Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation Page: [1] 2 3 4 5   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 7:16:13 PM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline 		Ideology aside, the important question I believe is not whether the passing of the Affordable Care Act was a good thing or a bad thing, but how it will be implemented or how it should be implemented. Based on what you know, how will it be implemented? Alternatively, how do you feel it should be implemented?
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 7:19:14 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

Ideology aside, the important question I believe is not whether the passing of the Affordable Care Act was a good thing or a bad thing, but how it will be implemented or how it should be implemented. Based on what you know, how will it be implemented? Alternatively, how do you feel it should be implemented?


Well, we're (the pleebs) not going to get a voice in that (implementation), but it's still a good question.

As to whether or not it was good legislation, or will it cost too much....only time will tell.

As to whether or not it was and/or is an improvement over current health care legislation....I can't think of any other answer but "Yes".

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 7:21:56 PM   
erieangel


Posts: 2237
Joined: 6/19/2011
Status: offline 		Not as good as it could have been and needs improvement but great first step toward true universal coverage.

And Universal coverage will happen after all, SCOTUS essentially said today that health care is a right of every American citizen.

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 7:38:56 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline 		To implement the law, states are supposed to expand Medicaid and set up exchanges. I see no problems unless states refuse to cooperate.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 7:48:52 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel

Not as good as it could have been and needs improvement but great first step toward true universal coverage.

And Universal coverage will happen after all, SCOTUS essentially said today that health care is a right of every American citizen.



Actually, they didn't say that.

What they said is....you have a federal mandate to acquire health care.

(That's what they said).

(in reply to erieangel)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 7:55:25 PM   
ddstarr


Posts: 13
Joined: 7/25/2011
Status: offline 		SCOTUS never said healthcare was a right. SCOTUS said the entire plan was nothing but a new tax.
This is yet another major step in solidifying government control over our lives and creating a class of citizens dependent on a government which confiscates wealth from those who are productive and gives it to those who are not.

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 7:58:53 PM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline 		I noticed that the

The ACA 'Tax'
http://www.collarchat.com/m_4154816/tm.htm

presented some information that appears relevant. That thread might be worth consulting.

In other threads some people said something about Medicaid being expanded to offer insurance coverage to those who have no income or are low income. This will effect starving artists for example and those in pursuit of the American dream.

As the American dream is concerned I recall one example in particular. I recall two individuals who started a company. In time they become very successful. They spent all of their money on a booth at a trade fair and had none left over to pay for a hotel room so they spent that night in the park across the street.(1) If you discriminate against no income or low income you will be discriminating against people such as Alexander Graham Bell who have contributed greatly to society. You cannot quantify the value of a person prior to their success. I believe/know that I am such an individual.

If it is a simple matter of having to fill out an affidavit attesting that your income was insufficient to have obligated you to pay taxes and you are covered by Medicaid, then I don't see how there will be much of a problem. If they want my bank account number, I would for example be upset and there are people who would refuse to get so-called affordable medical insurance just because they do not feel that anyone including the government or an insurance company has the right to demand such information. It is called none of your business.

(1) Unfortunately, I've forgotten their names; hence, I cannot provide further details.

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 8:24:15 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline 		Unfortunately, proof of income is usually required to receive most government help. Anything less than that makes it too easy for people to lie. IMO having Medicaid or other subsidized health insurance is worth giving out the info if it keeps people from losing their homes and having their wages garnished over medical bills.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 10:28:08 PM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM
Ideology aside, the important question I believe is not whether the passing of the Affordable Care Act was a good thing or a bad thing, but how it will be implemented or how it should be implemented. Based on what you know, how will it be implemented? Alternatively, how do you feel it should be implemented?


Trying to explain how every state, commonwealth and territory will implement the whole thing is a bit....much...for this medium. I can not really speak for states beyond mine (Commonwealth of Massachusetts). I do know that most states (like MA) have a law set up where by you, the citizen, can contact your direct representative and get information on how the federal law (in use since 2010) has/will be implemented. Even the Republicans are required by law to state the facts and figures to keep citizens informed (that's actually one of their direct job roles from the original 13 colonies).

In Mass, we already have a program set up: Mass Health. It was created by the Democrats and signed into law by then, Governor Mitt Romney (you might reconize that name from somewhere....). The purpose of Mass Health is to make sure all citizens within the state, and holding a residence for greater than two years, can obtain health coverage. Mass Health has three or four 'basic' and 'advance' levels of health coverage depending on one's income and situation. In addition, all employers are required by law to have health coverage for their employees who live in Mass. Those living in other states, but work in Mass, are not eligible for Mass Health. As of current, 98.1% of those residents qualifying for Mass Health or employer requires health coverage are covered right now. It costs the Commonwealth just 1.8% of the state's financial budget (Snow Removal costing much more). As a note, those last two sets of numbers (the 98.1% AND THE 1.8%) do change from month to month; I'm just giving the average figure for the moment.

Most people should really READ THE BILL! But as I said, you may need to contact your district/local representative to find out how your specific state will handle the law. By reading the bill, it will help your letter/phone call/email to your representative by informing them your situation and how the law may or may not help (which I do not claim to know). Hope this helps!

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 10:34:34 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

Ideology aside, the important question I believe is not whether the passing of the Affordable Care Act was a good thing or a bad thing, but how it will be implemented or how it should be implemented. Based on what you know, how will it be implemented? Alternatively, how do you feel it should be implemented?



God damn it I dont remember voting on a referendum.

we the taxpayer, thats how.

thankfully this is a government BY THE PEOPLE OF THE PEOPLE AND FOR THE PEOPLE!


Anyone here really believe that shit?




< Message edited by Real0ne -- 6/28/2012 10:35:16 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 10:38:36 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

Unfortunately, proof of income is usually required to receive most government help. Anything less than that makes it too easy for people to lie. IMO having Medicaid or other subsidized health insurance is worth giving out the info if it keeps people from losing their homes and having their wages garnished over medical bills.



honest banking and monetary policy and go to invoices instead of property taxes would accomplish that, but that is not profitable.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 10:40:58 PM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM
Ideology aside, the important question I believe is not whether the passing of the Affordable Care Act was a good thing or a bad thing, but how it will be implemented or how it should be implemented. Based on what you know, how will it be implemented? Alternatively, how do you feel it should be implemented?

God damn it I dont remember voting on a referendum.

we the taxpayer, thats how.

thankfully this is a government BY THE PEOPLE OF THE PEOPLE AND FOR THE PEOPLE!


Anyone here really believe that shit?


You, DID, read the first two words of BM's post, right? You do know what those two words mean, all joking and kidding aside?

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 10:45:24 PM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

Unfortunately, proof of income is usually required to receive most government help. Anything less than that makes it too easy for people to lie. IMO having Medicaid or other subsidized health insurance is worth giving out the info if it keeps people from losing their homes and having their wages garnished over medical bills.


My intention would be to comply with the law. I would not be asking for help. Such a demand would violate my privacy. Pre-mandate it was voluntary. Post-mandate it won't be. That changes things. Pre-mandate it was a negotiation, a contract. You contract with the government for assistance and the government says that if you want to contract with us for help you have to divulge certain information. Post-mandate it is no longer a negotiation. It is pure naked force, not a negotiation, and like I said there is something called right to privacy. It seems to me that they might try to violate my right to privacy.

Incidentally, right to privacy is the legal justification for abortion. I suppose it is possible they could magically proclaim that forcing information out of you is not a form of forced intercourse.

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 11:18:31 PM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl
Unfortunately, proof of income is usually required to receive most government help. Anything less than that makes it too easy for people to lie. IMO having Medicaid or other subsidized health insurance is worth giving out the info if it keeps people from losing their homes and having their wages garnished over medical bills.

My intention would be to comply with the law. I would not be asking for help. Such a demand would violate my privacy. Pre-mandate it was voluntary. Post-mandate it won't be. That changes things. Pre-mandate it was a negotiation, a contract. You contract with the government for assistance and the government says that if you want to contract with us for help you have to divulge certain information. Post-mandate it is no longer a negotiation. It is pure naked force, not a negotiation, and like I said there is something called right to privacy. It seems to me that they might try to violate my right to privacy.

Incidentally, right to privacy is the legal justification for abortion. I suppose it is possible they could magically proclaim that forcing information out of you is not a form of forced intercourse.


If you go back into the history books (and news clippings) for 1913 and just after that, there were a group of US Citizens that didnt like the passage of the 16th Amendment to the US Consitution. As it turns out, that little bit of taxation with representation helped this nation through the worst economic downturns, fight a bunch of imperialists and facists, paved highways, created one Kick-Ass military, sent space shuttles into outer space, and a whirlwind of other modern day marvels, over come the obsticles of the day. It makes one wonder, if it didnt pass, how different would America be today?

Its just a silly idea that our nation, for all its advancements in a wide range of fields, is still backwards when it comes to something that affects every one of us sooner or later, in small terms or big issues. And there are people, just like in 1913 whom didnt have any facts or evidence, but shouted from the highest building and banged fists on the longest tables in an effort to silence said facts and evidence from being heard. But, just like today, the facts and evidence is heard, and the US Citizens will grow to like the benefits of the bill.

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/28/2012 11:39:40 PM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline 		It seems to me that since the Supreme Court has ruled that the commerce clause is not relevant, it is not a civil matter. If it is not a civil matter, then what is it? It suggests that non-compliance with the mandate would be a criminal matter, but if your intention was to be in compliance, but you refused to divulge your bank account number? I'm not talking about failure to disclose identifying information.

If it is a criminal matter, there is a presumption of innocence. Now that is something that could go over like a lead balloon. Oh, how they will swoon, "That would be too costly!" The request of such information implies a presumption of guilt.

If the implementation of the law makes a presumption of innocence, many of my concerns would be alleviated. Historically, there has been a presumption of guilt which worked as long as it was a contractual matter.

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/29/2012 12:28:55 AM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

... created one Kick-Ass military, ...


Germany had a Kick-Ass military.

I'm not opposed to having medical insurance. I'm opposed to being violated.

As I see it, the devil is going to be in the details. The purpose of the bill will be defeated if people will be fearful to seek medical attention because they don't have insurance. Potentially, they have more to fear than before. Things could go very wrong.

I would go so far as to say as a society we are addicted to fear. Fear is a great motivator, Heil Hitler! Insurance companies in particular know this.

If they get it right, I see little reason to complain. If I'm going to be asked all sort of nosy questions, I have a problem with it. A presumption of guilt is degrading. What right does the government have to degrade citizens in the absence of criminal intent?

It is also likely that the government and/or insurance companies will employ harassment, Why aren't you making enough money to afford medical insurance? Again, we get back to it is called none of your business.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/29/2012 1:14:19 AM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

... But as I said, you may need to contact your district/local representative to find out how your specific state will handle the law. By reading the bill, it will help your letter/phone call/email to your representative by informing them your situation and how the law may or may not help (which I do not claim to know). Hope this helps!


Excellent suggestion and the time to do it. I would go so far to say that input on implementation details is more important than the act of voting. Otherwise, you will have a long road of put up and shut up or law suits that can shorten your life expectancy due to the grief they will cause you.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/29/2012 6:31:49 AM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

Unfortunately, proof of income is usually required to receive most government help. Anything less than that makes it too easy for people to lie. IMO having Medicaid or other subsidized health insurance is worth giving out the info if it keeps people from losing their homes and having their wages garnished over medical bills.


My intention would be to comply with the law. I would not be asking for help. Such a demand would violate my privacy. Pre-mandate it was voluntary. Post-mandate it won't be. That changes things. Pre-mandate it was a negotiation, a contract. You contract with the government for assistance and the government says that if you want to contract with us for help you have to divulge certain information. Post-mandate it is no longer a negotiation. It is pure naked force, not a negotiation, and like I said there is something called right to privacy. It seems to me that they might try to violate my right to privacy.

Incidentally, right to privacy is the legal justification for abortion. I suppose it is possible they could magically proclaim that forcing information out of you is not a form of forced intercourse.


You still have a choice. You can keep your information private and pay the tax penalty. Before you start making rape comparisons, why don't you check out what information your state of AZ would want from you (and talk to rape victims.)







_____________________________

Curious about the "Sluts Vote" avatars? See http://www.collarchat.com/m_4133036/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#4133036

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/29/2012 10:27:02 AM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

You still have a choice. You can keep your information private and pay the tax penalty. ...


This law is becoming increasingly less palatable as the discourse progresses. Do you realize that this sort of thinking was fingered as a cause for the recent global financial crisis? It was shown that this sort of thinking results in a moral decline that is difficult to recover from.

It's pure corporatism! The law of corporations like McDonald's coffee and not people. So that is the legal theory. Juries got angry against the corporations for doing this.

(in reply to kalikshama)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation - 6/29/2012 10:34:37 AM   
BenevolentM


Posts: 3394
Joined: 11/15/2006
Status: offline 		Son of a bitch! It isn't that corporations are people. It is people are corporations.

(in reply to BenevolentM)
Profile   Post #: 20
Page:   [1] 2 3 4 5   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> Affordable Care Act and Its Implementation Page: [1] 2 3 4 5   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094