RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ...

RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 11:23:51 AM)
quote: I think it would be a good idea to have all parties present. I think you are a few cards short of a full deck... but there ya go.

Lucylastic -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 11:27:57 AM)
isnt that speshul???

FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:05:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl 1. An alibi, 2. Revenge, rage or retribution, 3. Compensation for a sense of personal failure, 4. Overwhelming need for attention. 5. Financial motives (not through legal channels, but for settlements) 6. Political the "list". One thing, that should be glaringly obvious, is missing in this list. How many of these were determined not to be true allegations because a woman dropped the charges? Where do those fit in? quote: For example, in terms of the initial disclosure, unlike false accusers, true victims tend to go directly to law enforcement to file a report. False accusers are more apt to tell family members or close friends, who either report the rape themselves or push the victim to do so. Really??? We are going with that, really??? First, you can argue with the peer reviewed article if you wish. Those aren't my words. But I don't see the problem. We are talking about the universe of "women who have lied", not "all who have reported" or "those who choose not to report". In fact, in the paragraph just before the sentence you quote, it says this: McDowell compared the initial rape accusations made by "proven" victims with those made by "disproved" complainants. So, yeah, I'll go with that. Now ... We can agree that some women have lied about rape, despite the serious consequences if they falsely report a rape to police, where they can get into serious trouble themselves by so lying? Would you anticipate that lying about sexual harassment would be more likely, less likely are about the same as for rape? Firm

FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:07:26 PM)
FR: Please, people ... can we cut the barbs and such, and keep the tone a little higher? VAA has already locked and is reviewing one Cain thread for "attitude". Why not keep this one at a little higher tone? Thanks Firm

tazzygirl -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:19:42 PM)
quote: False accusers are more apt to tell family members or close friends, who either report the rape themselves or push the victim to do so. You can "go with that" if you want... its a lie. A blatant lie. A lie so abhorrent that it makes it impossible for me to take what else he wrote without skepticism.

FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:25:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic you notice why a majority of women here arent calling them(women) liars? why is that do you think? I suspect it is because women have been the objects of sexual attention of men since before we lived in caves, and have all had situations in which they were uncertain, or felt intimidated, or unduly pressured or even raped or otherwise taken advantage of and therefore can sympathize with any women making that claim. Firm

FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:28:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: False accusers are more apt to tell family members or close friends, who either report the rape themselves or push the victim to do so. You can "go with that" if you want... its a lie. A blatant lie. A lie so abhorrent that it makes it impossible for me to take what else he wrote without skepticism. So, you want to argue in defense of proven liars? The research indicates that liars are more likely to tell family members or close friends first, rather than the police ... it makes no comment, nor judgment about women who have actually been raped, but did not report it, nor does it say that women who have actually been raped do not sometimes tell family members or close friends first. You are choosing to be outraged for no good reason. Firm

Lucylastic -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:29:32 PM)
WHy do you think I didnt respond ... Why havent the NRA come out with the truth, they arent denying two settlements/agreements/non disclosure payments? instead of calling the women liars off the bat.. why are the NRA not coming out on his side? oooh Obama ??? must be! its the only possible reason [8\|]

tazzygirl -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:32:39 PM)
quote: The research indicates that liars are more likely to tell family members or close friends first, rather than the police ... it makes no comment, nor judgment about women who have actually been raped, but did not report it, nor does it say that women who have actually been raped do not sometimes tell family members or close friends first. It said liars tell families first and friends first. For example, in terms of the initial disclosure, unlike false accusers, true victims tend to go directly to law enforcement to file a report. False accusers are more apt to tell family members or close friends, who either report the rape themselves or push the victim to do so. He compares true victims... those who go to police with false accusers... those who tell family or close friends

Lucylastic -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:40:13 PM)
oh dont Tazzy that is just to ignorant to even comment on. Next it will be only people who go to the police are telling the truth..so Joe Pa should be reinstated cos no one told the police how many years ago?>> the priests should get away with diddling kids because they told their families rather than the police its utter crap whether its talking about female rapes, harassment, Pederasty, priests or football coaches being guilty and its fucking disgusting. Yes there are people who lie....and they are to be denounced and punished when caught, but to blanket assess one thing and deny others is foolhardy and reprehensible by many of these deniers.

tazzygirl -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 12:44:35 PM)
Its completely reprehensible to believe that simply because someone doesnt run to the police after something so traumatic has occured means they are lying.... ugh! http://www.rainn.org/get-information/legal-information/reporting-rape People need to fucking learn! quote: Many victims say that reporting is the last thing they want to do right after being attacked. That's perfectly understandable — reporting can seem invasive, time consuming and difficult quote: Understandably, many people aren't ready to make the decision about prosecution immediately after an attack. It's normal to want time to think about the decision and talk it over with friends and family. But, yeah, lets blame the victims!

popeye1250 -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:02:06 PM)
quote: Jump to: You know, if these women want money they should sue Ted Kennedy's estate. That would at least be believable as he was a known drunk and philanderer.

tazzygirl -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:10:34 PM)
quote: You know, if these women want money they should sue Ted Kennedy's estate. That would at least be believable as he was a known drunk and philanderer. Do let us know when they ask for money. Out of curiosity, what money do you believe they are after?

willbeurdaddy -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:13:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 quote: Jump to: You know, if these women want money they should sue Ted Kennedy's estate. That would at least be believable as he was a known drunk and philanderer. You make less sense than the View girls, and thats hard to do. Congrats on your accomplishment.

FirmhandKY -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:13:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: The research indicates that liars are more likely to tell family members or close friends first, rather than the police ... it makes no comment, nor judgment about women who have actually been raped, but did not report it, nor does it say that women who have actually been raped do not sometimes tell family members or close friends first. It said liars tell families first and friends first. For example, in terms of the initial disclosure, unlike false accusers, true victims tend to go directly to law enforcement to file a report. False accusers are more apt to tell family members or close friends, who either report the rape themselves or push the victim to do so. He compares true victims... those who go to police with false accusers... those who tell family or close friends You do know that ... He's talking about liars only, and ... He says "likely" and "tend" not "always" and "without exception". Here, let's see if this clears things up for you (I'm going to make the specific numbers up): "Our research discovered, out of the proven liars, that 53% tend to go to family and friends first to mention the fabricated rape. Women who have actually been raped, when they report it, tend to go to the police first, with 52% of them doing so." In a nutshell, you are then taking an emotional position saying "he's a lying scum bag!" because of that concept. Firm

willbeurdaddy -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:16:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY In a nutshell, you are then taking an emotional position saying "he's a lying scum bag!" because of that concept. Firm You give her too much credit. Shes taking an emotional position because thats all she is capable of taking when women or a conservative are involved. Combine the two and its total meltdown.

tazzygirl -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:19:09 PM)
quote: Another 212 of the total reports were found to be "disproved" as the alleged victim convincingly admitted the complaint was a "hoax" at some point during the initial investigation. How many of these were women who were terrified to continue prosecution?

Lucylastic -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:19:22 PM)
oh , yep ad feminim, gotta be an emotional outburst And you dare claim the high ground Utter bullshit.

tazzygirl -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:24:55 PM)
They keep insisting this is an emotional outburst. How many realize this research was done in 1985. Why is that important? In 1984, Tracey Thurman was awarded 2.3 million dollars in damages from the city of Torrington, Connecticut. http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Taubman… The fact that women couldnt even get a police department to honor a restraining order at that time should definitely speak to the fear level of being beaten by a man they know for reporting him for rape.

TreasureKY -> RE: Cain Accusers' Press Conference ... (11/11/2011 1:38:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic you notice why a majority of women here arent calling them(women) liars? why is that do you think? First, up to this point, there have been only TWO women posting in this thread, at all. Yours and Tazzy's posting history speaks for itself. Second, I can't say that I've seen any of the men in this thread saying outright that the accusers are lying. You may feel differently, but again, yours and Tazzy's posting history speaks for itself; neither of you don't appear to be typically willing to give anyone with politically opposed views to yourself any benefit of the doubt. Third, once more because of yours and Tazzy's posting history, it seems more than likely that... rather than keeping an open mind... you have judged Cain guilty simply because it suits your political leanings and personal prejudices. You may vociferously disagree and say that you are stating what you think is obvious, but there are others who have the capacity to step back to consider a broader array of variables. Some of us would prefer to wait for all the evidence to surface, and acknowledge that we may never know the truth. Finally, if the number of women posting in this thread is any reliable measure of the veracity of the accusers, the bigger question is why aren't there more than two women posters supporting them here?

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