RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (Full Version)

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Musicmystery -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 9:04:18 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

All myths are created equal here.


Well aren't you a wet blanket.

1776  means nothing then, according to you?

We are not perfect- but "form a more perfect union".


I know the difference between words and reality.

You should learn the difference between claims people make and the ones you claim they made.


Well aren't you old and bitter before it is time.  


Nope. Wrong again.



pahunkboy -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 9:51:35 AM)

Liberal Smear Machine Backfires After Gunman Found To Be Occultist, Pot-Smoking Left Winger A full scale demonization campaign against conservatives, free speech and the Second Amendment on behalf of Democrats and the establishment media in the wake of Saturday’s shootings has sensationally backfired after it emerged that gunman Jared Lee Loughner was a left-wing, pot-smoking liberal who was into dressing like the grim reaper and dabbling in the occult.



rulemylife -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 10:25:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: InvisibleBlack

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
What I despise are people who won't take a stand on anything.  People who want to sit back, hold hands, and pretend that the solutions are oh so simple.

You sit there and complain about it, then accuse others of not offering any solutions while offering absolutely nothing except your self-righteous ranting.


At this moment, what is there to take a stand on? You know why this guy went on a kill-crazy rampage? Please share that with the rest of us.

If you're creating a solution armed with only your preconceived notions or those provided to you by some talking heads on your favorite talk show - I don't want your solutions.

I don't think the solution is simple. In fact, I think the solution is so complex that the immediate knee-jerk reaction is almost certainly going to be wrong. Once I have some idea of what's behind this incident, I'll probably try and take a stab at what could be done to correct for it. I acknowledge that it's possible that nothing can be done. That happens sometimes.

If you have a solution, if you've taken a stand on this, please fill me in as to what it is. I went back and re-read this whole thread (God help me) and based on your posts, I haven't been able to determine what it is you view as an answer or as the root cause of the problem.


Then let me elaborate.

I'm not saying that this guy was conservative or liberal, but it was obviously politically motivated in some way.

And what I'm saying is the root cause of the problem is the inflammatory rhetoric that comes primarily from conservative talk shows.

When you have someone on the edge it only takes a little nudge to push them over.

Having read the whole thread for my posts, as you claim, I would have thought my position was obvious.

So either I'm not expressing myself well or you are not understanding what I have been saying. 



Hillwilliam -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 10:41:09 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Liberal Smear Machine Backfires After Gunman Found To Be Occultist, Pot-Smoking Left Winger A full scale demonization campaign against conservatives, free speech and the Second Amendment on behalf of Democrats and the establishment media in the wake of Saturday’s shootings has sensationally backfired after it emerged that gunman Jared Lee Loughner was a left-wing, pot-smoking liberal who was into dressing like the grim reaper and dabbling in the occult.

An O'Donnell supporter? [sm=ubanana.gif]



rulemylife -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 10:48:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Says the man who has a gun as his message board image.

Well unhhh, check yours. [:D]

(sorry, I couldn't resist)

K.


Hey, I didn't put it there.

Though it may be true.  [sm=insane.gif]






rulemylife -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 10:59:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: RapierFugue

You have, as a nation, a simple choice; either do something meaningful about gun ownership, rather than tinkering at the edges, or else accept these kind of events as the price of having a gun culture.


Rapier, I don't understand why you don't seem to grasp that we have made our choice. Thank you for your concern, but we're content with our decision.



Panda, usually we are in agreement on most issues but you are speaking as if everyone agrees with that point of view when you know that is not true.



Jeffff -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:02:57 AM)

I agree with Panda. We have made our choice. I am good with it too.



InvisibleBlack -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:03:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Tazzy's post above bother me A LOT.  All five charges relate to Loughner shooting fed employees.  Nothing about him shooting the others, including the nine year old girl.  Anyone know why this is the case?  Is it because these are federal charges, and charges relating to the others are filed at another level?


I'm not an attorney so I don't pretend to be an expert in these matters but, in general, murder is a state crime - unless it can be shown that the murderer crossed state lines or entered into a conspiracy to commit muder that crossed state lines. That's when the FBI gets involved. So shooting a random person in a grocery store is not a Federal crime, it is a state crime.

I believe that shooting a Federal employee is a Federal crime, and that's likely why the only charges brought so far are the Federal ones. I suspect very shortly the state of Arizona will bring a raft of charges against the shooter as well.

I also believe that Federal charges have precedence over state ones, but I could be mistaken about that.



Musicmystery -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:03:25 AM)

No, he's saying that people have made their choice.



rulemylife -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:12:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

its all gossip and parlor talk!

bunch of window watchers playing government and they do not even know the facts.  (if that is even possible in todays world of spin and lies.)

I have said several times much of this thread is enough to make me puke.



Well, paybacks are a bitch.

I tend to to hug the porcelain goddess frequently after reading most of your posts.



rulemylife -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:20:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

No, he's saying that people have made their choice.


I interpreted the "we" as speaking for the country as a whole.





CreativeDominant -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:25:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

Our constitution should be updated to say that "All Humans are created equal".
Why?  There've been plenty of laws since the Constitution recognizing the equality of women.

Unless you just want the document to be politically correct?



Lucylastic -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:28:50 AM)

THe Beck has spoken
http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/201101100011

is there one word of the whole thing that rings as true?
after all his diatribes? her "dont retreat, reload?"
Can you imagine the field day that would have been had  if the shooter had been an *eeebil moooslem*
Ms Giffords felt the danger
Even though it was Rep. Gabrielle Giffords herself who warned after being targeted in Palin's crosshairs:
I mean, this is a situation where -- I mean, people don't -- they really need to realize that the rhetoric and firing people up and, you know, even things, for example, we're on Sarah Palin's targeted list. But the thing is that the way that she has it depicted has the crosshairs of a gunsight over our district. When people do that, they've gotta realize there's consequences to that action.

I just read this page too so that could be something to do with it
http://www.csgv.org/issues-and-campaigns/guns-democracy-and-freedom/insurrection-timeline.

That was after I read malkins page and now I feel physically sick

Edited to add.that I had indeed read the malkin segment to open my ears to both sides
blech





CreativeDominant -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:36:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: RapierFugue

You have, as a nation, a simple choice; either do something meaningful about gun ownership, rather than tinkering at the edges, or else accept these kind of events as the price of having a gun culture.


Rapier, I don't understand why you don't seem to grasp that we have made our choice. Thank you for your concern, but we're content with our decision.



Panda, usually we are in agreement on most issues but you are speaking as if everyone agrees with that point of view when you know that is not true.

Actually, I would say you are right only in Panda's use of the general "we".  A majority of voters are content with the decision to allow a culture in which the citizens have the right to keep and bear arms.  That results in some occasions like this nutcase over the weekend.  The price of freedom...

As for your earlier assertion re:  this being due to the inflammatory rhetoric of right-wing conservatives?  See my post regarding that...and listen to anyone with sense.  Free speech is just that...free speech.  While I may not like what Hillary or Obama or Olbermann or Michael Moore have to say, as long as they are not inciting left-wing riots they have a right to say it.  Ward Churchill, with his call to take to the streets, may be a different case.  I don't agree with all that Beck or Limbaugh or G. Will have to say either, but as long as they are not encouraging violence...and don't run through that tired bullshit about Palin's crosshairs, please...they have a right to say it.  This nut was responsible for his own actions...and given that his favorite reading material, as reported by various folks in the mass media, seemed to be centered around the Communist Manifesto and one of his favorite activities appeared to be smoking pot, the argument could be made that he is more left than right.  From there, it would be just as easy to cite "leftist" sources for his dissatisfaction with a "progressive" who did not stand far enough to the left...and it would be a wrong citation. 



Musicmystery -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:41:22 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

No, he's saying that people have made their choice.


I interpreted the "we" as speaking for the country as a whole.




When all the people have made their choice, that IS the country as a whole's decision.

We call it democracy.



philosophy -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:45:07 AM)

"A majority of voters are content with the decision to allow a culture in which the citizens have the right to keep and bear arms. That results in some occasions like this nutcase over the weekend. The price of freedom... "

.....then anytime you feel like it, how about you mosey on over to the parents of the kid that was killed, you know the kid that was born on 9/11. Then you look them in the eye and tell them that their daughters murder is a price for freedom that you're apparently happy to pay.

Let me know how that goes.




Lucylastic -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:50:01 AM)

Mr Philo, how nice to see you posting again:)  Hope you are well
Hijack over




cuckoldmepls -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:51:00 AM)

Free men own guns, slaves don't. In England they could line you people up and execute you one by one, and there's not a damn thing you can do about it.

http://babelishere.webs.com/guncontrol.html



philosophy -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:51:59 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Mr Philo, how nice to see you posting again:)  Hope you are well
Hijack over




.....i just popped in to see what had changed........



....bugger all :D



Lucylastic -> RE: Arizona Democrat Congresswoman and 11 others shot (1/10/2011 11:52:56 AM)

wtf are you talking about, when was the last time any english "authority" lined anynone up and shot them for owning a gun
you are in freakin lala land



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