you don't agree with everything they think, or do, or say. And i think if you only associate with people who believe as you do, then you're doing yourself a grave disservice.


That's true. However, there are certain things that need to be agreed on - generally the things that are most important to you. How to raise children, how to spend money, etc.

For me, this falls firmly into two areas - the sort of person I want to be associated with and the sort of beliefs I want taught my children to grow up on. I will not raise my children to be racist, therefore I will not have children with a racist. Hence: I will not be romantically involved with a racist.

It really depends on how important the issue is to you. Valyraen and I disagree about certain things regarding feminism and women's rights such as he genuinely feels that strip clubs degrade women. I don't. However neither of us much care so I go without him and he doesn't give a shit.

For other people, that would be a deal-breaker.


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Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

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(in reply to gungadin09)
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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/15/2010 7:28:12 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

That would not be a person I would associate with, much less in such an intimate interaction.  It's really that simple for me.

lovingpet



This.

As others have already said, items in possession do not make a person racist. Hell, I never gave a thought to an old set of salt and pepper shakers I was able to snag from my grandmother's house just before my dad threw them away. Then several years later I realized that having them could be seen as politically incorrect. I just see them as items I will always remember being in my grandmother's kitchen. As far as I know, my grandmother wasn't racist and I have no idea how she came to own the items.

If I wanted to be all PC, I would get rid of them. Fuck PC, they are items that remind me of my grandmother. They don't make a statement about my morals or politics. If someone is going to make a judgment call on my personal value system based upon two old pieces of kitchenware......fuck them too. My actions speak for me.


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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/15/2010 7:37:22 AM   
LadyConstanze


Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse



If I wanted to be all PC, I would get rid of them. Fuck PC, they are items that remind me of my grandmother. They don't make a statement about my morals or politics. If someone is going to make a judgment call on my personal value system based upon two old pieces of kitchenware......fuck them too. My actions speak for me.



I have an old fur coat from my great-grandmother (granny inherited it and passed it on to me), it's obviously not new (typical 30's cut) and I usually just keep it in the wardrobe, last winter was so freezing cold and so much snow, I took it out to walk the dog, some cow layed into me about wearing fur and how I must hate animals, she pities my dog... I tried to point out that we are talking about something that's roughly 80 years old, it didn't matter to her, wearing fur is wrong and I am a bad person, I should get rid of it... Shame that the lake was frozen over, I had the urge to give her a quick push, so I was forced to ask her if she knitted her leather jacket, leather boots and gloves all herself or where does she think the leather comes from... She huffed off with "That's different"


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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/15/2010 7:50:19 AM   
allthatjaz


Posts: 2878
Joined: 8/20/2008
Status: offline 		I see racist people as uneducated, ignorant fucks and I wouldn't want a relationship with an uneducated ignorant fuck.

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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/15/2010 7:52:02 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: allthatjaz

I see racist people as uneducated, ignorant fucks and I wouldn't want a relationship with an uneducated ignorant fuck.


And there you have it.

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RE: What do you do when you have a sub or dom thats rac... - 12/15/2010 8:18:14 AM   
LinnaeaBorealis


Posts: 8595
Joined: 10/5/2008
From: Insanity & beyond
Status: offline 		I don't think that I'm racist, but I suppose there are areas where it could be construed that I am. I don't know for sure, since I am white & that's how I grew up & that's the kinds of experiences I've had: as a white person in a racist society that grants more privilege to white people.

Having said that, I have experienced racist attitudes based on my preferences. When I was a teenager, I was talking to a neighbor, telling her that I really wanted to go see Harry Belafonte when he came to Seattle in concert. She called me a "nigger-lover". I was so shocked, I went home & I was hysterical. My mother, the spitting image of Brunhilde, went & straightened her out.

Desegregation laws weren't passed in this country until 1964, somewhat less than 60 years ago. And the laws didn't stop racism. They simply gave people a recourse should they experience discrimination based upon their race. I was born & raised in the Pacific Northwest, but I happened to be living in the South when President Johnson signed the Civil Rights Bill. It was an interesting summer for me.

I used to be much more tolerant of other people's actions than I am today. My thinking was that if they didn't do anything bad to me personally, I would continue a relationship with them. No matter how they treated others. I no longer feel that way. I'm much more selective of my friends & lovers. If you were in a bar & someone walked in & shot everyone there except for you, would you think that they were still ok because they hadn't done anything bad to you??

_____________________________

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Forget your perfect offering
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(in reply to sunshinemiss)
Profile   Post #: 40
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