RE: Trick-or-bible

RE: Trick-or-bible (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:23:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AdorkableAiley quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Check? when my son was young, we would take his candy to the hospital and have it x-rayed. The bible would never have left the man's porch... and he would have been off the list for next year. Okay... my parents never went that far... but see, you have choices just like he does, he has every right to hand out bibles, or pennies or toothbrushes or whatever he wants as long as it isn't something harmful, and you have every right to refuse just like you would if he handed out kit kats and you didn't like them. Ailey I agree. No up in arms over this issue. Just smiles and polite... no thank yous... is all it takes. [:D]

Epytropos -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:23:42 PM)
The book isn't going to read itself to him. He would have to CHOOSE to read it, something which is laborious and dull. The only way it would happen is if he saw spiritual value in the act, which would be indicative of a choice.

tazzygirl -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:24:43 PM)
He had access to one if he wanted to read it, Would another make it easier?

Aylee -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:25:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SpanishMatMaster Dear Aylee: I asked a question, you answered. I am not inclined to handle this further. I consider that you are missing many important points and are horribly wrong, but I do not feel the need to explain it further. You would not be "upset" if somebody gave your child "Mein Kampf" to read, no matter his/her age. Your child, your rules. I have nothing more to say. Ya know. . . my other half is a librarian. And REALLY believes in the First Amendment. Furthermore, if we do NOT read things like that, how would we know how to counter the arguments. A colleague once stated that if you gave him a focus group and 20 minutes with nothing but quotes from quote: Mein Kampf to use as his talking points, he could convince the majority of the group to become Nazis, if the word Nazi was never used. The local University, the University of Kansas, created its Western Civilization program (required for ANY degree) after WW2, and the whole point is to be able to argue Western Philosophy and to counter-argue the destructive elements such as Nazism, Fascism, and so on. So. . . overall. . . to counter the arguments in quote: Mein Kampf you HAVE to read it to know what it says. That is the way the First Amendment works. It gets all the ideas out there. Otherwise censorship allows these evil ideas to lurk about unchallenged because no one recognizes them for what they are. An example would be Manicheeism. Suppressed in Roman times. Popped up again as the Albigensian Heresy. It was crusaded against. Now you see elements of it in the Gaea movement.

Epytropos -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:27:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl He had access to one if he wanted to read it, Would another make it easier? Then why does it matter? He already had one, now he has two. Nothing has changed.

tazzygirl -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:32:53 PM)
Ah, so you feel you are entitled to tell me how to raise my child. In your mind it doesnt matter, in mine it does. It matters because you, nor the man in this discussion, has the right to circumvent the decisions I have made.,,, the decisions that are not harmful, not torturing, not psychologically abusive.

Kaliko -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:35:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MissImmortalPain I felt the need to share this. It is about a man that will be handing out bibles rather than candy in protest of kids celebrating satans birth. Anyone want to comment? http://ca.news.yahoo.com/pocket-sized-bibles-halloween-treat-091125806.html I am a Halloween killjoy, myself. I have nothing to do with ghosts, witches, the dead, skeletons, or any of the like. I feel it is disrespectful to those that have passed before us. I enjoy the fall festival types of celebrations - pumpkins and hayrides and apple bobbing. But I will never allow any type of "dead" decor in my home, much to my daughter's dismay. I'm also not necessarily a Christian, so I would never be handing out Bibles. I think it's a harmless enough way for this person to make that statement if he so chooses. If nothing else, if my daughter wasn't already acquainted with the Bible, it would allow me the opportunity to teach her about a faith that many people have. Nothing wrong with that. And, regarding another posting with the question about the man handing out Mein Kampf, I would have to admit that I would not accept that. However, I don't walk up to the door anymore with my daughter and her friends - moms stay at the end of the driveways - so if she took it and we found it in her bag, I would either dispose of it without discussion or use it as an opportunity to start a discussion about a tough topic of history. It is obviously a different thing than handing out a Bible.

Epytropos -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:38:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Ah, so you feel you are entitled to tell me how to raise my child. In your mind it doesnt matter, in mine it does. It matters because you, nor the man in this discussion, has the right to circumvent the decisions I have made.,,, the decisions that are not harmful, not torturing, not psychologically abusive. Skipping past the fact that you declined to answer my question, this is purely a control issue. Just because you had a kid you think you get to build him in your image, but the fact is that he is a human being living in society. If you don't want him interacting with society, there is an obvious solution: Don't let him leave the house. But if you're going to take that route, let's not try and pretend you're all about letting him make his own decisions, because if you were you would take no issue with outside information being dispersed. You want to control what he can and cannot read, and this guy is threatening that tenuous information control schema.

Kaliko -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:41:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Epytropos quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Ah, so you feel you are entitled to tell me how to raise my child. In your mind it doesnt matter, in mine it does. It matters because you, nor the man in this discussion, has the right to circumvent the decisions I have made.,,, the decisions that are not harmful, not torturing, not psychologically abusive. Skipping past the fact that you declined to answer my question, this is purely a control issue. Just because you had a kid you think you get to build him in your image, but the fact is that he is a human being living in society. If you don't want him interacting with society, there is an obvious solution: Don't let him leave the house. But if you're going to take that route, let's not try and pretend you're all about letting him make his own decisions, because if you were you would take no issue with outside information being dispersed. You want to control what he can and cannot read, and this guy is threatening that tenuous information control schema. I know this wasn't directed at me, but if I may comment on the above, there's a way to introduce children to topics. I don't hide anything from my daughter. But it's my preference to introduce the tougher topics in the way I choose to, not have them thrust at her at another's choosing. It will happen, no doubt...so I can only try to mediate those instances that I can. Especially with children at a younger age...that's just being a parent.

SpanishMatMaster -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:41:05 PM)
Dear Aylee, I am asking myself which part of "I am not inclined to handle this further. I consider that you are missing many important points and are horribly wrong, but I do not feel the need to explain it further." you did not understand. You are still missing important points, but I am not inclined to discuss this fruther. Therefore, I humbly ask you (a petition, not a command) to let it be. If you do not (an information, not a threat) I will put you on "hide". Thank you very much for your attention.

Hillwilliam -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:41:32 PM)
I'm gonna repost this with slightly different wording because it got removed last night and it's My own damn fault for not paying attention. (ty VAD for bringing it to my attention) Religion is like a penis. A large portion of the population has one and some are inordinately proud of theirs. That doesn't give you a right to flaunt it in public or cram it down some unsuspecting person's throat.

Epytropos -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:45:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kaliko quote: ORIGINAL: Epytropos quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Ah, so you feel you are entitled to tell me how to raise my child. In your mind it doesnt matter, in mine it does. It matters because you, nor the man in this discussion, has the right to circumvent the decisions I have made.,,, the decisions that are not harmful, not torturing, not psychologically abusive. Skipping past the fact that you declined to answer my question, this is purely a control issue. Just because you had a kid you think you get to build him in your image, but the fact is that he is a human being living in society. If you don't want him interacting with society, there is an obvious solution: Don't let him leave the house. But if you're going to take that route, let's not try and pretend you're all about letting him make his own decisions, because if you were you would take no issue with outside information being dispersed. You want to control what he can and cannot read, and this guy is threatening that tenuous information control schema. I know this wasn't directed at me, but if I may comment on the above, there's a way to introduce children to topics. I don't hide anything from my daughter. But it's my preference to introduce the tougher topics in the way I choose to, not have them thrust at her at another's choosing. It will happen, no doubt...so I can only try to mediate those instances that I can. Especially at a younger age...that's just being a parent. Sounds like a control issue to me. Information need not be packaged in a certain way unless you intend it to have a certain effect. If you simply want a child to be able to make their own decision, then the information can come at them from anywhere and in any form.

Kaliko -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:45:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam I'm gonna repost this with slightly different wording because it got removed last night and it's My own damn fault for not paying attention. (ty VAD for bringing it to my attention) Religion is like a penis. A large portion of the population has one and some are inordinately proud of theirs. That doesn't give you a right to flaunt it in public or cram it down some unsuspecting person's throat. Hmm. This popped right into my head when I read that: Replace "religion" with "opinion." We all do that, all the time, right here on the boards. Everyone does it, everywhere. What is so different from you flaunting your opinion right here in this posting and him flaunting his religion on his doorstep?

SpanishMatMaster -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:46:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kaliko Especially at a younger age...that's just being a parent. Yes, children are not adults, and should not be handled like adults. A parent has special responsabilities and should do its best for his child and the society this child will grow in. This is one, only one of the many errors some people are making here. But exactly because of this difficult and complex responsability, I do not feel like telling anybody how to raise his/her child. So... I gave my opinion to the initial posting, I guess the best I can do is just to say bye to this thread. Or does somebody have any question specifically directed to me, before I go?

Aylee -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:47:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SpanishMatMaster Dear Aylee, I am asking myself which part of "I am not inclined to handle this further. I consider that you are missing many important points and are horribly wrong, but I do not feel the need to explain it further." you did not understand. You are still missing important points, but I am not inclined to discuss this fruther. Therefore, I humbly ask you (a petition, not a command) to let it be. If you do not (an information, not a threat) I will put you on "hide". Thank you very much for your attention. It was not a private conversation. This is a group conversation. Deal with it. Wash a valium down with some rum if you need it for relaxation. Just go with the flow, man.

AdorkableAiley -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:48:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam I'm gonna repost this with slightly different wording because it got removed last night and it's My own damn fault for not paying attention. (ty VAD for bringing it to my attention) Religion is like a penis. A large portion of the population has one and some are inordinately proud of theirs. That doesn't give you a right to flaunt it in public or cram it down some unsuspecting person's throat. It's not being crammed its being offered, there is a difference.

Kaliko -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:49:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Epytropos Sounds like a control issue to me. Information need not be packaged in a certain way unless you intend it to have a certain effect. If you simply want a child to be able to make their own decision, then the information can come at them from anywhere and in any form. I disagree with you 100%. And I will use an extreme example: My daughter's best friend was murdered when she was five. She didn't just die. She was murdered in a brutal way that made newspapers nationwide. Are you saying it would have been acceptable for me to allow her to watch the news to hear the horrific details of her friend's death? Or should the news have come from me and her father? Do I even really have to ask that question?

ricken -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:51:42 PM)
If this guy wants to give out bibles, so what like it's been said before, no big deal, no one has to read it....and if pissed off kids egg and TP his house, no big deal. As far as my opinion of the bible, I think everyone should read it, some good stories, some good lessons to learn from the stories. I'm sure theres probably even one in there about not giving people what they want (candy) and getting punished (house TP'd) As for me, kids are getting candy. I ain't gonna start preachin about health or god or nothing to them, let the little rug rats have some fun being little kids, the worlds too fucked up anyway.

Epytropos -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:52:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kaliko quote: ORIGINAL: Epytropos Sounds like a control issue to me. Information need not be packaged in a certain way unless you intend it to have a certain effect. If you simply want a child to be able to make their own decision, then the information can come at them from anywhere and in any form. I disagree with you 100%. And I will use an extreme example: My daughter's best friend was murdered when she was five. She didn't just die. She was murdered in a brutal way that made newspapers nationwide. Are you saying it would have been acceptable for me to allow her to watch the news to hear the horrific details of her friend's death? Or should the news have come from me and her father? Do I even really have to ask that question? There is a difference between something potentially traumatic and simple information. There is nothing in the bible which is in any way as traumatic as a brutal murder of a close friend and you know it.

SpanishMatMaster -> RE: Trick-or-bible (10/29/2011 1:54:36 PM)
Aylee, even being a public conversation, you are speaking to me. Your reaction is disrespectful and I do not think that our communication will have any value to any of us. Therefore I will set you on "hide" now. I wish you a good life. Goodbye.

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