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ORIGINAL: efrain83

It's sad that the GOP is held hostage by the far right wing Tea Party members and the left is held hostage by the far left entitlement junkies.  And there's little sanity in between, the only place where there is viable sanity.

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ORIGINAL: rulemylife

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ORIGINAL: gaybottomslave

VioletGray's questioning of why the GOP voted to raise the debt ceiling 19 times but refused to do it a 20th time is quite interesting.

Unfortunately, she's not going to like the answer: We, as a nation, cannot continue to fund the spending status quo. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Interesting because it is happening now, with a Democratic president.

Imagine that!

Have you noticed that whichever party is not in power demands fiscal responsibility, until they are back in power.

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And finally, apparently when VioletGray talks about the "Obama obessed GOP" she has no memory or recollection of the sheer hateful vitriol the liberal left obsessively spewed at Bush II for eight years--or Bush I and Ronald Reagan before that. Or maybe she's typical of left-wing zealots who see no problem with throwing stones at the "opposition" but then has the tamarity to cry foul when the "opposition" casts stones at someone she supports.

Now would that hateful vitriol be anything like calling someone a left-wing zealot?

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: efrain83

It's sad that the GOP is held hostage by the far right wing Tea Party members and the left is held hostage by the far left entitlement junkies.  And there's little sanity in between, the only place where there is viable sanity.

Whose entitlements ? Is wall street entitled, is Exxon/GE entitled, millionaire congressman and senators taking soc. sec 'because they are 'entitled ?'

The word is 'demagogued' out of any real meaning anymore. Did 'W' feel 'entitled' to spend over $500 million/DAY ($1.37 trillion) of the soc. sec overfunding ?

Even the CATO Inst. you know, that liberal bastion of tax & spend...informs us of $100 billion per year in corporate welfare. Are they entitlements ? Just what IS an entitlement.

Wouldn't any logical person have a right to feel that after paying into govt. via their paycheck for 40-50 or more years...that they are in fact truly entitled while the rest who have paid in...not so much ?

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: efrain83

It's sad that the GOP is held hostage by the far right wing Tea Party members and the left is held hostage by the far left entitlement junkies.  And there's little sanity in between, the only place where there is viable sanity.

Whose entitlements ? Is wall street entitled, is Exxon/GE entitled, millionaire congressman and senators taking soc. sec 'because they are 'entitled ?'

The word is 'demagogued' out of any real meaning anymore. Did 'W' feel 'entitled' to spend over $500 million/DAY ($1.37 trillion) of the soc. sec overfunding ?

Even the CATO Inst. you know, that liberal bastion of tax & spend...informs us of $100 billion per year in corporate welfare. Are they entitlements ? Just what IS an entitlement.

Wouldn't any logical person have a right to feel that after paying into govt. via their paycheck for 40-50 or more years...that they are in fact truly entitled while the rest who have paid in...not so much ?

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ORIGINAL: lockedaway

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: efrain83

It's sad that the GOP is held hostage by the far right wing Tea Party members and the left is held hostage by the far left entitlement junkies.  And there's little sanity in between, the only place where there is viable sanity.

Whose entitlements ? Is wall street entitled, is Exxon/GE entitled, millionaire congressman and senators taking soc. sec 'because they are 'entitled ?'

The word is 'demagogued' out of any real meaning anymore. Did 'W' feel 'entitled' to spend over $500 million/DAY ($1.37 trillion) of the soc. sec overfunding ?

Even the CATO Inst. you know, that liberal bastion of tax & spend...informs us of $100 billion per year in corporate welfare. Are they entitlements ? Just what IS an entitlement.

Wouldn't any logical person have a right to feel that after paying into govt. via their paycheck for 40-50 or more years...that they are in fact truly entitled while the rest who have paid in...not so much ?

Are you "seriously" asking this????   Corporate America has certainly received entitlements.  Should they?  Depends on what you call an entitlement.  Corporate American should have a business environment that attracts them to the country so they employ people, pay health benefits, pay state, federal and local taxes and still make money.  OTHERWISE, they won't be here.  Pretty simple...right?

You talk about GE and Geoffrey Imelt is up O'scumbag's ass like a lower g.i. scope.  But you are blind to that, of course.

Yes...we have had  corporate titans in this country get politicized so the line between politico and magnate have disappeared.  Yup...that is a shame.  It is evidence of rot and corruption.  And your man-child, scumbag president is as guilty of it as anyone past president if not more so.

Did you suggest that rich people should not get THEIR social security?  Did you really say that?  So a citizen pays into a program that is for all citizens and now you want to say that these particular citizens don't get to partake because they were more successful than you?  Is that REALLY your position?

What entitlement?  ObamaCare will be the largest entitlement in U.S. history....and it is just the beginning.  If you don't think that ObamaCare will be expanded and grow legs of its own, you are hopelessly naive. 

As a general principle, any power that is ceded to the government is a freedom lost.  A classic example is the seat belt law.  "ok...we are going to pass a law that if you aren't wearing your seat belt, it will be a secondary offense that you can't get pulled over for but you can receive a ticket as an incident to an otherwise lawful stop."  Well golly gee, that sounds reasonable, duh.   Now it is a primary offense that allows cops to look inside your car and do a cursory vehicle search and rock your world.  NOW it is a primary offense for riders in the BACK SEAT to not be buckled in.

lololol someday they will just have cameras in your car as part of standard equipment and if you disconnect it, it will be a $15,000.00 fine and one year in prison.

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I can't find a single real conservative in Wash.

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ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

, there are neo-cons (what we used to call war hawks),

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Neo-conservative policies were focused on far more than foreign policy.

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I just want the basis for discussion as all should be...well defined. People are entitled to what they pay into...the rest are not. With millionaires politicians receiving their money back through soc. sec are entitled but because it is a small fraction of their income find it far, far too easy to cut it even though it is almost all of someone else's income. That's demagoguery... pure and simple.

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ORIGINAL: lockedaway

As a general principle, any power that is ceded to the government is a freedom lost.  A classic example is the seat belt law.  "ok...we are going to pass a law that if you aren't wearing your seat belt, it will be a secondary offense that you can't get pulled over for but you can receive a ticket as an incident to an otherwise lawful stop."  Well golly gee, that sounds reasonable, duh.   Now it is a primary offense that allows cops to look inside your car and do a cursory vehicle search and rock your world.  NOW it is a primary offense for riders in the BACK SEAT to not be buckled in.

lololol someday they will just have cameras in your car as part of standard equipment and if you disconnect it, it will be a $15,000.00 fine and one year in prison.

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


[Here is an almost classic example. The auto companies lobby against a federal mandate for seat belts to be installed into all vehicles. The 'people' were not consulted. The insurance companies knew the score and lobbied congress not the pres. for a mandate because obviously with seat belts...fewer and lesser claims for injury, i.e., windfall profits which did occur and without any reduction in insurance premiums.

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ORIGINAL: lockedaway

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I just want the basis for discussion as all should be...well defined. People are entitled to what they pay into...the rest are not. With millionaires politicians receiving their money back through soc. sec are entitled but because it is a small fraction of their income find it far, far too easy to cut it even though it is almost all of someone else's income. That's demagoguery... pure and simple.

LOLOLOLOLOL Thank YOU!!!  Yes!!!  My point EXACTLY.  Been saying that for years.  (Bells ring, angels sing, trumpets blow, sunlight breaks through the clouds)  Welcome to conservatism, Mr. Rodgers.  Just remember...what you have said applies to all people on the socio-economic spectrum.

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ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


[Here is an almost classic example. The auto companies lobby against a federal mandate for seat belts to be installed into all vehicles. The 'people' were not consulted. The insurance companies knew the score and lobbied congress not the pres. for a mandate because obviously with seat belts...fewer and lesser claims for injury, i.e., windfall profits which did occur and without any reduction in insurance premiums.

You mean an almost classic example of not knowing what the fuck youre talking about? auto premiums were reduced drastically when seat belts became mandatory, and discounts were offered before they were mandatory but were becoming more common, just as there are now discounts for SRS and passive restraint systems. There were no "windfall profits".

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ORIGINAL: lockedaway

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ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Good? I mean, aren't we all tired of paying for health insurance companies profits without any actual benefit from it?

I don't know what you are talking about.  I have a VERY good health care plan.  It is pricey but I have had to rely on it.  They have spent more on me than I have on them. I'm very happy with my health insurance.  It is money well spent.

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: lockedaway

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I just want the basis for discussion as all should be...well defined. People are entitled to what they pay into...the rest are not. With millionaires politicians receiving their money back through soc. sec are entitled but because it is a small fraction of their income find it far, far too easy to cut it even though it is almost all of someone else's income. That's demagoguery... pure and simple.

LOLOLOLOLOL Thank YOU!!!  Yes!!!  My point EXACTLY.  Been saying that for years.  (Bells ring, angels sing, trumpets blow, sunlight breaks through the clouds)  Welcome to conservatism, Mr. Rodgers.  Just remember...what you have said applies to all people on the socio-economic spectrum.

So where is the rant over corporate welfare, corporate 'entitlements' farm entitlements, ethanol entitlements and a whole array of business subsidies, tax escapism that favor only the investor ? These are investor class 'entitlements' and are costing society a whole lot more and benefiting that same society a whole lot less than all other so-called 'entitlements' combined...most of which amazingly are less of any so-called entitlement, why ?

Because they are fucking paid for not bought through our congressional whores.

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lobbying should end

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


[Here is an almost classic example. The auto companies lobby against a federal mandate for seat belts to be installed into all vehicles. The 'people' were not consulted. The insurance companies knew the score and lobbied congress not the pres. for a mandate because obviously with seat belts...fewer and lesser claims for injury, i.e., windfall profits which did occur and without any reduction in insurance premiums.

You mean an almost classic example of not knowing what the fuck youre talking about? auto premiums were reduced drastically when seat belts became mandatory, and discounts were offered before they were mandatory but were becoming more common, just as there are now discounts for SRS and passive restraint systems. There were no "windfall profits".

Wrong, I was there. For just one example, when the 55 mph mandated speed limit (I guess yet another nanny-state law correct ?) became law. State Farm had realized such a windfall profit that [it] paid cash for 5 new IBM 370's. Other insurance companies did the same. Oil companies followed suit. Even IBM warmed stockholders that this would not continue specifically because they knew those windfall profits would not last. Neither oil because of embargoes or insurance because of govt. mandates.

Auto premiums and other vehicle premiums were not reduced at all. In fact, almost all insurance premiums have risen constantly because the market is so narrow, that premiums have had to keep up with servicers to pay $90/hr. to paint my wrecked car or $1,500 for a head and shoulders MRI. Can't revise history with me.

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


So where is the rant over corporate welfare, corporate 'entitlements' farm entitlements, ethanol entitlements and a whole array of business subsidies, tax escapism that favor only the investor ?

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ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


So where is the rant over corporate welfare, corporate 'entitlements' farm entitlements, ethanol entitlements and a whole array of business subsidies, tax escapism that favor only the investor ?

Because "rants" arent the style of conservatives.