quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker


Did the British intellectual  get his feelings hurt?

One doesnt have to be intellectual to show that you dont know what you are talking about. Even your latest link states there is no proof of the smallpox story.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

So in your mind Rupert Murdoch is someone only the British should have any concern over, and this is a UK family affair?

Sorry but I do feel obliged to inject a note of factuality here.

Murdoch is a US citizen. I believe he currently resides in New York. While born in Australia, Murdoch acquired US citizenship in order to comply with certain regulations there about the ownership of media companies. Simultaneously he renounced his Australian citizenship, possibly the only action he's carried out in recent decades for which I feel any gratitude.

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

So in your mind Rupert Murdoch is someone only the British should have any concern over, and this is a UK family affair?

Sorry but I do feel obliged to inject a note of factuality here.

Murdoch is a US citizen. I believe he currently resides in New York. While born in Australia, Murdoch acquired US citizenship in order to comply with certain regulations there about the ownership of media companies. Simultaneously he renounced his Australian citizenship, possibly the only action he's carried out in recent decades for which I feel any gratitude.

Nonsense. According to Anaxagoras he is actually a Brit, and thus nobody but a UK resident s any business commenting on his problems in the UK or the US, and only a bigot who hates the British woudl comment on anything concerning his phone haccking and bribery in the UK.

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
... and obsesses about negative stories from the UK like the Murdock issue. Ah well, good luck to him and his viewpoint!

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
And even I had not considered Rupert Murdoch such a British cultural icon, (apparently rivaling the Queen herself) that dissing him is bigoted against the British.

"obsesses about negative stories from the UK like the Murdock issue." (Your post 59)

(You do know he is from Australia or do all the Anglos look the same to you?)

Try to obfuscate but the fact remains it was/is principally a British news story relating to British media institutions and in part British government.

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
So in your mind Rupert Murdoch is someone only the British should have any concern over, and this is a UK family affair?

Not at all. That is strawmanning, I was referring to you having an obsession, do try to stay on track.

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

Very well done FirstQuaker. You have proven yourself to be a liar. I never said Murdock is British. That would be an absurd thing to do. He is well known as an Australian.

Neither did I say no one but a UK resident has any business commenting on the matter. That is another deliberate lie because I already made the point just back a few posts ago, in the last reply to you (post 78), that is is your obsession over negative British news stories that is revealing, not that you commented or had an interest in the story because that would not be an issue. You were the most prolific poster in the numerous threads about Murdock, becoming almost the exclusive poster on one thread near its end.

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
Very well done FirstQuaker. You have proven yourself to be a liar. I never said Murdock is British. That would be an absurd thing to do. He is well known as an Australian.

Neither did I say no one but a UK resident has any business commenting on the matter. That is another deliberate lie because I already made the point just back a few posts ago, in the last reply to you (post 78), that is is your obsession over negative British news stories that is revealing, not that you commented or had an interest in the story because that would not be an issue. You were the most prolific poster in the numerous threads about Murdock, becoming almost the exclusive poster on one thread near its end.

Let see, who was it who brought Rupert Murdoch into this discussion on the CIA and MI6 being in bed with KDafffy again, and how this showed I had an obsession with "anti-British" news?

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That beating you took from me really affected your little ego, didn't it. So jsut how long are you going to follow me around attempting to hijack threads in fruitless attempts to rectify your past disgraces here, little man?

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

I didn't hijack the thead, others were commenting on your bigotry as being a reason for your take on the story, and I added my view. This is a forum so that was appropriate enough. Neither do I follow you around asswipe. I haven't commented on one of your posts in months! What kind of strange fantasy world devoid of facts do you live in?

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
I didn't hijack the thead, others were commenting on your bigotry as being a reason for your take on the story, and I added my view. This is a forum so that was appropriate enough. Neither do I follow you around asswipe. I haven't commented on one of your posts in months! What kind of strange fantasy world devoid of facts do you live in?

Why else are you posting in it?

You have had nothing to say about the topic of the CIA and MI6 being involved in helping KDaffy repatriate his opponents for torture, now have you?

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
I didn't hijack the thead, others were commenting on your bigotry as being a reason for your take on the story, and I added my view. This is a forum so that was appropriate enough. Neither do I follow you around asswipe. I haven't commented on one of your posts in months! What kind of strange fantasy world devoid of facts do you live in?

Why else are you posting in it?

You have had nothing to say about the topic of the CIA and MI6 being involved in helping KDaffy repatriate his opponents for torture, now have you?

It seems I have to repeat myself again and again with you. As stated above, several others were commenting on your manifest bigotry which appertained to your coverage of the story, and I did the same. That is on topic as it relates to your take on the story since you strated the thread.

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

Dude perhaps in your fantasy world you're some sort of fearsome combatant in the sphere of debate that opponents try to avoid but in reality you're just a few pixels on a screen. I'm quite happy to continue this "discussion" for quite some time.

Despite your persecution complex, I haven't made it my business to attack you. The last time I criticised you was a few months ago when you were also yammering on about your same-old anglophobic views to Lucylastic. She also agreed you have issues with the British.

Whether you like it or not, it is common practice on this forum to comment on the biases of those who start threads. It isn't necessarily a personal attack if it focuses on their views on a given topic. Thus my comments here were appropriate.

quote:

Abdulati al-Obeidi told the BBC that Britain had accepted Libyan indications that Abdelbaset al-Megrahi’s release was an unwritten quid pro quo of the multi-billion pound contract.
“There was a hint that releasing him would help but it was not a condition,” he said. “The Libyan side, and you know the British, they know how to take things”
Asked if an exchange of the prisoner was part of the talks, Mr Obeidi said: “This is what I think”.
BP secured one of the largest contracts to exploit Libyan oil reserves after Col Gaddafi’s regime came in from the cold. The contract was celebrated as part of Tony Blair’s infamous Deal in the Desert trip to Libya.
Last year BP admitted it pressed for a deal over the controversial prisoner transfer agreement amid fears any delays would damage its “commercial interests”, but denied it had been involved in negotiations concerning Megrahi’s release.

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
Dude perhaps in your fantasy world you're some sort of fearsome combatant in the sphere of debate that opponents try to avoid but in reality you're just a few pixels on a screen. I'm quite happy to continue this "discussion" for quite some time.

Despite your persecution complex, I haven't made it my business to attack you. The last time I criticised you was a few months ago when you were also yammering on about your same-old anglophobic views to Lucylastic. She also agreed you have issues with the British.

Whether you like it or not, it is common practice on this forum to comment on the biases of those who start threads. It isn't necessarily a personal attack if it focuses on their views on a given topic. Thus my comments here were appropriate.

No I think it is funny some little whiner like you has to follow me around sniping if others are with him, much as a dog waits under a table, hoping for table scraps. But this demonstrates a lack of moral courage on your part, in addition to your other charms.

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Nor do I think it is a policy of this forum to encourage personal commentary and insults directed at anyone opening a thread, contrary to your novel claims.

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But I see that in addition to acting (along with the CIA) as KDaffy's bail bondsmen, and errand boys, it is now apearing by Libyan testimony your British betters led by Tony the Blair were also trading off a conviceted terorist for massive oil too...

quote:


Anyway, perhaps, like the jackal you see as a role model, you should follow me in all threads and comment on your psychically acquired  list of my bias and charector defects so as to make this forum into what you think it should be. Go have another few pints and consider it.

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
Dude perhaps in your fantasy world you're some sort of fearsome combatant in the sphere of debate that opponents try to avoid but in reality you're just a few pixels on a screen. I'm quite happy to continue this "discussion" for quite some time.

Despite your persecution complex, I haven't made it my business to attack you. The last time I criticised you was a few months ago when you were also yammering on about your same-old anglophobic views to Lucylastic. She also agreed you have issues with the British.

Whether you like it or not, it is common practice on this forum to comment on the biases of those who start threads. It isn't necessarily a personal attack if it focuses on their views on a given topic. Thus my comments here were appropriate.

No I think it is funny some little whiner like you has to follow me around sniping if others are with him, much as a dog waits under a table, hoping for table scraps. But this demonstrates a lack of moral courage on your part, in addition to your other charms.

LOL ahh now you are increasing the abusiveness of your comments. Clearly my posts are getting to you. Your projection and attempts at mind-reading are comical.

You can't do anything other than talk bullshit. I have seen quite a few strongly criticise your stance over the last few months. I only added my opinion here. Stop playing the victim.

How am I whining. You are the one with a persecution complex. I made a legitimate comment about your manifest hatred of the British. It leaks out of the majority of your posts.

How is it a lack of moral courage on my part to point out your hatred? As I said earlier I actually made this point before unprompted, and if you like I'll do it again unprompted?

quote:


Nor do I think it is a policy of this forum to encourage personal commentary and insults directed at anyone opening a thread, contrary to your novel claims.

This is an excellent illustration of your hypocrisy. On this thread I made some criticisms of your stance based solely on your comments from the past and present. Your opinions illustrate a clear bias and prejudice. That is clearly justified. It is not a criticism on anything other than your opinions. I did not engage in name calling or insults, other than to question your grip on reality when you personally insulted me. You were the one to name-call as in Post 87, to which I did not reciprocate.

quote:


But I see that in addition to acting (along with the CIA) as KDaffy's bail bondsmen, and errand boys, it is now apearing by Libyan testimony your British betters led by Tony the Blair were also trading off a conviceted terorist for massive oil too...

Ahh a comment about my British betters. This is another example of your bias. I never voiced any support for the British in this thread or any other yet you attack me over it. Similarly I was critical of historic British involvement in the Middle-East but disagreed over your extreme criticisms so you cast me as a British supporter. That is indicative of a singular all or nothing fanaticism. There is no grey area. Its all or nothing with hatred.

quote:


Anyway, perhaps, like the jackal you see as a role model, you should follow me in all threads and comment on your psychically acquired  list of my bias and charector defects so as to make this forum into what you think it should be. Go have another few pints and consider it.

This would suit you wouldn't it since you have kept crying victim on this thread. As I said before I haven't critiicised you in months so I think you should grow up and deal with it.

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
Really. So you spend your time following me about "Correcting misinformation" that you see regarding my posts (Like correcting the definition of the word Anglosphere for instance) while discussing what bias your special training allows you to detect and while telling me I have a persecution complex, which your unique psychic skills have have allowed you to detect?

Do you post as a form of therapy, then?

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

So you did not read it either?

Doubtless the Eton Alumni at the local pub helped you out.

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Sorry but I do feel obliged to inject a note of factuality here.

Murdoch is a US citizen. I believe he currently resides in New York.

Nonsense. According to Anaxagoras he is actually a Brit, and thus nobody but a UK resident s any business commenting on his problems in the UK or the US, and only a bigot who hates the British woudl comment on anything concerning his phone haccking and bribery in the UK.

Very well done FirstQuaker. You have proven yourself to be a liar. I never said Murdock is British. That would be an absurd thing to do. He is well known as an Australian.

Even though Murdock is Australian, and has news outlets around the world, it's principally a British news story relating to British institutions and related players.

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ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

So you did not read it either?

Doubtless the Eton Alumni at the local pub helped you out.

Yes I read it, and understood it, unlike you.

Hows life as a sock puppet these days ?

quote:

The Fort Pitt incident is the best documented case of deliberately spreading smallpox among unsuspecting populations, but it likely was not the first time such a stratagem was employed by military forces. It appears that Ecuyer and Amherst proposed the same idea independently at about the same time, suggesting that the practice was not unusual.

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
Really. So you spend your time following me about "Correcting misinformation" that you see regarding my posts (Like correcting the definition of the word Anglosphere for instance) while discussing what bias your special training allows you to detect and while telling me I have a persecution complex, which your unique psychic skills have have allowed you to detect?

Do you post as a form of therapy, then?

I never used the wording "Correcting misinformation" so that is a false attribution since you put it in quotes.

LOL I was disagreeing on your use of a term with is legitimate on a discussion forum. It seems you can't stand any criticism at all!

There isn't any special training required to detect your bias. It is obvious. Numerous people have commented on it.

Neither does it require "psychic skills" to see you have a persecution complex. You keep pretending I follow you around hijacking your threads when I haven't commented on a single one of your posts in months, and you have been moaning about my comments in post 83, 85, 87 and 89 just on this page alone!

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The Shorter Oxford English Dictionary defines the Anglosphere as "the group of countries where English is the main native language".[1] The Merriam-Webster dictionary uses the definition, "the countries of the world in which the English language and cultural values predominate".[2]

quote:

Anglosphere is a neologism which refers to those nations with English as the most common language. The term can be used more specifically to refer to those nations which share certain characteristics within their cultures based on a linguistic heritage, through being former British colonies. In particular this includes the United Kingdom, the United States, Canada (except Quebec), Australia, New Zealand, and Ireland.

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

I hope this puts this minor issue to bed permanently. Murdoch is NOT an Australian any more. Someone else has responsibility for him and I have sympathy and pity for whoever is unfortunate enough to have this responsibility.

Can we get back on-topic now please?

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Speaking to The Daily Telegraph, Sami Saadi, a former deputy leader of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG), said he was the victim of a “conspiracy” by the British, who arranged his “rendition” to Col Muammar Gaddafi’s regime.

The allegations are the most serious yet of Britain’s involvement in seizing alleged terrorist suspects and delivering them to repressive countries for intense interrogation, often torture.

Mr Saadi, also known as Abu Munthir, is named in documents found in a Libyan intelligence archive last week which show British complicity in the practice.

Now in hospital in Tunisia, where he is recovering from injuries sustained in prison, Mr Saadi, who lived for many years in England, said he felt “really disappointed” with the British Government.

“When I was in China in 2004, the British approached me through an intermediary,” he said. “They said they would allow me to return to Britain but they just wanted to speak to me at the British Consulate in Hong Kong to check my political views. So I flew to Hong Kong with my wife and four children.


“I was expecting to meet the British, but I and my whole family were arrested at the airport and ended up on an aeroplane taking us to Libya.”

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
So you now don't think the US is in the Angolsphere even thought this is the definition -

quote:

The Shorter Oxford English Dictionary defines the Anglosphere as "the group of countries where English is the main native language".[1] The Merriam-Webster dictionary uses the definition, "the countries of the world in which the English language and cultural values predominate".[2]

and

quote:

Anglosphere is a neologism which refers to those nations with English as the most common language. The term can be used more specifically to refer to those nations which share certain characteristics within their cultures based on a linguistic heritage, through being former British colonies. In particular this includes the United Kingdom, the United States, Canada (except Quebec), Australia, New Zealand, and Ireland.

- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglosphere

Okay, just what is your definition since don't like mine or any other sources -

"It would explain how he is up in arms about what he repeatedly calls the "anglo-sphere" which he lumps the US in with," - You

"It's clear there isn't a decisive political connection in the so called "anglosphere" even according to its proponent." -You

You did not even know what the word meant did you?

quote:

It would explain how he is up in arms about what he repeatedly calls the "anglo-sphere" which he lumps the US in with, goes on about British colonialism whilst ignoring the impact of the French equivalent...

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Your use of the term "anglosphere" is problematic even according to the wiki link you provide! It's clear there isn't a decisive political connection in the so called "anglosphere" even according to its proponent. This fairly strong political connection is what you keep inferring so your claim is void. Speaking of broad Western interests is far more appropriate.

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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

I hope this puts this minor issue to bed permanently. Murdoch is NOT an Australian any more. Someone else has responsibility for him and I have sympathy and pity for whoever is unfortunate enough to have this responsibility.

Can we get back on-topic now please?

Be careful, if you discuss Murdoch you have an unnatural obsession with the British, according to Anaxagoras.

As for the topic, I am still wondering how the US and the UK think to deal with a man they tortured among the new leaders of Libya.

quote:

It seems I have to repeat myself again and again with you. As stated above, several others were commenting on your manifest bigotry which appertained to your coverage of the story, and I did the same. That is on topic as it relates to your take on the story since you strated the thread.

quote:

Whether you like it or not, it is common practice on this forum to comment on the biases of those who start threads. It isn't necessarily a personal attack if it focuses on their views on a given topic. Thus my comments here were appropriate.

quote:

and obsesses about negative stories from the UK like the Murdock issue.

quote:

Neither did I say no one but a UK resident has any business commenting on the matter. That is another deliberate lie because I already made the point just back a few posts ago, in the last reply to you, that it is your obsession over negative British news stories that is revealing, not that you commented or had an interest in the story, which would not be an issue at all. You came across as the most prolific poster in the numerous threads about the hacking controversy, becoming almost the exclusive poster on one thread near its end.

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker: We have Bush and Blair sucking up to Kdaffy, but as noted, we had Clinton trying to pay the AQ to bump Kdaffy and Saddam off, while Raygun just sent in the jets..

But the new Napoleon and the Tory twits in Canada and the UK are only there for a percentage of the oil (France gets 35% according to their press.) Obama, of course has the US leading from behind.

About the only fair thing that can be said is the Angosphere is totally schizophrenic about the place, kissing up to the Libyan rulers one day and trying to kill them the next.

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker: And frankly since Oz, Canada and UK Anglos have all weighed in on how they support this oil war, do we really need a hobbit to post from Christchurch to complete the set?

But do play your little race card.

After all, the rest of the planet is prejudiced against Anglo-Saxons for no apparent reasons, certainly all the slavery, conquests and genocide they committed in the name of Anglo-Saxon profit from one end of the planet to the other over the last 500 years is no grounds the rest of the planet should think badly of them, especially where the lot is seen as going thieving yet again, this time in Libya.

quote:

A major Western defense firm was upgrading military equipment for an elite Libyan security brigade just before an uprising against Muammar Gaddafi, documents show, showing how the West tried to foster ties with him during his final years in power.

Less than a month before the start of the revolt, the British arm of U.S.-based General Dynamics was making arrangements to improve communications systems for tanks, artillery and armored troop carriers for the Khamis Brigade, which played a lead role in cracking down on the revolt, according to documents found by Reuters at a brigade base. General Dynamics said the upgrade was never completed. But the documents illustrate in detail for the first time what weapons were involved in the deal and that the firm was doing business with Gaddafi's forces on the eve of the uprising.

quote:

Tony Blair helped to secure defence contracts worth £350m and the promise of more as part of the deal with Libya that allowed the Lockerbie bomber to return home.
The deals were signed during his meeting with Colonel Gadaffi in May 2007, when the then prime minister agreed to a prisoner transfer deal between the two countries. The disclosure has led to renewed accusations that the Labour government entered into a “terrorist for trade” agreement.

Senior officials with two companies which accompanied Blair on his “deal in the desert”, left with large hardware orders under the defence accord between the two countries.

MBDA, in which British Aerospace (BAe) has a 38% stake, left with a £147m contract for anti-tank missiles and a £112m related communication system contract. General Dynamics UK (GDUK) was given a deal worth £85m to supply the Libyan army with radios which could be extended to other elements of its armed forces.

During the talks, Libya also spoke with MBDA about its intention to buy surface to air missiles, a deal which would have been worth at least £200m but later fell through. The firm was also in the running to win further lucrative weapons contracts linked to a sale by France to Libya of Rafale jet fighters.

quote:

Government documents show that prior to the 2007 talks, Britain was pursuing arms deals with Libya. A UK Trade and Investment paper in 2005 named Libya as a “key market” with “strong prospects” for arms sales.

Another document, obtained by the Campaign Against Arms Trade, shows Ministry of Defence staff met Libyan officials on at least 20 occasions prior to the prisoner transfer deal.

In 2007, just before the Libyan summit, the British naval shipbuilding company VT Group was negotiating with Libya to sell three high-powered patrol vessels the size of mini frigates, worth £400m. The Foreign Office also approved the sale of armoured cars and water cannon to Libya despite a ban on the sale of weapons for internal repression.

The UK Trade and Investment Defence and Security Organisation, which promotes defence exports, admitted in May that “high-level political interventions” had enhanced the prospect of arms sales to Libya.

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
Did the little man get his feeling hurt again?

While you are applying the ethanol to your bruised ego, consider how it also turns out the defense contractors in the Anglosphere were working on their Libyan military contracts up until the last minute...

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ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
Did the little man get his feeling hurt again?

While you are applying the ethanol to your bruised ego, consider how it also turns out the defense contractors in the Anglosphere were working on their Libyan military contracts up until the last minute...

Blah blah blah, this childish name calling whilst completely ignoring my points is doing your cred a lot of favours!

quote:

His lawyers contend he is a model citizen. And as a successful businessman, Gary Hyde certainly exudes an aura of respectability. For years the 41-year-old father of two was a volunteer police officer in his home town of York, until a serious injury forced him to retire. "He is an upstanding and respected member of that community," his lawyers argued last week.

But now another picture of Hyde is emerging. A man who had turned his enthusiasm for guns and military memorabilia into a thriving business is Britain's very own lord of war; an international arms dealer, whose chief currency is the AK-47 assault rifle.

quote:

Recently released confidential US embassy cables revealed that in 2008 York Guns tried to ship 130,000 of the assault rifles to Libya. The memo, obtained by the website WikiLeaks, reveals that the company was acting as the intermediary between an unidentified Ukrainian arms manufacturer and Libyan officials. The size of the deal raised eyebrows in diplomatic circles, as Libya has only 70,000 ground-force troops and these would be unlikely to use a weapon as dated as the AK-47. The cable noted that the export licence was rejected because the "UK is concerned that the intention may be to re-export the weapons, particularly to armed rebel factions backed by Khartoum and/or Ndjamena in the Chad/Sudan conflict".