RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women

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kalikshama -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 5:54:49 AM)
quote: I daresay the vast majority of birth control is taken by MONOGAMOUS, MARRIED women. That's a good supposition - I certainly use condoms during periods of non-monogamy. Lots of good stats here (but alas, none on point to your theory): Facts on Contraceptive Use in the United States June 2010 WHO NEEDS CONTRACEPTIVES? • There are 62 million U.S. women in their childbearing years (15–44).[1] • Seven in 10 women of reproductive age (43 million women) are sexually active and do not want to become pregnant, but could become pregnant if they and their partners fail to use a contraceptive method.[2] • The typical U.S. woman wants only two children. To achieve this goal, she must use contraceptives for roughly three decades.[3] ...TRENDS IN CONTRACEPTIVE USE • The proportion of women aged 15–44 currently using a contraceptive method increased from 56% in 1982 to 64% in 1995, and then declined slightly to 62% in 2002 and 2006–2008.[2] --------- I find it interesting that the proportion of women using contraception declined during the peak of Abstinence-Only Education

kalikshama -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 6:01:20 AM)
quote: Would you rather see them pay an extra $10/month to cover the copay for birth control or would you rather have them pay to deliver 15 babies and cover the cost of any complications because some married woman's husband decides she needs to start squirting out brats every 11 or so months? I heard on NPR that often insurance companies PREFER to give contraception coverage as this is cheaper for them than covering maternity.

PeonForHer -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 6:15:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kalikshama I heard on NPR that often insurance companies PREFER to give contraception coverage as this is cheaper for them than covering maternity. That's a principle that social democratic and conservative governments - outside of the USA, anyway - discovered more than half a century ago. Looking after people a bit saves society as a whole a lot more money in the long run. It's because we take this principle so much for granted that so many of us 'outsiders' look at debates like this within the USA in utter astonishment.

DomMeinCT -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 6:37:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kalikshama quote: Would you rather see them pay an extra $10/month to cover the copay for birth control or would you rather have them pay to deliver 15 babies and cover the cost of any complications because some married woman's husband decides she needs to start squirting out brats every 11 or so months? I heard on NPR that often insurance companies PREFER to give contraception coverage as this is cheaper for them than covering maternity. If an employer is self insured (as are most large corporations, where the employer is paying the risk of the insurance and the insurance company is only doing the administrative services - ASO), it has nothing to do with what the insurance company wants. In an ASO situation, the employer calls all the shots what is to be covered, or how difficult it may be to get (say, raising a copay higher for certain drugs), barring legislation. I worked for an insurance company for years that insured a large tobacco company and we complied with their demands to limit information about smoking dangers. The insurance company removed all the pre-recorded audio helpline topics available to their employees that dealt with smoking, quitting smoking, and the dangers of smoking. In ASO situations, employers are the decision makers in what benefits are available to their employees.

SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 6:48:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kalikshama quote: My company doesn't cover birth control...plain simple period.. regardless of laws.. Thanks to iamsemisweet I got my shot covered.. but only with proof... If you detail what you had to do to get your company to cover your shot, you'll no doubt be helping others. There are a lot of lurkers who never post. I threatened to sue the company and insurance for the violation of the eeoc... They now cover it with the above described...

kalikshama -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 6:51:22 AM)
YAY!

Lucylastic -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 8:45:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kalikshama quote: I daresay the vast majority of birth control is taken by MONOGAMOUS, MARRIED women. That's a good supposition - I certainly use condoms during periods of non-monogamy. Lots of good stats here (but alas, none on point to your theory): Facts on Contraceptive Use in the United States June 2010 WHO NEEDS CONTRACEPTIVES? • There are 62 million U.S. women in their childbearing years (15–44).[1] • Seven in 10 women of reproductive age (43 million women) are sexually active and do not want to become pregnant, but could become pregnant if they and their partners fail to use a contraceptive method.[2] • The typical U.S. woman wants only two children. To achieve this goal, she must use contraceptives for roughly three decades.[3] ...TRENDS IN CONTRACEPTIVE USE • The proportion of women aged 15–44 currently using a contraceptive method increased from 56% in 1982 to 64% in 1995, and then declined slightly to 62% in 2002 and 2006–2008.[2] --------- I find it interesting that the proportion of women using contraception declined during the peak of Abstinence-Only Education I had a look at the latest report out by the UN on Contraceptive use. They only have figures for married or in union women of childbearing age(15-49) In that data it says 74% of those women in the US use birthcontrol...the range of bc methods are mostly encompassing. The site also gives information on mortality rate of women Canada and UK at MMR 12, US is double( MMR 24) The data is from 2010, using the following citeria..The maternal mortality ratio (MMR) is the annual number of female deaths from any cause related to or aggravated by pregnancy or its management (excluding accidental or incidental causes) during pregnancy and childbirth or within 42 days of termination of pregnancy, irrespective of the duration and site of the pregnancy, per 100,000 live births, for a specified year. All information can be found at http://unstats.un.org/unsd/demographic/products/socind/ Now, to MY way of thinking.. A) the figures for birth control participation do not include single women, so are low B) That is the vast majority of women who consider their health and child bearing as a SERIOUS health issue C) as 24 out of a 100,000 women die from childbirth, it most CERTAINLY a SERIOUS health issue. TO belittle birthcontrol as just wanting to have sex is so damn ignorant as to render it pointless. Ive found perusing forums other than this that the same people who are against mandating free birthcontrol, are also against funding Planned parenthood, Welfare, single mothers on welfare and Food programs for the kids of poor people. Taking the little power they have and reducing it even more. [sarcasm} death is too good for em(the poor, the women, the freeloaders, sick, elderly and unemployed) let god sort it out..[/sarcasm} GAH Thanks for the info Kali, Spirited, Im gutted that you have to go thru that shit:( I hope things work out well for you.

MrBukani -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 9:33:08 AM)
Dont know if I said this before but we scrapped birthcontrol out of healthcare. There was a bit debate on it but not much. Healthcare is damn expensive, so cuts are gonna be made anywhere they can. I know you wont like it but havin sex is a choice and should we have free condoms as well? I mean with STD's and all. If we could afford it, everything in healthcare should be free if it concerns your health directly. Our dental plan is gettin scrapped to the bone also. People like me will go abroad to Turkey to get their teeth fixed cause they cannot afford dutch dentists. On the other hand how much is dental work directly related to health? The only way to have fair healthcare is to scrap commercial healthcare altogether. No more commercial pharma industry. etc. Stop puttin your parents in nursinghomes. Surgeons can all make a million for all I care, but not 5 million. A fireman will never make a million and he saves lives a lot too. We can still have commercial R&D and we pay for that cost and they can make a hefty profit selling the patent to the state. Then we can go back to havin free birthcontrol.

Lucylastic -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 10:02:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MrBukani Dont know if I said this before but we scrapped birthcontrol out of healthcare. There was a bit debate on it but not much. Healthcare is damn expensive, so cuts are gonna be made anywhere they can. Viagra and cialis is covered....and use not for "medical reasons" is 75% of the number of users, I would say birth control is a little bit more advantageous to the world than Viagra..which is mostly a vanity drug I know you wont like it but havin sex is a choice and should we have free condoms as well? I mean with STD's and all. Having sex is a biological imperative for procreation. while a conscious choice to actually take part, our bodies are NATURALLY programmed to enjoy, want and need. They havent come out with anything to reduce sex drive yet....well apart from chemical and moralising means, and Im sure all you guys are as likely to agree to no sex except for procreation as I am. Free is a misnomer, if you pay taxes in either UK Or canada, you are paying for BC and healthcare. Many things arent covered. supplemental insurance is available in Canada , I havent lived in the UK for 20 odd years so I dont know it off hand... If we could afford it, everything in healthcare should be free if it concerns your health directly. Again, NOTHING is free Our dental plan is gettin scrapped to the bone also. People like me will go abroad to Turkey to get their teeth fixed cause they cannot afford dutch dentists. On the other hand how much is dental work directly related to health? Actually , dental care is very important to health, get an abscess or gum disease , , loose a molar, and your whole mouth/ can be one BIG nightmare, AND excruciatingly painful. Look how many people NEED their wisdom teeth removed. however, only emergency coverage is covered by the provincial healthcare. Neither is vision care. and many other things I know it hasnt been covered in the UK for years. The only way to have fair healthcare is to scrap commercial healthcare altogether. No more commercial pharma industry. etc. Stop puttin your parents in nursinghomes. Surgeons can all make a million for all I care, but not 5 million. A fireman will never make a million and he saves lives a lot too. We can still have commercial R&D and we pay for that cost and they can make a hefty profit selling the patent to the state. Then we can go back to havin free birthcontrol. Nursing homes will never be closed..Too many people have neither the money or the skill to give the elderly the care they need. Hospitals cannot keep up with the problems of elderly as it is. I get your points, just offering my thoughts:) Edited for formatting

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 12:17:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kalikshama I just scanned the entire Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act for "vast majority," did not find one single instance of the term I just scanned the Constitution for "vast majority", and did not find one single instance of the term, nor did I find it on the menu at Denny's, or in the instruction manual for my car -- see, I can throw out nonsensical meaningless blather like you did too?!! [8\|] quote: and don't understand why you're on about it That's because you're a Lefty... and your entitlement thinking leaves you believing the world owes you everything for FREE just because your DimwitocRAT leaders tell you that you do. You don't. If someone is telling me that I must help PAY THE BILL for someone else's [fill in the blank with whatever], then they need to show me that the need to do is both URGENT, affects THE MAJORITY, and is a NECESSITY. For those who want to have sex on SOMEONE ELSE'S DIME, that doesn't meet the criteria. For those in the other poster's situation (where it's life-threatening), then I'm happy to pitch-in to LOWER the cost, but THEY should be willing to share in the cost of THEIR meds as well. What you Libs can never seem to understand is NOTHING IS FUCKING FREE... NOTHING!!! Someone is fucking paying for it -- either through higher taxes, higher insurance premiums, lower services, or whatever. I'm not willing to pay for someone else's sex life. Got it?!! Sandra Fuck-Head can boo-hoo all fucking day long on TV about why I should pay for her to fuck-fancy-free, but SHE CAN PAY FOR OWN FUCKING BIRTH CONTROL. If my money is going towards helping another lower their prescription drug costs, then I want it going to SENIORS who need their life-saving meds, CHILDREN who need their life-saving meds, people like poster here who needs her life-saving meds -- NOT SOME ENTITLEMENT PIECE OF SHIT LEFTY-RAT THAT'S GOING TO ONE OF THE MOST PRESTIGIOUS LAW SCHOOLS IN THE COUNTRY THAT WANTS OTHERS TO PAY FOR HER TO FUCK-UP-A-STORM DURING LAW SCHOOL!!! Clear enough for you to "undertand" now?!! [8\|]

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 12:26:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess As long as you are willing to fork over $200,000 of your own money for each additional child that comes along... Show me where I'm paying $200,000 OF MY OWN MONEY?!!

BitaTruble -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 12:28:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess Yes, and people who are INJURED from car accidents still have their medical expenses covered. So again, by your own logic, contraception should be covered. Or are you saying that people who are injured in a car accident should NOT be covered by health insurance. My daughter's car was creamed not to long ago by a young lady who had stolen her dads car and only had a learners permit resulting in 5 people going to the hospital. My grandson and the at fault driver spent the night in the hospital. Those bills were covered by car insurance, not health insurance.

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 12:55:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess ...people who are INJURED from car accidents still have their medical expenses covered. So again, by your own logic, contraception should be covered. Yes, and people who are "INJURED" from an actual "health issue" are covered as well. But, as usual, you can't see past your Lefty-Entitlement-Thinking. Those who want FREE birth control have not been "INJURED", have they?!! No, they just want something for FREE!!! They can piss off... millions both PAY for their health insurance, and also cough up their "co-pay" for any scrips they need. Fucking-for-FREE doesn't doesn't trump another who needs life-saving meds that THEY have to pay for. quote: You have not responded to the health issues involved in pregnancy. Yes, I have. Don't wanna get pregnant? Then don't fuck, or pay for your OWN contraception (condoms, pills, or whatever) If pregnancy put you at risk? Then don't fuck, or pay for your OWN contraception (condoms, pills, or whatever) Got pregnant by accident? Keep it and use your maternity care, or visit Planned Parenthood for an abortion. quote: You have not responded to the fact that we all collectively pay for unwanted pregnancies and the children that result. We all "collectively pay" for the sick, as well... so fucking what?!! By your twisted Lefty-Logic, then we should all be covering every fucking person's VITAMINS as well, or their GYM MEMBERSHIP, or similar nonsense -- because that'll cut down on the number of "sick" people as well. Nonsensical Lefty-Entitlement garbage!!! You wanna fuck your brains out... GO FOR IT -- on your own damn dime... fork up $1.00 for a condom, or cough up a whopping $15 bucks for birth control. PAY FOR YOUR OWN FUCKING SEX LIFE!!! For those, like the other poster here, that NEED birth control for an ACTUAL health issue (which is NOT the vast majority of women in the U.S. who take birth control), then that should both be included in their health plan, and available at an affordable co-pay.

PeonForHer -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 12:56:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwynn And it is part of the dementia of the far right that 'lefties' think that 'everything should be free.' It's testimony to the effectiveness of the right wing propaganda of generations, really. The mantra that it's lefties, rather than righties, who 'want everything to be free' has been chanted so much and for so long that people have had their brains pummeled into believing it. Likewise, nowadays, there is no 'social responsibility', there's only 'individual responsibility'. Society owes nothing to people who bring up children so that these children, as adults, work for society, pay the taxes it demands and, occasionally, fight in its wars.

MrBukani -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 1:23:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic quote: ORIGINAL: MrBukani Dont know if I said this before but we scrapped birthcontrol out of healthcare. There was a bit debate on it but not much. Healthcare is damn expensive, so cuts are gonna be made anywhere they can. Viagra and cialis is covered....and use not for "medical reasons" is 75% of the number of users, I would say birth control is a little bit more advantageous to the world than Viagra..which is mostly a vanity drug I know you wont like it but havin sex is a choice and should we have free condoms as well? I mean with STD's and all. Having sex is a biological imperative for procreation. while a conscious choice to actually take part, our bodies are NATURALLY programmed to enjoy, want and need. They havent come out with anything to reduce sex drive yet....well apart from chemical and moralising means, and Im sure all you guys are as likely to agree to no sex except for procreation as I am. Free is a misnomer, if you pay taxes in either UK Or canada, you are paying for BC and healthcare. Many things arent covered. supplemental insurance is available in Canada , I havent lived in the UK for 20 odd years so I dont know it off hand... If we could afford it, everything in healthcare should be free if it concerns your health directly. Again, NOTHING is free Our dental plan is gettin scrapped to the bone also. People like me will go abroad to Turkey to get their teeth fixed cause they cannot afford dutch dentists. On the other hand how much is dental work directly related to health? Actually , dental care is very important to health, get an abscess or gum disease , , loose a molar, and your whole mouth/ can be one BIG nightmare, AND excruciatingly painful. Look how many people NEED their wisdom teeth removed. however, only emergency coverage is covered by the provincial healthcare. Neither is vision care. and many other things I know it hasnt been covered in the UK for years. The only way to have fair healthcare is to scrap commercial healthcare altogether. No more commercial pharma industry. etc. Stop puttin your parents in nursinghomes. Surgeons can all make a million for all I care, but not 5 million. A fireman will never make a million and he saves lives a lot too. We can still have commercial R&D and we pay for that cost and they can make a hefty profit selling the patent to the state. Then we can go back to havin free birthcontrol. Nursing homes will never be closed..Too many people have neither the money or the skill to give the elderly the care they need. Hospitals cannot keep up with the problems of elderly as it is. I get your points, just offering my thoughts:) Edited for formatting I dont see why viagra should be covered except when somebody has a real medical condition, same goes for the birthcontrol pills. There is an argument when it really directly is concerned. Im not gonna answer for free, cause you know what I mean. Dental can cause health issues of course, the line drawn is the cosmetic part. Glasses(spectacles) were scraped as well over here. I have glasses but dont mind much. Although the poorest of the poor should have perks. Maybe an interesting controversy, transgender operations have always been covered here. What I mean with elderly and nursing homes is this. Its already costing us 25% of all medical costs, this will rise to 50% within 25 years about. If we dont take care of our own parents and change our selfinterest culture, we will pay more then just money. Off course there is always situations where it is not possible. In reality 80% of children just dont want to in western society. I would like to live with my kids when Im old. I would rather have mi mum at home right now. My brothers said no. We had to sell the house to pay for a private home. Thing is my mother is very unhappy to be in a home, me too. My brothers, well, I can only say they deserve, what they have dished out. Its personal, but sometimes things personal give one the best perspective.

Hillwilliam -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 1:30:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA -- NOT SOME ENTITLEMENT PIECE OF SHIT LEFTY-RAT THAT'S GOING TO ONE OF THE MOST PRESTIGIOUS LAW SCHOOLS IN THE COUNTRY THAT WANTS OTHERS TO PAY FOR HER TO FUCK-UP-A-STORM DURING LAW SCHOOL!!! Clear enough for you to "undertand" now?!! [8\|] You might want to actually read the transcript instead of parroting your favorite rightie. Fluke was speaking of a friend who was lesbian and needed BC pills for health problems that were not pregnancy related (she was a lesbian so this much should be obvious). When you don't pay attention, your ignorance shows. ETA your quote regarding someone on these boards who has a similar problem. "If your insurance company was not "covering" your very obvious life-saving meds at all -- i.e., no option for a reduced rate/co-pay, and you were responsible for 100% of the cost -- then that's just fucking wrong!!! You CLEARLY have a serious medical condition that warrants coverage/prescription drug co-pay."

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 1:31:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer The mantra that it's lefties, rather than righties, who 'want everything to be free' has been chanted so much and for so long that people have had their brains pummeled into believing it. Oh?!! And what exactly do the "Righties" want for FREE?!! By all means... DO TELL?!! (Yep, everyone ignore that democRATS, OWS, the Libs/Lefties, and their ilk are the ones whining about FREE healthcare, FREE education, FREE birth control, FREE... FREE... FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE ! ! !) [8\|]

mnottertail -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 1:34:20 PM)
Don't forget FRRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEDOM from oppression.

MrBukani -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 1:36:05 PM)
Wasnt it land of the FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE and home of the brave?[:D]

Hillwilliam -> RE: Maddow takes a look at GOP war on women (3/13/2012 1:36:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MrBukani Wasnt it land of the FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE and home of the brave?[:D] Braveheart was on last night.

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