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RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 9:51:55 AM

ArtCatDom

Posts: 478
Joined: 1/20/2005
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Just an interesting thought to follow up on your post.

In the Quran when discussing judgement it asserts that Allah will judge no one by any burden greater than they can bear. That is to say, you will only be judged on what you have the capacity to understand. Allah will not turn you away because in an honest search you guessed wrong. It's the honest search that matters.

The Bible is peppered with similar assertions. (For example: Paul when discussing those who had no received the Gospel or proper rendition of it claims they will be judged by their conscience (for right and wrong are written on the heart), akin to the Egyptian weighing of ma'at.)

Just a thought.

*meow*

(in reply to NeedToUseYou)

Post #: 81

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 11:23:48 AM

ArtCatDom

Posts: 478
Joined: 1/20/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gooddogbenji

ArtCatDom,

I very rarely get to read your posts, as I stay out of most serious threads, but when I do, I am amazed at your knowledge. Okay, you may be full of shit, as I have no way to verify what you're saying, but no one else argues with your facts, so I assume you are not.

Just thought I'd mention it.

Yours (provided you don't mind a dog... LOL),

benji

I will certainly admit I'm not always right. :-P If you're interested in references regarding Allah as the Judeo-Christian God, I'd be glad to provide them.

*meow*

(in reply to gooddogbenji)

Post #: 82

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 11:34:17 AM

ArtCatDom

Posts: 478
Joined: 1/20/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittensmailbox

quote:

I will note though that Allah is the God of the Jews and Christians. Arabic speaking Jews and Christians say "Allah" just as the Muslims do. It's just a word for God. The Quran itself acknlowedges the God of the Prophets Abraham, Moses and Jesus is the God of the Quran.

*meow*

Cat, Allah is not the God of Christains, we just call Him God....

God is just an English word. People who use other languages don't say "God". French speakers say "Dieu". Spanish speakers will say "Dios". Arabic speakers will say "Allah".

From Wikipedia:
"Allah is the Arabic term for "God" in Abrahamic religions, specifically the main term for God in Islam.

Both non-Arabic speaking and Arabic speaking Muslims and also Arab Christians and Jews (including the Teimanim, several Mizraḥi communities and some Sephardim) use it as the proper noun 'God' is used in English. It is found both in the Qur'an and in Arabic translations of the Bible. In the Qur'an, it refers to The Only God."

"If so, the word Allāh is an abbreviated title, meaning 'the deity', rather than a name. For this reason, both Muslim and non-Muslim scholars often translate Allāh directly into English as 'God'; this also explains why Arabic-speaking Jews and Christians freely refer to God as Allāh." [emphesis added]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allah

Please also check this link regarding the myriad names of the Judeo-Christian (Abrahamic) God.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God#Names_of_God

You can doublecheck this information in most Introduction to Theology or Introduction to Abrahamic Religion textbooks, as well as other encyclopedias.

*meow*

(in reply to kittensmailbox)

Post #: 83

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 11:37:18 AM

kittensmailbox

Posts: 744
Joined: 1/7/2005
From: Youngstown, Ohio
Status: offline

i just call him God, but since you seem to know so much more then i do. i will just have to assume that you know more about my own beliefs, more then i do....

_____________________________

~softly smiles

~lowers her eyes in respect~

~kitten

(in reply to ArtCatDom)

Post #: 84

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 11:53:27 AM

ArtCatDom

Posts: 478
Joined: 1/20/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittensmailbox

i just call him God, but since you seem to know so much more then i do. i will just have to assume that you know more about my own beliefs, more then i do....

Oh come on now. Framing it as an assault on your beliefs is a strawman.

YOU may call Him "God", but a French speaker who is also Christian will call Him "Dieu". Is the French speaker talking about a differant God than you are? You're not saying that noone had the proper word for God until over a millenia after Christianity began and English came about, are you?

*meow*

< Message edited by ArtCatDom -- 5/13/2006 11:54:30 AM >

(in reply to kittensmailbox)

Post #: 85

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 12:26:26 PM

SirKenin

Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline

You know, it is not the Bible that is the problem. It is people like the OP that take it and twist it, trying to literalize everything and making Christians look like a bunch of bumbling idiots that is the problem.

If people would only do their research, and there is PLENTY of it available on the internet (and I will often times kill time researching topics, like I did with Revelations and homosexuality and the like), then these misunderstandings would not even be an issue. We would not have atheists telling us that the infallible Word is for lunatics. Just cross reference the various cultures, history, etc and you will realize that not only is the OP so far base it is ridiculous, but that the Bible as a whole is not that far off.

Should anybody be interested in reading some scholars that actually know what they are talking about on this subject instead of all this drivel, I will be happy to point you in the right direction.

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to kittensmailbox)

Post #: 86

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 8:09:44 PM

puella

Posts: 2457
Joined: 12/2/2004
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You do realize that the bible is an exteded metaphor, yes?

(in reply to knees2you)

Post #: 87

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 8:51:17 PM

MistyMenthal

Posts: 413
Joined: 3/28/2006
Status: offline

quote:

You do realize that the bible is an exteded metaphor, yes?

Do You mean Extended my Dear?

I Just know satan Exists!

BLOW ME A KISS Misty

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 88

RE: End of Days. - 5/13/2006 11:55:14 PM

Kedikat

Posts: 680
Joined: 4/20/2006
Status: offline

Yeah, these days will likely end. But other days will follow. Maybe worse, maybe better.
Depends on how perfect you think your days are, as to heaven or hell follows.
By the way. Have you noticed that a whole bunch of other folks believe in other ancient things written by visionaries and perverted by power mongers?
Maybe for those folks, it's just interesting times. Some of them have better times at the end.

(in reply to slavejali)

Post #: 89

RE: End of Days. - 5/14/2006 5:14:35 AM

Tantalus42

Posts: 51
Joined: 1/27/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

You know, it is not the Bible that is the problem. It is people like the OP that take it and twist it, trying to literalize everything and making Christians look like a bunch of bumbling idiots that is the problem.

Christians are quite capable of doing that all on their own. Just look at Pat Robertson... all he has to do is open his mouth and he will leave no doubt of his idiocy, thus staining the reputation of his religion.

By the way, you mentioned something earlier about Revelations being a coded letter. I'd certainly like to see references to that, I've yet to come across any biblical scholar - Christian or non - who has espoused that viewpoint and I'm truly curious.

What intrigues me most about this discussion is how many perverts on here are still very religious and very much believers, even though the elders of their own churches would condemn them to hell for what they do in their private lives.

(in reply to SirKenin)

Post #: 90

RE: End of Days. - 5/14/2006 10:54:25 PM

knees2you

Posts: 2336
Joined: 3/15/2004
Status: offline

The Devinci Code!

That's the Answer.

Always, Ant

(in reply to Tantalus42)

Post #: 91

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 5:36:50 AM

philosophy

Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
Status: offline

and again, Swift..........

we are God's chosen few
All others will be damned
There is no room in heaven for you
We can't have heaven crammed

(in reply to knees2you)

Post #: 92

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 5:54:17 AM

Kindred2Evil

Posts: 227
Joined: 4/16/2005
Status: offline

I'm just curious here, so hang in with me if I ramble a bit....

Christians believe a book that was written 60 years after Christ died...Do you believe it literally or do you take your own meanings from the various stories inside its covers? Was there honestly a flood that took the whole planet and turned it into one big puddle? Was there really a man who built a boat big enough to house 2 of every animal plus his family? Was there really only 1 man and 1 woman in the beginning? If so...aren't we all related then? Doesn't this book also say incest is wrong? If that's the case, then explain it to me how we aren't ALL committing incest if we all come from Adam and Eve.
Just who is the whore of Babylon who will rise up on the back of a great dragon or serpent or whatever it says exactly?
What I'm getting at is the Bible is chock full of STORIES. They were visions written down by men, who are totally fallible. Ever played the telephone game as a kid? The first kid gets told I caught a 4 inch bass yesterday. By the time it gets through 20 kids this thing is a 20 ft long killer shark that came out of my bathtub. Stories get twisted, deducted from and added to...it's human nature.
Do I believe there is a big change coming? OOOOhh you betcha. Do I believe the world is going to end any time soon? Nope, can't say that I do. As someone stated earlier, the world has been coming to an end for 2,000 years.
We see more wickedness and badness now because it's kept in front of our faces 24/7 365 days a year. 50 years ago you didn't hear about all this right...well we didn't exactly have the capabilities we have now. Now we can take you right down to where people are starving to death, where the 4 horsemen thrive. Thank you so much CNN.
Before anyone goes screaming for the highlands with their Armegeddon kit, look back over history. Many many many times when big changes were coming someone threw out the Apocolypse card.
It's a time of change right now, big change. Personally I can't wait to see what the human race does next to piss off the Supreme Being (or in my case Goddess).

_____________________________

Her touch is on the breeze that brushes your cheek, Her voice rides the thunder as the storm breaks, Her tears will clean your heartache when the rains come, Her sun will light the darkest times when you feel alone...She is the Goddess.

(in reply to philosophy)

Post #: 93

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 6:14:08 AM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline

No-one has shown that God exists......or any other god.

To exist, something must be something in particular. To exist is to exist as something, with a particular identity.

God does not exist, he is outside of reality so is called Supernatural. He can only exist outside of reality as *imagined or believed*

The human mind seems to be able to insist that things that do not exist are real.

Most people that I've come across that have *faith* ...... have *believed* for no good reason other than being told/taught that God exists.

One of the most amusing things I found recently was that NONE of the people that had their deep christian *faith* ...could remember the names of the twelve disciples.

Maybe people need to *believe* in something and God seems a handy enough thing. Maybe that's a good enough reason ...lol

agirl

(in reply to ArtCatDom)

Post #: 94

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 6:33:23 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

If we really believed god exists and something heavenly was on the other side we would be digging our own graves and enthusiastically jumping in without the need to resort to silly death fetishes of suicide bombers et al.

Well! Who is the first believer to jump off a very tall building?

Oops! I forgot that suicide was rather conveniently a sin!

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 5/15/2006 6:34:26 AM >

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 95

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 6:36:17 AM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

I smoke, I drink, I swear........I believe I am traveling there about the right speed.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to meatcleaver)

Post #: 96

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 6:39:00 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

I drink and smoke swear and fornicate and every thing is going a little fast for me. My brakes don't work!

(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 97

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 7:12:27 AM

MistyMenthal

Posts: 413
Joined: 3/28/2006
Status: offline

quote:

I'm just curious here, so hang in with me if I ramble a bit....

Christians believe a book that was written 60 years after Christ died...Do you believe it literally or do you take your own meanings from the various stories inside its covers? Was there honestly a flood that took the whole planet and turned it into one big puddle? Was there really a man who built a boat big enough to house 2 of every animal plus his family? Was there really only 1 man and 1 woman in the beginning? If so...aren't we all related then? Doesn't this book also say incest is wrong? If that's the case, then explain it to me how we aren't ALL committing incest if we all come from Adam and Eve.
Just who is the whore of Babylon who will rise up on the back of a great dragon or serpent or whatever it says exactly?
What I'm getting at is the Bible is chock full of STORIES. They were visions written down by men, who are totally fallible. Ever played the telephone game as a kid? The first kid gets told I caught a 4 inch bass yesterday. By the time it gets through 20 kids this thing is a 20 ft long killer shark that came out of my bathtub. Stories get twisted, deducted from and added to...it's human nature.
Do I believe there is a big change coming? OOOOhh you betcha. Do I believe the world is going to end any time soon? Nope, can't say that I do. As someone stated earlier, the world has been coming to an end for 2,000 years.
We see more wickedness and badness now because it's kept in front of our faces 24/7 365 days a year. 50 years ago you didn't hear about all this right...well we didn't exactly have the capabilities we have now. Now we can take you right down to where people are starving to death, where the 4 horsemen thrive. Thank you so much CNN.
Before anyone goes screaming for the highlands with their Armegeddon kit, look back over history. Many many many times when big changes were coming someone threw out the Apocolypse card.
It's a time of change right now, big change. Personally I can't wait to see what the human race does next to piss off the Supreme Being (or in my case Goddess).

_____________________________

Her touch is on the breeze that brushes your cheek, Her voice rides the thunder as the storm breaks, Her tears will clean your heartache when the rains come, Her sun will light the darkest times when you feel alone...She is the Goddess.

There is Archealogical Evidence that says the Ark
existed...

KISS ME Misty

< Message edited by MistyMenthal -- 5/15/2006 7:13:41 AM >

(in reply to meatcleaver)

Post #: 98

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 7:31:20 AM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

Horridly tenuous evidence to some...........

And the fact they found some wood and hulls on Ararat does not mean that the whole deal is bought in the story behind a boat.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to MistyMenthal)

Post #: 99

RE: End of Days. - 5/15/2006 7:45:55 AM

Kindred2Evil

Posts: 227
Joined: 4/16/2005
Status: offline

I've seen the shows where they say they found parts of the ark. Whoot. That still doesn't answer the other questions I have asked. This is why I don't get into the Christian faith. I don't care that you or anyone else does, but me, I like to SEE what's going on. People put so much faith in the written word of men who lived thousands of years ago, they eat it up like a woman with PMS would eat chocolate. Where is the proof?
And don't lay that "you have to have faith" garbage on me. Utter nonsense. I was given a brain, two eyes, two ears and a mouth so I could think, see, hear and speak the things I'm curious about. I'm not bashing Christians, if you have faith good on ya...I'm just curious as to how you can believe tales that when you really think about it, are totally outrageous.
Even if the story of the ark is true, again you have the incest thing. All the ones on the boat were family yes? And no one else survived the whole water world scenerio yes? Hmmm...sounds like they had to be having sex with each other to repopulate the planet.
The four horsemen, the apocolypse, the end of days....Show me.

_____________________________

Her touch is on the breeze that brushes your cheek, Her voice rides the thunder as the storm breaks, Her tears will clean your heartache when the rains come, Her sun will light the darkest times when you feel alone...She is the Goddess.

(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 100

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