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[Poll]

Biases on collarme?


Posters tend to be more sympathetic to women
  24% (24)
Posters tend to be more sympathetic to men
  0% (0)
Posters tend to be more sympathetic to subs/bottoms
  9% (9)
Posters tend to be more sympathetic to Dominants/Masters
  8% (8)
Posters tend to be more sympathetic to slaves
  3% (3)
There tends to be an anti D/s bias here.
  3% (3)
There tends to be an anti M/s bias here.
  7% (7)
Posters tend to take women more seriously.
  9% (9)
Posters tend to take men more seriously.
  2% (2)
Other
  34% (34)


Total Votes : 99


(last vote on : 10/8/2012 7:10:16 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 4:13:21 AM   
SoulAlloy


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Can't say I've noticed any particular bias, on most threads I see differing opinions. Doesn't seem to be an option for 'not especially' so haven't voted.

I suppose there's an anti-wank thread bias though :p

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 4:26:12 AM   
Zonie63


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

Any person that has ever spoken to a Quebecois gets the notion that all French people (such as Parisians) are the same racist and needlessly arrogant snobs. They don't have reason to be arrogant at all. Their culture is inferior, and their dialect is a bastardization of Euro-French. Then there are those that somehow believe because they speak the language that makes French apart of their background.

They're little ratty counterfeits.
Perhaps you speak for yourself and other Anglo-centric asswipes, but please don't ever claim to speak for me or any other sentient being. You are obviously a product of a Toronto upbringing, and as such serve as a very good example to non Canadians as to why Toronto is so disdained by rational citizens. In brief. Fuck Off you pathetic short dicked little twit, and if you doubt my ability to say it to your face come to Ottawa and Ill happily meet you anywhere and say it to your face as many times as you would like.

In fact I dare you to, but you don't have the balls, do you whimper-baby?



Wow, I never realized just how severe the divide in Canada truly was. Some of my ancestors were French-Canadian, but went to Louisiana after the French and Indian War and became "Cajuns." I don't speak French myself, but from what I've been able to gather from French people I know, they speak a very different style of French in Louisiana than in France or Quebec.

My understanding (and I could be wrong) is that they're nicer to Americans in Montreal than they are in Paris. I knew someone who was a French major in college, and when she was in Paris trying to speak French, they just gave her nothing but crap because it wasn't perfect French. But in Montreal, I've heard that they're far more accommodating if you at least make the effort to try to speak French, even if you're not very good at it.

Toronto, on the other hand, just makes me think of New York City with a Maple Leaf.

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 4:41:16 AM   
Ninebelowzero


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Ya know I really hate this anti French shit. I'm no Francophile by any means but I've veen going to France for rugby matches since '91 & never seen any of the French snob-stereotype. Sure there is some nationalistic ribbing but that's it. We call the Les Frogs, they call us Les Rosbifs, in fact there's even a co joined bar in Paris catering to rugby geeks called Les Frogs et Rosbifs, good bar too. I've sat in stadia swapping brandy/scotch & smokes with the French & I gotta say that bar the Italians bring the best looking female fans to Twickenham. Even when I've been out of Paris with my old job the French have bucked the mythology of being lazy etc.

Oh & France has a great law, every town & village has to have it's own bakery, so you get real bread twice a day, not this fucking styrofoam shit we get in supermarkets. If that's an inferior culture I might just buy into it.

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 5:17:00 AM   
NocturnalStalker


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quote:

Perhaps you speak for yourself and other Anglo-centric asswipes, but please don't ever claim to speak for me or any other sentient being. You are obviously a product of a Toronto upbringing, and as such serve as a very good example to non Canadians as to why Toronto is so disdained by rational citizens


Point proven.  This is the attitude most Quebecois have towards anyone else in Canada.  The second you give these idiotic poseurs a taste of the truth they suddenly crumble from within.  They have titans made of glass inside. 

And I'm the one with prejudice when the Quebec people are the ones that hold disdain for the rest of Canada and wanted to separate so they can speak their primitive dialect of French and probably eat poutine and cry about how the signs in English are too large. 




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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 5:25:25 AM   
TheFireWithinMe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NocturnalStalker

quote:

Perhaps you speak for yourself and other Anglo-centric asswipes, but please don't ever claim to speak for me or any other sentient being. You are obviously a product of a Toronto upbringing, and as such serve as a very good example to non Canadians as to why Toronto is so disdained by rational citizens


Point proven.  This is the attitude most Quebecois have towards anyone else in Canada.  The second you give these idiotic poseurs a taste of the truth they suddenly crumble from within.  They have titans made of glass inside. 

And I'm the one with prejudice when the Quebec people are the ones that hold disdain for the rest of Canada and wanted to separate so they can speak their primitive dialect of French and probably eat poutine and cry about how the signs in English are too large. 




Bullshit! The vast majority of us would be content if separation from Canada were never mentioned again. We consider ourselves Canadian just like those who live outside Quebec...and yes that includes French speaking Quebecers. It's certain politicians who keep raising the fucking issue.

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 5:26:27 AM   
Zonie63


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ninebelowzero

Ya know I really hate this anti French shit. I'm no Francophile by any means but I've veen going to France for rugby matches since '91 & never seen any of the French snob-stereotype. Sure there is some nationalistic ribbing but that's it. We call the Les Frogs, they call us Les Rosbifs, in fact there's even a co joined bar in Paris catering to rugby geeks called Les Frogs et Rosbifs, good bar too. I've sat in stadia swapping brandy/scotch & smokes with the French & I gotta say that bar the Italians bring the best looking female fans to Twickenham. Even when I've been out of Paris with my old job the French have bucked the mythology of being lazy etc.

Oh & France has a great law, every town & village has to have it's own bakery, so you get real bread twice a day, not this fucking styrofoam shit we get in supermarkets. If that's an inferior culture I might just buy into it.


I've never really had any problems with French people I've known here in the U.S., but I've never been to France myself. However, from people I've known who've traveled to Europe, almost all of them have said that Paris is the most unfriendly city they encountered in their travels. I don't know why that is.

On the internet, though, the biggest arguments I've ever seen are between Yanks and Brits. It's amazing, when you really think about it. I sometimes look at the boards on the Internet Movie Database, and for movies like The Patriot, Braveheart, and other historical or war-related films involving the UK, I've found some British to be quite outspoken and passionate in their views, to say the least. Usenet forums like alt.flame.the.usa are similar, where it's Aussies vs. Brits vs. Yanks mixing it up and flaming each other mercilessly.




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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 5:36:34 AM   
LaTigresse


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Everyone seems to dislike someone/thing. I know there are plenty of people/things that I have no use for at all. And I know for certain there are a few people that actively dislike me. I am okay with that as they always fall with the category of nimwits I haven't any use for.

It's funny to me, that people constantly mention that people will say things here that they wouldn't say to a person face to face. I find that extremely odd actually. On here I censor myself a great deal more than I do in person. In person people have the benefit of my body language and facial expressions to better 'read' the intent of my words. On here they don't so I am much more careful what I say and how I say it.

< Message edited by LaTigresse -- 11/13/2011 5:37:07 AM >


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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 5:40:55 AM   
Ninebelowzero


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Lol If you think Braveheart is historical then we have problems. Yeah i've been in situations with Shackledraggers (Aussies to you) where it's got leery but a biff sorted that out on both sides.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Zonie63


quote:

ORIGINAL: Ninebelowzero

Ya know I really hate this anti French shit. I'm no Francophile by any means but I've veen going to France for rugby matches since '91 & never seen any of the French snob-stereotype. Sure there is some nationalistic ribbing but that's it. We call the Les Frogs, they call us Les Rosbifs, in fact there's even a co joined bar in Paris catering to rugby geeks called Les Frogs et Rosbifs, good bar too. I've sat in stadia swapping brandy/scotch & smokes with the French & I gotta say that bar the Italians bring the best looking female fans to Twickenham. Even when I've been out of Paris with my old job the French have bucked the mythology of being lazy etc.

Oh & France has a great law, every town & village has to have it's own bakery, so you get real bread twice a day, not this fucking styrofoam shit we get in supermarkets. If that's an inferior culture I might just buy into it.


I've never really had any problems with French people I've known here in the U.S., but I've never been to France myself. However, from people I've known who've traveled to Europe, almost all of them have said that Paris is the most unfriendly city they encountered in their travels. I don't know why that is.

On the internet, though, the biggest arguments I've ever seen are between Yanks and Brits. It's amazing, when you really think about it. I sometimes look at the boards on the Internet Movie Database, and for movies like The Patriot, Braveheart, and other historical or war-related films involving the UK, I've found some British to be quite outspoken and passionate in their views, to say the least. Usenet forums like alt.flame.the.usa are similar, where it's Aussies vs. Brits vs. Yanks mixing it up and flaming each other mercilessly.







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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 6:49:05 AM   
JstAnotherSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SuzeQ

I didn't mean just casual play, I meant those who's motivation is openly sexual, who admit they do D/s because it turns them on. Its OK to say you spank or whip because it turns you on, but its not really OK to say you obey or want to be obeyed because it turns you on.
There are other reasons, besides it turns you on?

Whoda thunk it.


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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 7:05:47 AM   
Aileen1968


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gungadin09

I'm curious whether forum members think there are any of the following trends here. (multiple selection allowed)

pam




I've been around here since 2005. It really hasn't changed much. Just the names. People have been jumping all over other peoples words for as long as I can remember on this site.
The only thing I think is different is that there weren't as many wanker threads back then and actual topics got discussed and were the longer threads.
Now I know when I see that there's a thread that goes on and on for pages that it's just a trainwreck.
The threads that are worthy of a real discussion barely make it past page one these days.

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 7:57:22 AM   
LadyPact


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gungadin09

So... aside from a bias against individual posters, which we've agreed we can do nothing about, are there any other significant biases on collarme? The one that stands out from the poll is a favoritism towards female posters. And yet, no one has said anything about it. Why do you think that bias is perceived but not mentioned? For those who agree that that's a bias here, do you see the same bias in real life? Or do you perceive it being worse here?

pam

First I want to say that for the most part, this has been an awesome thread.  I hope I don't get too long winded here, but there's just so much good stuff.

To attempt to answer what you are asking here, I do see a particular bias in two areas.  Lifestyle femdoms get an overall automatic acceptance around here.  The only cardinal sin that is the exception to that rule is if that person happens to be a pro or findomme.  If that exception isn't present, a female Dominant will do just fine here.  How often do female Dominants get put to the same scrutiny as males?  Rare, if ever.  Nobody ever questions 'MistressXYZ' with no experience, but a male coming on these boards as 'MasterABC' with the same limited experience gets nailed rather quickly. 

The other big one?  Cheating.  Men don't get the same free pass that women seem to.  Watch the introduction forum sometime.  There are definitely cases of women who sign on here to get a piece of the side who get 'welcomed' but a man doing the same doesn't get the same reaction.  Personally, My feeling is, wherever a person stands on the cheating issue, it shouldn't matter which gender is involved.  Yet, I often see the 'let it slide' attitude depending on if a person is male or female.

While I do see some of certain biases as worse here, I will say that I do also see it in real life as well.  Part of this has to do with the newness factor and another part has to do with presentation.  LaT totally nailed it in a previous post regarding how something is typed up.

I've seen it out in the world, too.  It's just done in a different way.  I've been to munches/events where there have been a few new folks show up where there's an obvious 'favorite' among the first-timers.  Gender is the front runner on that one, with partnered or not partnered being a close second.  Some people get a better reception because they are better looking than someone else or one is more outgoing than the other.  This has absolutely nothing to do with kink.  It's just the way people are in groups.

I'm kind of in the same boat as Hib when she mentioned that a lot of this stuff has just been talked to death for Me.  That part isn't any different here than on Fet.  The 101 stuff just doesn't interest Me unless I'm showing (in real life) somebody a play technique that is new to them.  Typing it out just doesn't thrill Me and if it comes to that, it's probably something that I've typed out before. 

There was so much that LaT and CP said on this thread that I agreed with (not quite all, but darn near most) that I could fill an entire page of this thread.  I'll spare everyone the point by point thing, except this one.

Sorry, but none of the male Dominants around here inspire any sexual reaction in Me.  The only way that works is if I put Myself in their place when they are relating something that talks about sadism and I look at it from the perspective of wanting to do the same thing because I'm a sadist, Myself.  It's the very same thing for Me in the fact that chicks don't turn Me on.  No offense to anyone for that, but the spark just isn't there.


Edited for clarity.


< Message edited by LadyPact -- 11/13/2011 8:02:02 AM >


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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 8:03:48 AM   
Zonie63


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ninebelowzero

Lol If you think Braveheart is historical then we have problems. Yeah i've been in situations with Shackledraggers (Aussies to you) where it's got leery but a biff sorted that out on both sides.


Well, I suppose I should have said historical fiction, but on the forum in question, quite a bit of the actual history does get discussed quite extensively. I just posted a new thread on this subject.

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 1:17:49 PM   
Awareness


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  Christ, this thread would be a lot better if people could ignore the Quebecois highjack.  No good comes from giving the French or French-wannabe's any form of attention - they already think the world revolves around them.  Talking about them just encourages this view.

It's axiomatic that everyone has their own biases, I think we can all agree on this.  To me, what this thread refers to is the resulting group-think exhibited here which is a product of politics.

Yes.  Politics.

Politics is the movement of power in groups - social and otherwise.  It's an intrinsic part of human society, so there's no getting away from it.  With this in mind, it's not hard to see the majority of interactions on these boards as an example of playing politics.  Indeed, I tend to have a meta-view on this which sees most interactions between human beings as having a political component.

The resulting biases are a reflection of the political games which have been played on these boards up to this point.  And there are some natural factors which tend to favour that progression to the current state.  That being, a FemDom bias and general anti-MaleDom attitude - with exceptions.  Male Doms are tolerated if they're either fluffy or don't ruffle any feathers.  The FemDom inability to deal with a mind-set which doesn't flatter their pretensions is one of the reasons why I have trouble taking them seriously.

I - as you've all discussed ad nauseum - have my own bias against male subs.  I think it's a waste of potential.  This, of course, enrages the FemDom set because male subs are their target market and the fuckers are fluffy and make good pets.

Basically, if you're a Male Dom and actually have a spine, you're a target.  From the FemDoms of course, but also from a fair amount of fucked up subs.  I tend to ignore that, because there's as many broken, twisted subs out there as their are fucked up MaleDom wannabes.  As I've said before - this lifestyle attracts dysfunction.

So, the natural factors which favor this.   Women are - by nature - usually more loquacious than men and they grow up playing politics, whereas men grow up playing games which teach them how to target.  Strong men, are rarely going to give a shit what someone thinks so attempting to convert a whole bunch of people by trying to argue them into the ground is always going to be seen as a waste of time.  Men also tend to have no problem going it alone, whereas women are almost automatically drawn into mutual assistance.

Don't believe me, pick a pages-long thread and watch how many of the women in it:

* Respond to a contrary opinion by reinforcing and supporting each other.
* Attempt to attack a guy by talking ABOUT him to other women,  rather than addressing him directly.
* Descend to random insults whenever they see a poster they don't like.

I had one particularly nutty bitch with "sexy" in her name - an irony if ever there was one - follow me round for literally MONTHS making personal attacks whenever she saw a post of mine.  Not once did she get pulled up by the moderators, but if I take someone's head off, I do it so effectively, I get an email from the fuckers.  The inconsistency is amusing but simultaneously mind-boggling.

Personally, I find posting wank-fodder for the chicks kind of demeaning.  It's an appeal for popularity.  If a chick wants to know what's in my head, she needs to invest some time and effort.  Nevertheless, some dudes do it and it always makes me roll my eyes.

I think the most damning aspect of all this is the general flavour of intolerance which comes from this FemDom established board hierarchy.  In general, the BDSM community is on the fringes of society and is acquainted with intolerance and the various ways in which their kink can be used against them.  Should we therefore be surprised when those adherents turn out to be as intolerant of others whose kink doesn't match their own?

Not really.  It's just people.  I'm always going to look down on the scat-fairies, I don't care how you wanna dress it up.  And while the FemDom folks would - you think - have something in common with Male Doms, more often than not, it becomes patently obvious that they feel threatened.  As I've said, I find FemDoms unconvincing, but I seriously don't have the time and inclination to hunt down their posts, post rebuttals to everything they say and make up pet insult names for them.  Whereas I've experienced all those things on a consistent basis from those very same people.

I just shrug and note it as further evidence of their weakness.  There is one exception which comes to mind. although I'm 50/50 on whether she's the real deal or just more experienced.  We'll see.

Oh, and I'll agree with the newcomer thing.  Newbies get jumped unless they're hot.  Chicks fawn if a dude has a pic up and is hot - provided he's not so arrogant they feel they could never score with him.  Dudes just tend to fawn if a chick is hot, regardless of her attitude.  Again, just people, but it wouldn't hurt for some of those to think about their actions and realise what they're telling us about themselves.

Edit:  Oh, forgot this one.  If you want to see the female need to belong in action - check how many female signatures have nonsensical addendums which state they belong to this or that miscellaneous group, they're "approved" by some individual or they have this many points.

Now check how many dudes have the same thing.

You're welcome.  For further enlightenment, just quote your credit card #.


< Message edited by Awareness -- 11/13/2011 1:27:24 PM >


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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 1:29:01 PM   
gungadin09


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
First I want to say that for the most part, this has been an awesome thread. 


Thanks, i'm flattered that You think so.

pam

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 2:27:53 PM   
Ninebelowzero


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Bollocks

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 2:48:08 PM   
HeatherMcLeather


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He's just demonstrating his personal bias.

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 3:00:02 PM   
Kaliko


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

Personally, I find posting wank-fodder for the chicks kind of demeaning. It's an appeal for popularity. If a chick wants to know what's in my head, she needs to invest some time and effort. Nevertheless, some dudes do it and it always makes me roll my eyes.



Awareness, just by posting what it is you just posted, you have posted wank-fodder for some. There's no telling what turns some women on, you know.


quote:



 Edit:  Oh, forgot this one.  If you want to see the female need to belong in action - check how many female signatures have nonsensical addendums which state they belong to this or that miscellaneous group, they're "approved" by some individual or they have this many points.




I think that's a small group.

To which, ahem, I haven't been invited. But it's okay. I'm not bitter.

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 3:50:33 PM   
Arpig


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quote:

Edit: Oh, forgot this one. If you want to see the female need to belong in action - check how many female signatures have nonsensical addendums which state they belong to this or that miscellaneous group, they're "approved" by some individual or they have this many points.
I'm inclined to agree with this. It always makes me think of the scene from life of Brian...."Yes, We are all individuals!" 

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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 3:53:32 PM   
LillyBoPeep


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one thing that i did notice --

recently a male sub posted about what to buy himself for christmas. he mentioned getting himself a collar and some kind of chastity device, and responses were like "why would you do that without knowing what your hypothetical Mistress would want?"

previously, i'd made a post about headboxes and how i thought i might like to build one just to play with it. no one posted to me "why would you do that without knowing what your hypothetical Dude would want?" instead, a guy came along and showed me the design of one he'd made.

some of that is informed by their experiences of having guys come up to them saying "use this on me exactly this way," but i couldn't help but notice the difference in responses to similar questions...


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RE: Biases on collarme? - 11/13/2011 4:02:33 PM   
Arpig


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I haven't seen either of those threads, but I have seen the same sort of thing often. A lot of it has to do with history, both your history as a poster, and the general long standing pattern of male subs making do-me posts.

As well, there is, among the Dommes on this site, a definite streak of nastiness, which comes out most often against male subs. Which is a little odd when you think about it.


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