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Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 12:58:26 PM

butynbrains

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i have been lucky enough to experience (in the past) a loving D/s relationship in which there was ABSOLUTE honesty. Previous to that relationship i had only vanilla relationships, but in those i would have said i was pretty honest. Once i experienced *absolute* honesty in a relationship i saw the difference was night and day. For me, absolute honesty in the relationship isn't simply a "perk" of a D/s relationship, its a necessity.

Do you find that you agree? Within a relationship that professes to be based on honesty (not solely, but as a core value) are there lies you can forgive or would anything not completely honest be reason to move on/end the relationship? i think it is prob diff if you're getting to know someone vs. already in a long term, committed relationship, but perhaps not. Looking forward to hearing others thoughts :).

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 1:09:47 PM

Arpig

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It depends on the lie.

A lie to cover up the preparations for a surprise party....Kiss and thanks

A major lie about something big...bubye

A little white lie...lets sit down and discuss why you feel you had to hide that

_____________________________

Big man! Pig Man!
Ha Ha...Charade you are!

Why do they leave out the letter b on "Garage Sale" signs?

CM's #1 All-Time Also-Ran

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 1:11:27 PM

FukinTroll

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I am mean and unforgiving in that department. Integrity is very important to me.

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 1:22:50 PM

myotherself

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I'm with the Troll on this one.

Experience has shown me that if someone will lie to me once about something important, then they'll have no problem doing it again. I can't live like that.

Honesty is so important to me that if I judge a lie to be serious enough, then I will walk away from that person.

But I think an important point here is the judgement of the recipient/victim of this lie. And of course, YMMV

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 2:14:12 PM

IrishMist

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As others have already mentioned, it depends on the lie, and the reason behind it.

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 2:14:26 PM

FukinTroll

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quote:

ORIGINAL: myotherself

I'm with the Troll on this one.

Experience has shown me that if someone will lie to me once about something important, then they'll have no problem doing it again. I can't live like that.

Honesty is so important to me that if I judge a lie to be serious enough, then I will walk away from that person.

But I think an important point here is the judgement of the recipient/victim of this lie. And of course, YMMV

I must admit to some hypocrisy here... had to break the news to my oldest that Santa wasn't real. But he is 17 now and I have to spend winters away so I needed a replacement Santa.

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The Mods have me on speed Spank!! Gotta luv'em.

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 2:17:48 PM

dcnovice

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quote:

Any Lies You Can Forgive?

You look like you've lost weight.

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No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 2:17:50 PM

TotalDiscipline

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for me

-depends on my mood
-depends on who lies
-depends on the reason

< Message edited by TotalDiscipline -- 3/12/2011 2:18:29 PM >

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Love is the law, love under will.

shorten your answers to the essence

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 2:23:23 PM

JstAnotherSub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll

I must admit to some hypocrisy here... had to break the news to my oldest that Santa wasn't real. But he is 17 now and I have to spend winters away so I needed a replacement Santa.

Omg you take that back! Santa is real....you just don't have a chimney at your bridge!

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yep

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 2:25:01 PM

FukinTroll

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: FukinTroll

I must admit to some hypocrisy here... had to break the news to my oldest that Santa wasn't real. But he is 17 now and I have to spend winters away so I needed a replacement Santa.

Omg you take that back! Santa is real....you just don't have a chimney at your bridge!

Yep, you're right. It was a cruel lie to make DS shine even brighter.
*Hangs my head in shame*
SLURP~

_____________________________

I'm the guy your girl is thinking about when she is fucking you!

TrollTopia
Greedy Groupie!

The Mods have me on speed Spank!! Gotta luv'em.

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 2:38:15 PM

littlewonder

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a couple weeks ago while I'm talking on the phone with Master about his day of hiking and getting lost and I'm walking into my driveway as a car revs up behind me almost hitting me, I'm yelling into the phone to Master about it and he laughs maniacally...it was him surprising me with a visit.

Yeah I forgave him.

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 3:23:22 PM

porcelaine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: butynbrains

Within a relationship that professes to be based on honesty (not solely, but as a core value) are there lies you can forgive or would anything not completely honest be reason to move on/end the relationship?

Greetings,

My relationships are founded upon one principle that serves as the figurehead and everything falls under it. He leads and I follow. And I don't find a lot of wiggle room available from that perspective. I will posit that I am referencing partnerships that have fostered a mutual desire for maintaining the structure. That includes the necessity of each person staying put. If shortcomings or other life events are significant enough to lead to our undoing, we must sincerely consider if our original engagement was wisely undertaken. The test of my tether will never be forged in happy moments. It's the instances where checking out is frustratingly forsaken in deference to the greater thing that's teetering in its wake.

Do I want honesty? Yes. Am I at liberty to say what I will or won't forgive in one breath and proclaim my station in the next? Absolutely not. I am either his slave and enslaved or merely an autonomous slave that he owns. In my mind one cannot be on both sides of the divide. If I am living my life according to another person's standard, then I have to accept that is going to involve some disappointment and probably a bit of pain as well.

What it truly boils down to is whether I'm willing to accept that my idea of perfection did not unfold as hoped. Can I see him or am I still attempting to fashion him into something he never was? Can I serve in the midst of the unthinkable? Or is my kneel predicated on continued comfort and the omission of life's interruption? In the end I am either serving him or myself. Because when I serve him we both benefit. And if I find that is not the case, I need to go back to the drawing board and consider what inspired me to embark on 'that' journey in the first place.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 3:24:40 PM

butynbrains

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Thanks for sharing your thoughts, everyone :)

(in reply to littlewonder)

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 3:46:42 PM

preytolife

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From: LaLa Land
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Depends on the lie, the reason behind it, the intention/feelings behind it. I could conceivably understand and in some cases forgive a well intentioned lie, provided we talked about it... but a malicious one, or major dishonesty about things I *need* to know is a deal breaker. Especially lies related to partners, sexual contact and polyamory.

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"No man is so good as to be free from all evil, nor so bad as to be worth nothing." - Norse Proverb

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 4:02:52 PM

leadership527

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quote:

ORIGINAL: butynbrains
For me, absolute honesty in the relationship isn't simply a "perk" of a D/s relationship, its a necessity.

*nods* A lot of people say that. I'm not that good of a person. On top of that, I'm not that focused on honesty. I'm more interest in "being good".

Within a relationship that professes to be based on honesty (not solely, but as a core value) are there lies you can forgive or would anything not completely honest be reason to move on/end the relationship?
I don't know. I suppose that if I were to base my relationship on absolute honesty then the first time Carol or I was dishonest it'd be over. Man, I sure am glad that is not the foundation of my relationship.

I think it is prob diff if you're getting to know someone vs. already in a long term, committed relationship, but perhaps not. Looking forward to hearing others thoughts :).
I doubt it. I think that for a wide variety of past history, some folks are focused on "absolute honesty". But I haven't had those life experiences and neither has Carol. So for us, it's just not that big of a deal. Especially not for me.. the leader. Half of leadership is "white lies".

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/12/2011 6:43:23 PM

Missokyst

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I prefer honesty.
But there are very few lies I could not forgive if I knew enough about the person and thought they were basically honest.

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pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses your understanding ~Gibran, Kahlil

“The truth is, everyone is going to hurt you. You just got to find the ones worth suffering for.”
― Bob Marley

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/13/2011 8:40:03 AM

StrongSpirit

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I could forgive someone cheating if they told me about it immediately.
I could forgive a white lie, told to protect me. ("Why yes dear, you are the best lover I have ever had!")
I could not forgive a brown lie told to trick me ("Can we split the check?" - but if you say yes, I will secretly think you are cheap.)
I could not forgive any lie told to protect the liar.

(in reply to Missokyst)

Post #: 17

RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/13/2011 9:02:00 AM

DesFIP

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From: Apple County NY
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I told him in the beginning that if he was going to shoot the messenger when he heard something he didn't like, expect the messenger to lie for reasons of self defense.

In other words, if he really did want honesty, then he had to be able to hear it without attacking me because I had hurt his feelings by telling him that he made a mistake.

Now at the same time, there's no reason to say "you look like an overstuffed pig in that shirt". You can always say "That shirt doesn't flatter you at all, I'd put it into the donate pile". The result is the same but no one's feelings are savaged in the process.

So if you're using absolute honesty as an excuse to be as nasty as possible, which is what people usually mean by this, then no thanks.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/13/2011 9:18:28 AM

Arpig

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From: Increasingly further from reality
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quote:

In other words, if he really did want honesty, then he had to be able to hear it without attacking me because I had hurt his feelings by telling him that he made a mistake.

I agree...I often tell people not to ask questions they don't want to hear the answer to.

_____________________________

Big man! Pig Man!
Ha Ha...Charade you are!

Why do they leave out the letter b on "Garage Sale" signs?

CM's #1 All-Time Also-Ran

(in reply to DesFIP)

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RE: Any Lies You Can Forgive? - 3/13/2011 9:57:58 AM

sexyred1

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I hate to break it to the OP, but everyone lies. We just had an interesting thread on this recently, so I doubt any relationship involves absolute honesty for all the reasons above.

White lies, lies protecting someone, being gracious instead of bluntly nasty, those types of things can be forgiven.

Other lies are not.

Can I forgive lies? No. I tried to forget so I could remain, but once the lies became so much that they destroyed the trust that was the foundation of the relationship, that was it.

(in reply to Arpig)

Post #: 20

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