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RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 5:01:46 PM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline

Think the real key to this whole change in the face of the country is how it is going to affect politcs. The south and southwest saw the largest pickups in minority citizens. Those Red states are going to have to either adjust their stance in regards to minorities or find themselves decidedly purple in color. Policies in relation to Latin and South America will be change drastically from what they are now. Dare say the same for Asia. Our lean towards Europe will come to an end........

(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 121

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 5:16:24 PM

zenny

Posts: 275
Joined: 2/13/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

I will amend my last statement. Diversity does give us good ethnic restaurants. However an excellent Thai restaurant in every city is hardly something to have national concern over.

Taking your thought to its logical end point there should be no such thing as Thai rest. or a Italian rest. There should only be american cuisine. Silly?

You and others still continue to not understand Aylee. Also, that statement is already at its end. In fact, your conclusion is the exact opposite of what Aylee's.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

Think the real key to this whole change in the face of the country is how it is going to affect politcs. The south and southwest saw the largest pickups in minority citizens. Those Red states are going to have to either adjust their stance in regards to minorities or find themselves decidedly purple in color. Policies in relation to Latin and South America will be change drastically from what they are now. Dare say the same for Asia. Our lean towards Europe will come to an end........

You misunderstand. I would say most schisms in politics regarding minorities is whether or not to give them special privileges (typically in incentives or exemptions). This is also the source of most of the discordance between the majority and those minorities and the source of the "us vs. them" attitude.

(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 122

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 5:17:59 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

I will amend my last statement. Diversity does give us good ethnic restaurants. However an excellent Thai restaurant in every city is hardly something to have national concern over.

Taking your thought to its logical end point there should be no such thing as Thai rest. or a Italian rest. There should only be american cuisine. Silly?

No, that is not what I said. Taking my point to its logical ends tells you that I like ethnic cuisine.

Taking my thoughts to their logical end says that I believe in merit. I am very much anti-judging people by their race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality.

If you apply for a job at my company, do you want me to hire you based on your merit? Or would you rather I make my judgment about you based on your sex and skin color? (Two things I can tell from your picture.)

You have lots of posters on this thread that think the important things about a person are their race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality.

I am not one of those people. I see no reason to focus on them. I see no reason to celebrate them. They are not things you get a choice over. I might as well celebrate my eye color or the genes that make up my body size.

Do you really think people sit back and say, "Thank g*d Ian McKellen is gay. Otherwise X-Men would have sucked."

Do you think Gene Roddenberry said, "Oh, and get me a gay Asian man and an olive Russian for the cast!"

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 123

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 5:25:52 PM

thishereboi

Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

I don't know spanish but I am positive I could learn it. We are the only country on earth that is too lazy to learn another language. Its pathetic.

How many languages do you speak?

Did you miss my question dyb, I am really curious?

_____________________________

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This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi

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Post #: 124

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 5:32:35 PM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline

Me, I speak only one. I dabble in french and know enough to get myself in trouble. I point at myself as much as anyone else. It is a disgrace that I hope I can change.

(in reply to thishereboi)

Post #: 125

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 5:38:32 PM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

I will amend my last statement. Diversity does give us good ethnic restaurants. However an excellent Thai restaurant in every city is hardly something to have national concern over.

Taking your thought to its logical end point there should be no such thing as Thai rest. or a Italian rest. There should only be american cuisine. Silly?

No, that is not what I said. Taking my point to its logical ends tells you that I like ethnic cuisine.

Taking my thoughts to their logical end says that I believe in merit. I am very much anti-judging people by their race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality.

If you apply for a job at my company, do you want me to hire you based on your merit? Or would you rather I make my judgment about you based on your sex and skin color? (Two things I can tell from your picture.)

You have lots of posters on this thread that think the important things about a person are their race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality.

I am not one of those people. I see no reason to focus on them. I see no reason to celebrate them. They are not things you get a choice over. I might as well celebrate my eye color or the genes that make up my body size.

Do you really think people sit back and say, "Thank g*d Ian McKellen is gay. Otherwise X-Men would have sucked."

Do you think Gene Roddenberry said, "Oh, and get me a gay Asian man and an olive Russian for the cast!"

No you specifically said that you are against diversity. That it shouldn't be highlighted or even mentioned. Therefore there shouldn't be a variety of eating places. They should be just one. Otherwise that would be pointing out the "specialness" of the various eating places if they weren't homogenous. Either you stand behind what you wrote or not.

Which is all not on the point anyway. There is no way you can stop what is happening unless you can change birth rates of whites in this country. Simple as that. The effects on everything is going to be far reaching.

(in reply to Aylee)

Post #: 126

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 5:40:38 PM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: zenny

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

I will amend my last statement. Diversity does give us good ethnic restaurants. However an excellent Thai restaurant in every city is hardly something to have national concern over.

Taking your thought to its logical end point there should be no such thing as Thai rest. or a Italian rest. There should only be american cuisine. Silly?

You and others still continue to not understand Aylee. Also, that statement is already at its end. In fact, your conclusion is the exact opposite of what Aylee's.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

Think the real key to this whole change in the face of the country is how it is going to affect politcs. The south and southwest saw the largest pickups in minority citizens. Those Red states are going to have to either adjust their stance in regards to minorities or find themselves decidedly purple in color. Policies in relation to Latin and South America will be change drastically from what they are now. Dare say the same for Asia. Our lean towards Europe will come to an end........

You misunderstand. I would say most schisms in politics regarding minorities is whether or not to give them special privileges (typically in incentives or exemptions). This is also the source of most of the discordance between the majority and those minorities and the source of the "us vs. them" attitude.

No, I am positive of what she wrote. She is not for diversity. She is for sameness. The end point of sameness is looking, sounding, eating and working all alike. Is it not?

And if you don't think changing demographics effects politics.....well....leaves me speechless

(in reply to zenny)

Post #: 127

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 6:08:02 PM

zenny

Posts: 275
Joined: 2/13/2008
Status: offline

You have the poster telling you that you're wrong and explaining it. Good luck with that. She's not for sameness by the way, she's for meritocracy.

I'll now explain. I'm commenting on a source and saying the source will remain regardless of the outcome. You're saying and outcome may happen. It's similar to treating the symptoms vs. treating the disease.

You, like others, are very good at reading what you want and not what is there.

(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 128

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 6:27:33 PM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline

Like other things in the country you are free to be wrong....which you are.

Her original was Nope. I am tired of celebrating diversity. I do not think that it is even healthy to do so.

Celebrating diversity means celebrating differences. So first those differences have to be enumerated. Which leads to stereotyping and pigeon-holing people into some one-dimensional view.

It also sets up an Us versus Them mentality. You see it all the time and does not lead to harmony and happiness. It leads to the demonization of the "other."

She is saying directly that she isn't for diversity. Isn't means not for. Are you starting to catch on?

(in reply to zenny)

Post #: 129

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 8:27:01 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

The second consists of non-functional or status diversity. It is not useful. I see no reason to celebrate it.

Aylee, the example you gave to illustrate what you call "non-functional or status diversity" is not "non-functional or status diversity" - it is just plain stupidity. When I hear of someone attempting to build a house using just plumbers, I will give your claim serious consideration.

Do you have a serious example of what you mean by this? By serious I mean something that is not a strawman-type example, not contrived and likely to occur in the real world.

Between now and then ('cause I fear I might be waiting a while for your example) could you offer an example of any area of human behaviour where human performance is not characterised by diversity as requested?

If you are unable to offer such an example, do you then agree that a fundamental characteristic of human behaviour is its diversity?

Again, there are TWO types of diversity here. Useful and non-useful.

If I am going to build a house I am only interested in one type. Can you do the job I need you to do? So, I need a plumber, an electrician, yadda, yadda.

I am not interested in hiring someone based on race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality.

Celebrating an achievement is one thing. YAY! You made it through boot camp!

Celebrating your genes is ridiculous. YAY! My genes give me a skinnier body than you!

So have fun judging and placing value you on people because of their skin color or religion or sexual partner. Don't ask me to join in.

Unable or unwilling to provide a single serious example of your cherished "non-useful" diversity Aylee.

Unable or unwilling to abandon your strawman example.

Unable or unwilling to nominate a single instance of human behaviour/endeavour that isn't characterised by diversity.

Unable or unwilling to resolve the contradictions pointed out in your position.

Unable or unwilling to answer whether diversity is a fundamental feature of human behaviour of not.

Instead a series of comical attempts at a comical defence of a comical (mis)understanding/caricature of diversity. This position screams denial to me.

The diversity of life, of humans, of human behaviour, of Nature is all around us every second of every day. We can choose to recognise it, or choose to deny it. Like kids caught with their hands in the cookie jar who deny stealing the cookies, those who choose denial are only fooling themselves. Ultimately they are the only losers.

It is obvious that I am unable to communicate with you.

I do not think that making a personal judgment on someone based on race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality is useful.

You believe that it is.

I hope you enjoy your time deciding just who is a worthwhile person based on the color of their skin, their first language, how old they are, if they are an innie or an outie, where they grew up and who they want to fuck.

I think that is rather hate-filled and ugly, but it is your life and your decision.

Good luck with that.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 130

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 8:29:56 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

No you specifically said that you are against diversity.

No. I have repeatedly said that celebrating diversity is bad.

Like tweakabelle, I hope you enjoy your time deciding just who is a worthwhile person based on the color of their skin, their first language, how old they are, if they are an innie or an outie, where they grew up and who they want to fuck.

I think that is rather hate-filled and ugly, but it is your life and your decision.

Good luck with that.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 131

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 8:47:02 PM

Charles6682

Posts: 1820
Joined: 10/1/2007
From: Saint Pete,FL
Status: offline

You have to forgive RacistJim,he does not know any better.

America's face looked just fine before the invasion of illegal Hispanics/Latinos and Muslims began.

_____________________________

Charley aka Sub Guy

http://www.Facebook.com/SubGuy

https://Twitter.com/SubGuy6682

(in reply to RacerJim)

Post #: 132

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 8:52:43 PM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

I do not have to forgive racistjim anything at all.He is what he is....and decent intelligent people should shun and ridicule him for it at every turn.
The world has moved forward...shall we slow down in hopes the assholes will catch up.....not as far as I'm concerned.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to Charles6682)

Post #: 133

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 8:55:21 PM

zenny

Posts: 275
Joined: 2/13/2008
Status: offline

How are you getting "I am tired of diversity" from "I am tired of celebrating diversity"?

Are you trolling or genuinely unable to understand her statements? If you just missed the word previously and feel committed, hey, it happens. Though I would really like to know.

(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 134

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 9:09:09 PM

tweakabelle

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

No you specifically said that you are against diversity.

No. I have repeatedly said that celebrating diversity is bad.

Like tweakabelle, I hope you enjoy your time deciding just who is a worthwhile person based on the color of their skin, their first language, how old they are, if they are an innie or an outie, where they grew up and who they want to fuck.

I think that is rather hate-filled and ugly, but it is your life and your decision.

Good luck with that.

When I said that I agreed totally with your statement that:
"I do not feel that color, religion, sex, et cetera are important. I do think that focusing on these kinds of differences creates problems. It is just surface crap that has nothing to do with your abilities or worth as a person." (post #103 previous page this thread)
which bit did you fail to understand?

Please don't attribute views to me which are clearly not mine, especially when i have specifically expressed my agreement with the opposite of the views you are attributing falsely to me.

I find it difficult to dream up good reasons for such intellectual sloppiness.

_____________________________

(in reply to Aylee)

Post #: 135

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 9:17:00 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

DYB, I get the impression that "those people" are telling us that they're going to sneak into our country whether we like it or not and that we can go fuck ourselves!
Am I close?

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 3/27/2011 9:18:01 PM >

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 136

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 9:18:14 PM

Charles6682

Posts: 1820
Joined: 10/1/2007
From: Saint Pete,FL
Status: offline

I know slvemike,I agree.I was just kidding.People like RacistJim are stuck in their way and I wouldn't waste my time waiting for him to move forward.That is his problem,not mine.

_____________________________

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https://Twitter.com/SubGuy6682

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 137

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 9:34:59 PM

tweakabelle

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

The second consists of non-functional or status diversity. It is not useful. I see no reason to celebrate it.

Aylee, the example you gave to illustrate what you call "non-functional or status diversity" is not "non-functional or status diversity" - it is just plain stupidity. When I hear of someone attempting to build a house using just plumbers, I will give your claim serious consideration.

Do you have a serious example of what you mean by this? By serious I mean something that is not a strawman-type example, not contrived and likely to occur in the real world.

Between now and then ('cause I fear I might be waiting a while for your example) could you offer an example of any area of human behaviour where human performance is not characterised by diversity as requested?

If you are unable to offer such an example, do you then agree that a fundamental characteristic of human behaviour is its diversity?

Again, there are TWO types of diversity here. Useful and non-useful.

If I am going to build a house I am only interested in one type. Can you do the job I need you to do? So, I need a plumber, an electrician, yadda, yadda.

I am not interested in hiring someone based on race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality.

Celebrating an achievement is one thing. YAY! You made it through boot camp!

Celebrating your genes is ridiculous. YAY! My genes give me a skinnier body than you!

So have fun judging and placing value you on people because of their skin color or religion or sexual partner. Don't ask me to join in.

Unable or unwilling to provide a single serious example of your cherished "non-useful" diversity Aylee.

Unable or unwilling to abandon your strawman example.

Unable or unwilling to nominate a single instance of human behaviour/endeavour that isn't characterised by diversity.

Unable or unwilling to resolve the contradictions pointed out in your position.

Unable or unwilling to answer whether diversity is a fundamental feature of human behaviour of not.

Instead a series of comical attempts at a comical defence of a comical (mis)understanding/caricature of diversity. This position screams denial to me.

The diversity of life, of humans, of human behaviour, of Nature is all around us every second of every day. We can choose to recognise it, or choose to deny it. Like kids caught with their hands in the cookie jar who deny stealing the cookies, those who choose denial are only fooling themselves. Ultimately they are the only losers.

It is obvious that I am unable to communicate with you.

I do not think that making a personal judgment on someone based on race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality is useful.

You believe that it is.

I hope you enjoy your time deciding just who is a worthwhile person based on the color of their skin, their first language, how old they are, if they are an innie or an outie, where they grew up and who they want to fuck.

I think that is rather hate-filled and ugly, but it is your life and your decision.

Good luck with that.

You don't find it difficult to communicate with me. You refuse to.

You refuse to answer any question put to you. You attribute totally fictitious views to me, views I despise and reject totally and have done so consistently for as long as you have known me. Views I specifically rejected as recently as a few hours ago. Views I find offensive to the core.

If you haven't the intellectual or moral honesty to deal with questions you don't like that is your problem. To maliciously attribute hate to me to cover your own cowardice tells me much more than I need to know about you. I had long suspected your views were rooted in fear ignorance and insecurity. You have just demonstrated my suspicions were correct.

I feel so so sorry for you.

_____________________________

(in reply to Aylee)

Post #: 138

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 9:46:29 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

When I said that I agreed totally with your statement that:
"I do not feel that color, religion, sex, et cetera are important. I do think that focusing on these kinds of differences creates problems. It is just surface crap that has nothing to do with your abilities or worth as a person." (post #103 previous page this thread)
which bit did you fail to understand?

The part where if they are not really important we should celebrate them. Call it dissonance.

quote:

Please don't attribute views to me which are clearly not mine, especially when i have specifically expressed my agreement with the opposite of the views you are attributing falsely to me.

You keep attributing malice to me because I see no point and actually a danger to being pleased with attributes an individual has no control over.

quote:

I find it difficult to dream up good reasons for such intellectual sloppiness.

Probably for the same reason that you have never explained why cholera is bad.

A belief that non-functional diversity adds to ability is bad.

Going back to the house building. Being black does not make you a better electrician. Being female does not make a better plumber. Being Jewish does not help to make a window frame. You can continue with this.

Celebrating those things means that they actually make a difference in a persons ability.

If I need my new house wired, what is important is that the person I hire is a competent electrician. The celebrating of ones non-controllable attributes does not factor in. Nor should it.

Yet you have repeatedly insisted that it is these differences that make the human race so wonderful.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 139

RE: The changing face of America - 3/27/2011 10:09:25 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle
Unable or unwilling to provide a single serious example of your cherished "non-useful" diversity Aylee.

You ask me to prove a negative. I cannot think of a single example for this century where being male or female, black or white, hetero or homo, et cetera, makes a difference in that persons worth or ability to do a job.

quote:

Unable or unwilling to abandon your straw-man example.

Less strawman than trying to make you see that there is a diversity of ability and a diversity of attribute.

quote:

Unable or unwilling to nominate a single instance of human behavior/endeavor that isn't characterized by diversity.

Damn straight I can't. That would mean that I would think that race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality had anything to do with the ability to perform a function or job. Being pregnant is something outside this.

quote:

Unable or unwilling to resolve the contradictions pointed out in your position.

What contradiction? That celebrating something that a person has no control over is idiotic and serves no purpose but to divide people into them and us? I really see no contradiction there.

quote:

Unable or unwilling to answer whether diversity is a fundamental feature of human behavior of not.

Here you go, yes humans group themselves according to race, language, age, sex, culture and hetero/homosexuality. I do not think that is healthy.

quote:

Instead a series of comical attempts at a comical defence of a comical (mis)understanding/caricature of diversity. This position screams denial to me.

Denial is refusing to see the analogy. One type of diversity is useful, one type is not.

quote:

The diversity of life, of humans, of human behavior, of Nature is all around us every second of every day. We can choose to recognize it, or choose to deny it. Like kids caught with their hands in the cookie jar who deny stealing the cookies, those who choose denial are only fooling themselves. Ultimately they are the only losers.

This topic has never been about individuals' positive and negative skill-sets.

This discussion has been about celebrating or not, attributes of an individual that they have no control over.

Are people different? Well, yes. Does having or not having a penis make that difference? Not in a meaningful way. Does whether a person having black skin versus white skin make them different? Yes. Not in a meaningful way. Does a person having a big nose versus a small nose make them different? Yes. Not in a meaningful way.

You will never convince me that those things should make a difference.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 140

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