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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:19:02 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Oh, but thats the thing.  You want to post unfactual bullshit and call it debate but it is clearly obfuscation of the truth.

We on the other hand use facts, logic and reason to debate.   

And no, the point remains, you have no credble evidence for the 'freed' 26 million.  Because there is no credible evidence of their unwilling incarceration to begin with. 

Did they spontaneously jump up and start creating a path to their own destiny as did all these other countries ?  Nope.

If they were so glad that we gave them this freedom from whatever, why didnt they greet us with open arms and loving kisses as the neo-cons had fantasized?  Why did they throw shoes at Bush instead of flowers?  Why is that ratfuck in hiding, old W?  Why did it turn into a 9 year free for all?

Explain that in detail so that we may all become enlightened  on one of those basic things you see......that nobody else does, other than other dishonest travellers.

So, your free point, liberation point, is as misinformed as your 50 million point. 

So, there is no debate coming from your side, it is reasonable people pointing out to you that since not one of your premises is correct, the excluded middle does not hold and your conclusion is incorrect.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 12/26/2011 10:24:02 AM >

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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:25:07 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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Certainly, if Iraq were this grand la la land that leftists like to claim that it was prior to the liberation then we shouldnt have gone in

Sadly though, that "Iraq was a la la land" propaganda has no basis in reality

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Oh, but thats the thing.  You want to post unfactual bullshit and call it debate but it is clearly obfuscation of the truth.

We on the other hand use facts, logic and reason to debate.   

And no, the point remains, you have no credble evidence for the 'freed' 26 million.  Because there is no credible evidence of their unwilling incarceration to begin with. 

Did they spontaneously jump up and start creating a path to their own destiny as did all these other countries ?  Nope.

If they were so glad that we gave them this freedom from whatever, why didnt they greet us with open arms and loving kisses as the neo-cons had fantasized?  Why did they throw shoes at Bush instead of flowers?  Why is that ratfuck in hiding, old W?  Why did it turn into a 9 year free for all?

Explain that in detail so that we may all become enlightened  on one of those basic things you see......that nobody else does, other than other dishonest travellers.

So, your free point, liberation point, is as misinformed as your 50 million point. 


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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:27:16 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Well, you retort with more unfactual bullshit. It doesnt do anything for your intellectually dishonest case. You got a cite for la-la land or is that more of the neo-con teabagger fantasy?  

Cuz nobody nowhere said anything like that.  And we shouldn't have gone in la-la or no-la.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 12/26/2011 10:28:48 AM >

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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:31:46 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		I'm not in the US, so I may be missing an in-joke here...

... you're not actually for real, right, Sanity?

I mean, this has been a fun legpull on your part, these aren't "thoughts" you're seriously fronting, right?

Just have to be sure. Someone pointed out it might actually not be a joke, but I can't realistically credit that without an admission.

Health,
al-Aswad.


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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:34:08 AM   
Politesub53


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Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Certainly, if Iraq were this grand la la land that leftists like to claim that it was prior to the liberation then we shouldnt have gone in

Sadly though, that "Iraq was a la la land" propaganda has no basis in reality




Show me where anyone claimed that ? All i remember saying myself is if we go in, we will make a bad situation worse. Why do you think Bush snr called a halt when he did, despite urging the marsh Arabs to rise up ? The answer is he, and his advisers, knew the likely outcome. A Shia ruled state to replace Saddam.

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Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:39:49 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
One honest one in the bunch...

Thank you for at least acknowledging the reality in prewar Iraq

Thats far more than certain others are even capable of

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Certainly, if Iraq were this grand la la land that leftists like to claim that it was prior to the liberation then we shouldnt have gone in

Sadly though, that "Iraq was a la la land" propaganda has no basis in reality




Show me where anyone claimed that ? All i remember saying myself is if we go in, we will make a bad situation worse. Why do you think Bush snr called a halt when he did, despite urging the marsh Arabs to rise up ? The answer is he, and his advisers, knew the likely outcome. A Shia ruled state to replace Saddam.


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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:42:35 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		When do you think you are going to be honest enough to acknowledge the reality in post-war Iraq? 

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Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:46:54 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Never

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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:48:50 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

I'm not in the US, so I may be missing an in-joke here...

... you're not actually for real, right, Sanity?

I mean, this has been a fun legpull on your part, these aren't "thoughts" you're seriously fronting, right?

Just have to be sure. Someone pointed out it might actually not be a joke, but I can't realistically credit that without an admission.

Health,
al-Aswad.


He is really serious believe it or not.

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Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:49:09 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
When will certain leftists have the requisite debating skills to attack the topic rather than the messenger

Never




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RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:51:48 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


When will certain leftists have the requisite debating skills to attack the topic rather than the messenger

Never




There ya go again, calling yourself a leftist.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 10:53:37 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		We have attacked the topic.  As pathetic as it is now, from when you introduced your unrealistically unknowledgeable spin to it, buttressed by further misconceptions and false dichotomiess, non sequturs, ad hominems, straw men, and red herrings,  we pointed out that even given a vast amount of undeserving weight to serindipity, valid conclusions do not follow from non-facts.

You are making it about you, nobody else would trouble to do it, as it is so unworthy a subject of any deliberative discussion.


< Message edited by mnottertail -- 12/26/2011 10:54:45 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 11:15:20 AM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		the topic is iraq, not leftists who are only attacking the messenger who cant get his facts straight, about the facts that he cant get straight. its incredulity at the points you have made so many errors in.
You claimed iraq had fifty million liberated, you were wrong, both on the number and on the vote record, when you keep offering up the wrong information , it does become problem on how to get the person who has no facts, that he is continually not worth debating with, because the facts are wrong. Its the post of bull that are the issue.


< Message edited by Lucylastic -- 12/26/2011 11:27:01 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 11:53:42 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
Actually lucy, it is obvious that I am the topic... as always

Some day you and yours may manage to tone down your shared obsession with me but until that day comes the spotlight shall remain mine, and mine alone

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

the topic is iraq, not leftists who are only attacking the messenger who cant get his facts straight, about the facts that he cant get straight. its incredulity at the points you have made so many errors in.
You claimed iraq had fifty million liberated, you were wrong, both on the number and on the vote record, when you keep offering up the wrong information , it does become problem on how to get the person who has no facts, that he is continually not worth debating with, because the facts are wrong. Its the post of bull that are the issue.



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Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 11:58:55 AM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		you think way to highly of your abilties dear boy. However nothing I have said, is attacking you, but thepoints and untruths you keep posting.
Truly, the thought that you are anything more important than an itch, is laughable.
I get annoyed simply with your utter dereliction of facts, Please show your facts to go along with your assumptions, are you trying to argue that your figures of 50 million are accurate?
by whose count?
yours?
not factual, and WRONG

< Message edited by Lucylastic -- 12/26/2011 12:00:19 PM >

_____________________________

(•_•)
<) )╯SUCH
/ \

\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
/ \

(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

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Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 12:11:30 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=3973729

Ive admitted already that I misspoke about the population of Iraq, but this obsession over my misstatement will probably continue for weeks

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

you think way to highly of your abilties dear boy. However nothing I have said, is attacking you, but thepoints and untruths you keep posting.
Truly, the thought that you are anything more important than an itch, is laughable.
I get annoyed simply with your utter dereliction of facts, Please show your facts to go along with your assumptions, are you trying to argue that your figures of 50 million are accurate?
by whose count?
yours?
not factual, and WRONG


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Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 12:13:03 PM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=3973729

Ive admitted already that I misspoke about the population of Iraq, but this obsession over my misstatement will probably continue for weeks

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

you think way to highly of your abilties dear boy. However nothing I have said, is attacking you, but thepoints and untruths you keep posting.
Truly, the thought that you are anything more important than an itch, is laughable.
I get annoyed simply with your utter dereliction of facts, Please show your facts to go along with your assumptions, are you trying to argue that your figures of 50 million are accurate?
by whose count?
yours?
not factual, and WRONG


Have you not been obsessed with "57 states" for years now?

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Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 12:13:55 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
As will the obsession over me itself...


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Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 12:16:43 PM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline 		I wouldn't call it an obsession so much as an easy target.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Iraq Trembles Amid Renewed Sectarian Violence... - 12/26/2011 12:26:14 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
Easy target for what - you and your friends' constant personal attacks? Easy target for making into the topic as opposed to Iraq, etc

Exactly my point, thanks for validating it

Ever consider trying to learn how to post on topic instead?

There are debate classes online, go attend to one

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

I wouldn't call it an obsession so much as an easy target.


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Profile   Post #: 100
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