RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (Full Version)

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HannahLynn -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 10:41:15 AM)

so he did say what they said he said. but you don't want people to believe that. got it.

for what its worth, the fucker is right, but i find your lame ass attempt to deflect rather than defend pretty fucking pathetic.



samboct -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 10:53:21 AM)

To DYB

"To me it is at the crux of the differences between those that gots and those that don"t. Those on the right and left. Dems, Repubs. It is definitely part of the bigger issue and to brush that exchange off is doing a disservice to all the Unemployed of this country. If you want to go on making excuses and sucking on the tit of the right...so be it. Just don't try to put ideas and words into play that aren't there..."

Excuse me? In case you haven't noticed, I'm one of the more liberal posters on this board- I'm a liberal and proud of it. From my perspective- you've got an "us versus them" mentality- if someone doesn't agree with you- that automatically makes him evil and on the other side. Sorry- but I'll call the shots as I see them- and I agree with ST that Huff Po used a very slanted headline. I've already answered your comment about blaming the unemployed for their plight in a previous post- but to reiterate- had Cain said that these people need to get off their ass then he's a fool. That he blames macroeconomic problems for structural unemployment- well, I agree with him there. Do I think he's got the right macroeconomic issues...nope.

Sam



StrangerThan -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 10:54:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynn

so he did say what they said he said. but you don't want people to believe that. got it.

for what its worth, the fucker is right, but i find your lame ass attempt to deflect rather than defend pretty fucking pathetic.



I made no attempt to deflect. I said the journalism was sorry, and it is. For what it's worth, I can agree with what he said to a point, but that point is not encompassed within the headline. You can take that any way you want.

What I find fucking pathetic isn't the rabid hunt to find something to create such bullshit headlines, but the lining up of sheep behind it. I mean hell, if you have to cut shit up to turn it into a picture you like, your art pretty much sucks.



samboct -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 10:56:16 AM)

"I mean hell, if you have to cut shit up to turn it into a picture you like, your art pretty much sucks. "


No, no, no.... If your art consists of shit- then it STINKS!



StrangerThan -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 10:57:21 AM)

Lol, aye, that it does.





FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:01:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynn

so he did say what they said he said. but you don't want people to believe that. got it.

for what its worth, the fucker is right, but i find your lame ass attempt to deflect rather than defend pretty fucking pathetic.

The piece and video accompanying it in the article Owner posted doesn't match his thread title, which is misleading and obviously partisan.

I didn't see Cain's original comments about who is to blame if they don't have a job, so I'm not including that in my analysis.  But his defense of his comments in the accompanying video is correct, in my opinion: the blame rest with the voters who allowed the politicians the power to give the favors to Wall Street that has substantially caused the current economic malaise.

After all, we are supposed to be a nation of free people, responsible for our actions and expressing our will through our elected officials.  And when those actions lead to the ineffective and elitism political class we now have ... it's kinda disingenuous to then duck the blame.

Perhaps we need a little more anarchy, and a little less government.  [8D]

Firm



DomYngBlk -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:18:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynn

so he did say what they said he said. but you don't want people to believe that. got it.

for what its worth, the fucker is right, but i find your lame ass attempt to deflect rather than defend pretty fucking pathetic.



The fucker is right cause people that umemployment is the fault of the unemployed? Fucking kidding......



FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:21:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

The fucker is right cause people that umemployment is the fault of the unemployed? Fucking kidding......

If they are voters, and voted for the politicians that allowed it to happen ... then yea, it's their fault.

Firm



DomYngBlk -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:21:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

To DYB

"To me it is at the crux of the differences between those that gots and those that don"t. Those on the right and left. Dems, Repubs. It is definitely part of the bigger issue and to brush that exchange off is doing a disservice to all the Unemployed of this country. If you want to go on making excuses and sucking on the tit of the right...so be it. Just don't try to put ideas and words into play that aren't there..."

Excuse me? In case you haven't noticed, I'm one of the more liberal posters on this board- I'm a liberal and proud of it. From my perspective- you've got an "us versus them" mentality- if someone doesn't agree with you- that automatically makes him evil and on the other side. Sorry- but I'll call the shots as I see them- and I agree with ST that Huff Po used a very slanted headline. I've already answered your comment about blaming the unemployed for their plight in a previous post- but to reiterate- had Cain said that these people need to get off their ass then he's a fool. That he blames macroeconomic problems for structural unemployment- well, I agree with him there. Do I think he's got the right macroeconomic issues...nope.

Sam


Got the perfect right to be wrong..have at it



DomYngBlk -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:24:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

The fucker is right cause people that umemployment is the fault of the unemployed? Fucking kidding......

If they are voters, and voted for the politicians that allowed it to happen ... then yea, it's their fault.

Firm



See now you are putting words in his mouth that don't exist. Just as with his 999 plan. .....He was clearly asked if he stood by his comments ...he said yes....nuf said



Marc2b -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:26:30 AM)

One of the things that I really destest about political discussion is how we are supposed to collectively pretend certain things so that we can believe a world view more in keeping with our prejudices. Watching that video it is perfectly clear that Cain was saying: you elected the people who allowed wall street to run amok, you have to take responsibility for that (by voting for me). But we are supposed to pretend that he is really saying: if you are unemployed it is because you're lazy so fuck you! Starve to death and see if I care! That way we can all feel good about hating him.

I don't need to hate Cain to not vote for him, his unconstitutional attitude toward Muslims building mosques is reason enough for me. He would have saved himself a some grief, however, if he had substituted the word responsibility instead of blame. I say some grief because thouse who already hate him won't let go of that hate for any reason, they'll find something else to distort into a more acceptable world view.



Hillwilliam -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:28:00 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

The fucker is right cause people that umemployment is the fault of the unemployed? Fucking kidding......

If they are voters, and voted for the politicians that allowed it to happen ... then yea, it's their fault.

Firm


So what do you do when there are no good choices like the past coupla decades?



FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:35:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

So what do you do when there are no good choices like the past coupla decades?


There are at least a couple of different options.

One is to refer to Thomas Jefferson:

God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ... What country before ever existed a century and half without a rebellion? And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.

Firm



FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:42:26 AM)

A couple of others that are pertinent:

Whenever the people are well informed, they can be trusted with their own government; that whenever things get so far wrong as to attract their notice, they may be relied on to set them to rights.


I say, the earth belongs to each of these generations during its course, fully and in its own right. The second generation receives it clear of the debts and incumbrances of the first, the third of the second, and so on. For if the first could charge it with a debt, then the earth would belong to the dead and not to the living generation. Then, no generation can contract debts greater than may be paid during the course of its own existence.
Firm




Hillwilliam -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 11:49:06 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

So what do you do when there are no good choices like the past coupla decades?


There are at least a couple of different options.

One is to refer to Thomas Jefferson:

God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ... What country before ever existed a century and half without a rebellion? And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.

Firm


Do you think the Tea Party on one side and OWS on the other side are part of this rebellion?



FirstQuaker -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 12:06:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

So what do you do when there are no good choices like the past coupla decades?


There are at least a couple of different options.

One is to refer to Thomas Jefferson:

God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ... What country before ever existed a century and half without a rebellion? And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.

Firm


Do you think the Tea Party on one side and OWS on the other side are part of this rebellion?


There are more then a few Tea Party people reported as showing up at the OWS demos on the West Coast.

Even across the border in Vancouver, the origin of OWS, the people showing their colors run across a pretty broad Canadian political base

You don't have to have any particular political bent to dislike and denounce open public thievery.



slvemike4u -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 12:13:07 PM)

Seems like you are advocating rebellion...did not Jefferson also say that( I am paraphrasing here) no people should ever take such a step lightly...or over too little grievance.
While the mechanism of free elections are still in place,when the Constitution of your country is still the law of the land....and when the Bill of Rights still hold sway....how can you advocat the violent overthrow of a lawfully elected government ?
Not liking the results of an election,or the subsequent direction the country might take due to those results does not seem to me to be reasons to rush to water the tree of liberty with your nieghors blood [8|]



Hillwilliam -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 12:19:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Seems like you are advocating rebellion...did not Jefferson also say that( I am paraphrasing here) no people should ever take such a step lightly...or over too little grievance.
While the mechanism of free elections are still in place,when the Constitution of your country is still the law of the land....and when the Bill of Rights still hold sway....how can you advocat the violent overthrow of a lawfully elected government ?
Not liking the results of an election,or the subsequent direction the country might take due to those results does not seem to me to be reasons to rush to water the tree of liberty with your nieghors blood [8|]

I don't advocate the overthrow of a duly elected government. I advocate the overthrow of the nonelected ones who seek (these days quite successfully) to control them.



slvemike4u -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 12:33:52 PM)

I was actually addressing Firm ...sorry for the confusion



Hillwilliam -> RE: Cain blames unemployed,audience laughs and cheers... (10/19/2011 12:48:52 PM)

Well, I'm interested in his opinion as well.



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