quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Politesub that's what you don't get, IF that's what people feel needs to be changed then that's what they need to do CHANGE IT.  Not wait for someone else to do it.  If they can't get jobs because their jobs are overseas then they need to find other jobs they may be able to do, or change their education in some way.  Is that EASY hell no, i am not saying ANY of this is easy.  But you all want to be sooo specific that you fail to see the overall problem. 

Most of you are so caught up on blaming everyone else that you fail to see the POTENTIAL and possibility EACH INDIVIDUAL has to make fucking changes in this country.   People want to sit around crying about the wealthy and what they have, or call corporations criminals etc etc etc.   You know usually when you fix a problem you start at the beginning.  The beginning is with the individual, and as each individual changes and makes different choice and works to make those choices matter, it comes together in a bigger way.

People want to make changes at the top and wait and see if any of it filters down to them.

angel

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

LET THEM EAT CAKE!!
history repeating itself?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

LET THEM EAT CAKE!!
history repeating itself?

Can only warn people, Lucy, you cant make them believe until it hits them right between the eyes.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

LET THEM EAT CAKE!!
history repeating itself?

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

the lower class is made of many people who were in the upper to middle class just years ago Tazzy.  You who loves statistics should know that.

So what's your explanation to that?  That what they once were doesn't mean anything?  That they have no clue and are simply poor people now?

Sorry i don't buy it.  You may, but i have faith in people and once they realize their is no rescue coming, those people who had once been mid to upper middle class and wealthy will start fighting back to be where they were if not better and i am hoping they take some others with them. 

As i said Tazzy, you want to "give up" on people so to speak, i believe in them and believe they are capable of a lot more than what they are showing.


YES, i get it, its hard and depressing and many people HAVE given up.  That's the problem.

angel

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

MSLA:

Of course they should, but many on the LEFT side of the fence look at the surgeon as some sort of evil one-percenter for doing so.

CREDIBLE CITATION PLEASE.

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

MSLA:

The LEFT feels you TAKE other people's money and redistribute it, where the RIGHT feels the "floor sweeper" has a responsibility to themselves to gain the needed skills to earn more in another profession.

THAT OTHER PEOPLES MONEY WAS OURS, AND the government under republican administrations have seen that we are removed of it and given it to Corporations.

quote:

the lower class is made of many people who were in the upper to middle class just years ago Tazzy.  You who loves statistics should know that.

So what's your explanation to that?  That what they once were doesn't mean anything?  That they have no clue and are simply poor people now?

quote:

As i said Tazzy, you want to "give up" on people so to speak, i believe in them and believe they are capable of a lot more than what they are showing.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

MSLA:

Of course they should, but many on the LEFT side of the fence look at the surgeon as some sort of evil one-percenter for doing so.

CREDIBLE CITATION PLEASE.

It's the biggest LEFTY of them all... the giant idiot in the Oval Office is where this comes from...

1)  First, the Idiot-In-Chief cites "millionaires and billionaires" as WHO should pay more:

"This jobs bill is fully paid for by asking millionaires and billionaires to pay their fair share," Obama said. "Some see this as class warfare. I see it as a simple choice: We can either keep taxes exactly as they are for millionaires and billionaires..."

Link: http://articles.cnn.com/2011-10-06/politics/politics_obama-economy_1_jobs-bill-jobs-plan-surtax?_s=PM:POLITICS


2)  Then, under his plan, the Idiot-In-Chief defines said "millionaires and billionaires" as those making $200,000+ per year who need to pay more:

"Barack Obama's plans to target individuals earning more than $200,000 a year for tax rises has provoked a furious backlash from Republicans who say the President is ruining the future of America's children. Individuals earning more than $200,000 a year and families earning more than $250,000 - around one in 50 households - are likely to be left worse off by the proposed changes to the U.S. tax system."

Link: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2039203/Obama-tax-increase-proposal-2011-Plan-target-families-earning-250k-more.html


3) Surgeon Compensation -- up to $500,000+ (which is MORE than $200K, annually)

Link: http://healthcareers.about.com/od/compensationinformation/f/TopPayDoctors.htm


Thus, given "surgeons" CLEARLY make more than $200,000 dollars per year, the absolute idiot in the Oval Office is the one who has determined the "surgeons" are part of the evil 1% of "millionaires and billionaires".

*Note:  The use of "surgeons" in my earlier post was in response to the example used by another poster -- i.e., "surgeons" are meant to imply those that considered "rich".

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

MSLA:

The LEFT feels you TAKE other people's money and redistribute it, where the RIGHT feels the "floor sweeper" has a responsibility to themselves to gain the needed skills to earn more in another profession.

THAT OTHER PEOPLES MONEY WAS OURS, AND the government under republican administrations have seen that we are removed of it and given it to Corporations.

Oh?!!  Soooooooo then the Gov. deducted some money from your bank account or paycheck and gave it to Microsoft or GE?!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

LET THEM EAT CAKE!!
history repeating itself?

I am really glad people are seeing this!

Everything is a cycle and it is by design.

the bank is the greatest evil because the people cannot control it.

its usually a 10 year boom bust cycle.

what they are doing today parrots what they did when they crashed it in the great depression.

Have to dig your ass off in the history books to see it.

but it IS by design

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Once again, your lack of understanding is showing.

quote:



Just how much does a surgeon earn a year?

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What do you feel is the minimum annual income required to qualify for the 1%?

quote:



Do you really feel that there's no gap between the two sums?

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

A "gap" between what... a Secretary earning $40,000 a year and a CEO earning $400,000 a year?!!  Yes, there's a "gap", so fucking what?!!  When the Secretary qualifies for, and begins doing, the CEO's job, or the Cashier qualifies for, and begins doing, the President's job, or the Janitor qualifies for, and begins doing, the COO's job, then the "gap" will disappear.

Neat how that works, huh?!!

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ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

And 10 people to a house thats rented is against the law in many communities... just for that reason.

Dont blind them with technicalities Tazzy, thats just not fair.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

A "gap" between what... a Secretary earning $40,000 a year and a CEO earning $400,000 a year?!!  Yes, there's a "gap", so fucking what?!!  When the Secretary qualifies for, and begins doing, the CEO's job, or the Cashier qualifies for, and begins doing, the President's job, or the Janitor qualifies for, and begins doing, the COO's job, then the "gap" will disappear.

Neat how that works, huh?!!

20 years ago, I was a materials scientist making about 40K/year. I was on salary (people do that when you have a mortgage) and sometimes working 80+ hours/week.

Our CEO who was busy "Enronning" the company was pulling down 250K+ for a 30 hour week.

His decisions made him a coupla million on his stock options and about ruined everyone else, employees and investors alike. Our stock which had topped at about $5/share got so low that it was delisted on NASDAQ. After his conviction for interstate mail fraud (he was absconding with our 401K monies and it wasn't by far his first conviction. I stopped counting at 7 the companies he had done this to) he got probation and everyone left in the company was asked to take a pay cut or leave.

In the mean time, he went on his merry way and started doing it again to another company.

So tell me. Who should make more?

An electron microscopist with double science majors and 3 years grad school who works 60-80 hour weeks and bills clients an average of 50K/month or Mr hereditary who knows how to play the system and bankrupt companies because his daddy is connected?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

you said many, you only showed one.