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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:02:26 AM   
lizi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: masterdebaucher

I personally like the fact that I can mould the sub/slave to my ways. In this relationship, it is important that the sub/slave understand what her master wants and needs. This can only come with spending time with each other over a long period of time and understanding each other without having to say. IMHO having to undo someone else's tainign and redo yours is quite a tedious job.

Cheers


Quite a tedious job to undo training? Really? How long does it take to let your SO know your specifications on making coffee or tea, and BJ's? I can't see much undoing of training in letting her know what you'd like her to wear or how to greet you at the door. People build on a base of knowledge and them sometimes move on. If people had to 'undo' all the training from one job to move on to another, the time spent training for the new job would be double, but that doesn't happen, people just add the new skills on top of the old ones.

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:04:44 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lizi


quote:

ORIGINAL: masterdebaucher

I personally like the fact that I can mould the sub/slave to my ways. In this relationship, it is important that the sub/slave understand what her master wants and needs. This can only come with spending time with each other over a long period of time and understanding each other without having to say. IMHO having to undo someone else's tainign and redo yours is quite a tedious job.

Cheers


Quite a tedious job to undo training? Really? How long does it take to let your SO know your specifications on making coffee or tea, and BJ's? I can't see much undoing of training in letting her know what you'd like her to wear or how to greet you at the door. People build on a base of knowledge and them sometimes move on. If people had to 'undo' all the training from one job to move on to another, the time spent training for the new job would be double, but that doesn't happen, people just add the new skills on top of the old ones.

Not to mention that sometimes those 'old skills' a sub brings to the table can be pretty fucking mind blowing (among other things *eyebrow wiggle*).

As for 'undoing training' Pfffffffffffffffffffft. it takes 15 seconds to tell a new submissive "that's an interesting technique you're using but I prefer it this way".

There, DONE.

< Message edited by Hillwilliam -- 8/29/2012 10:06:07 AM >


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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:10:45 AM   
searching4mysir


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lizi


quote:

ORIGINAL: master bates

I personally like the fact that I can mould the sub/slave to my ways. In this relationship, it is important that the sub/slave understand what her master wants and needs. This can only come with spending time with each other over a long period of time and understanding each other without having to say. IMHO having to undo someone else's tainign and redo yours is quite a tedious job.

Cheers


Quite a tedious job to undo training? Really? How long does it take to let your SO know your specifications on making coffee or tea, and BJ's? I can't see much undoing of training in letting her know what you'd like her to wear or how to greet you at the door. People build on a base of knowledge and them sometimes move on. If people had to 'undo' all the training from one job to move on to another, the time spent training for the new job would be double, but that doesn't happen, people just add the new skills on top of the old ones.



Sounds like laziness, not domliness. I could never submit to someone this lazy.

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:13:03 AM   
MissAsylum


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I see them in the exact same manner as those who will purposely seek out virgins just for the sake of them being virgins.


quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

What do you think when you see a male Dominant that deliberately seeks out the inexperienced female submissives?

I have my view based on what I've seen in the LA community, but I'm curious what all of you think.





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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:13:24 AM   
myotherself


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I have talked to more than a few guys who specifically targetted noobs. Over and over again I heard them go on about 'undoing' someone else's 'training'.

I really don't get that. We humans are adaptable creatures - that's a big part of the reason we're still around after all these years, and doing so well.

I have never been trained. I've entered several relationships - some vanilla, some D/s - and got to know several guys extremely well. I watched how they did things, noticed how they liked things, and then did it myself. It's part of my submissive nature, I guess. I never had any problem adapting quickly from one guy to another.

Unless a dominant picks someone as dumb as a doorknob there should be zero problem with them doing things his way without any real prompting. All this talk about undoing previous training smells like so much horse hockey to me.

The only problem arises when the sub has enough experience to spot when the dominant is 'embellishing' his level of experience and expertise. I suspect this is why some guys prefer the noobs.

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:14:55 AM   
DNAHelicase


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: culareD



Sooo, does anyone have any thoughts on what a Dom such as is being discussed would look like?

I can't tell you what they look like. Heck, they look just like anyone else.

I can tell you what they act like tho.
They move quickly. It's almost like when you toss a worm off the dock and the bluegills race to see who can eat it first.
If you go to your first munch and someone comes over and immediately starts acting in a posessive manner, RUN. It's a Noobhunter.
Note, this is different behavior from the guy (or gal) who leads you around and introduces you to everyone if he senses a 'wallflower'.
The former person will try to isolate you from others to make him the best possibility you've met (because you havent met anyone else).
Early overt posessiveness is your key.
Beware the guy who talks to you for 5 minutes and then acts jealous if you talk to someone else.

BDSM relationships are like nilla relationships. The best ones begin as a friendship and gradually grow to something more intimate.
If someone contacts you and in their first email, they assume some kind of ownership of you, laugh your ass off and then ignore them.


This is just one type of newbie predator. We have a man in our community who uses the non-threatening, non-possessive friend approach instead. His MO is to send out literally dozens of messages per day. One of his former "subs" (read: fuck buddy he occasionally spanked) let him use her laptop to logon to his account on another website. He forgot to log off. She found pages and pages of messages he initiated to every new profile with an "F" and numbers lower than 46. By his own admission, he spends almost all his time either combing through profiles to find new female profiles on that other fetish website or chatting with women on yahoo and other messengers. He tells these women that he just wants to be friends with them, that he just wants to answer their questions and help introduce them to the lifestyle safely (funny that he only wants to help women, eh?). He even does this with new young women who list themselves as dominants, hoping that they might be new and unsure enough to do something with him. After chatting with women for a while in a seemingly friendly way, he starts turning it more and more towards play. He tells them he just wants to teach them. He claims to be mentoring or teaching every woman he fucks, though he honestly doesn't even know how to use a flogger or what the word protocol means and when, at a play party, somebody mentioned service submission, he had no idea what that was. He also trash talks other men in the community if any of these young women ask him about them after they've been chatting, telling them that other doms are unsafe, or inept, or whatever insult he chooses that day to try to convince newbies that he is the only good dominant in our area. If he convinces a woman to play with him after days, weeks, or months of chatting her up in a non-threatening manner, he makes it all about sex. If the woman asks him to try other things, he hedges or ignores her outright. If she wants to play with other people to experience new things, he tells her how horrible and unsafe that man is and how he just wants to make sure she'll be safe. Women are toys to him, and he knows anybody with *any* experience will see straight through his bullshit and ineptitude in almost all realms of BDSM. That's why he goes for newbies, and lots of them. His conquests tend to be short lived, as he never stops chatting up the newbies and the ones who have been with him for a while eventually start feeling used, jealous of the constant stream of new starry-eyed women, and frustrated at the lack of variety in play. This is the report from more than half a dozen women in the last year alone.

There are many patterns that predators may use. Some of the things you'll see in most types, but keep in mind each one may be different:
*Sticks to newbies exclusively
*Has many, many partners and little or no time in between new partners
*May try to keep many of his partners quiet, telling them not to announce that they're together or not wanting to interact at BDSM events
*Usually tells lots of little white lies or dodges questions
*Claims to be teaching or mentoring every woman he fucks, despite a lack of knowledge in many areas of BDSM or any specialized skills
*Has been doing this for a long while
*Bases his ideas about BDSM heavily or exclusively around sex
*Many of his partners wind up abruptly leaving the scene for good or taking a long break when the relationship with him ends, because they feel used, victimized, etc. (Yes, I know relationships can end badly when they're legitimate--but if it's something that happens every three months with the same person involved over and over, it should raise a red flag.)
*Very welcoming and friendly to female newbies, but mostly ignores male newbies
*Very persistent in pursuing many women all the time, even if it isn't done in a threatening way
*Usually presents himself as a nice, helpful guy, especially to women and newbies (this one is nothing to be concerned about by itself, but along with several of the other warning signs should be viewed suspiciously)

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:19:51 AM   
OsideGirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: myotherself

Unless a dominant picks someone as dumb as a doorknob there should be zero problem with them doing things his way without any real prompting. All this talk about undoing previous training smells like so much horse hockey to me.


Yeah, I agree. It smells fishy to me as well.


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The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:24:26 AM   
DNAHelicase


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And one more thought: it's less common, but there are women and submissives of all genders who are predators, too. My list applies to the typical male dom predator. I don't know how well it would translate to female or submissive predators.

(in reply to DNAHelicase)
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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:24:51 AM   
pyschosubmission


Posts: 1109
Joined: 7/6/2012
From: Glasgow, Scotland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: myotherself

Unless a dominant picks someone as dumb as a doorknob there should be zero problem with them doing things his way without any real prompting. All this talk about undoing previous training smells like so much horse hockey to me.


Yeah, I agree. It smells fishy to me as well.



Seconded, in fact this sprang to mind

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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:25:33 AM   
Asfixation


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quote:

What do you think when you see a male Dominant that deliberately seeks out the inexperienced female submissives?


My first answer without thinking this through would be ~predatory~.....BUT
all experience is relative and it very much depends on what one defines as experience. One can gain a great deal of experience from an intense scene and a great deal of repetitive play from many more. And then again some experiences really are lost to direct recall until triggered or recreated in a scene when one realises there is prior experience to fall back on.
That said I tink the concept of a 'virgin' sub feels like potential for a power over rather than a power swop. Maybe it's just me but I prefer some background, some meaty experience, some common ground.

(in reply to OsideGirl)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:27:28 AM   
OsideGirl


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I liked that!

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Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:29:59 AM   
culareD


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Once again...great thread...good pearls of wisdom.

When do you think writing assignments, if any, from a Dom to a sub begin?

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:36:08 AM   
JeffBC


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
As for 'undoing training' Pfffffffffffffffffffft. it takes 15 seconds to tell a new submissive "that's an interesting technique you're using but I prefer it this way".

Well sure but how vanilla of you. In a true BDSM relationship there'd need to be endless barking of commands followed by whippings.

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(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:38:17 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DNAHelicase

And one more thought: it's less common, but there are women and submissives of all genders who are predators, too. My list applies to the typical male dom predator. I don't know how well it would translate to female or submissive predators.

It's off topic but DNA, I've seen your name lurking for a while. It's good to see you join in the posting.

You're correct, predators come in all shapes, sizes, inclinations and genders.
It's impossible to cover it all in one post or even a short thread but I bet the OP is getting the idea.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:41:03 AM   
Hillwilliam


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Joined: 8/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: culareD

Once again...great thread...good pearls of wisdom.

When do you think writing assignments, if any, from a Dom to a sub begin?

It depends on the Dom and sub. I've never assigned one.

Remember culare. There is no ONE TWUE WAY. It's whatever works for a particular couple or household.

Maybe I should tell you to write 100 times

"There is no ONE TWUE WAY"

< Message edited by Hillwilliam -- 8/29/2012 10:43:39 AM >


_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to culareD)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:42:55 AM   
OsideGirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: culareD

Once again...great thread...good pearls of wisdom.

When do you think writing assignments, if any, from a Dom to a sub begin?


Pretty much never from my point of view. I don't engage in make busy work, my time is precious and I have no interest in someone that doesn't respect my time.

The only thing I think has some merit is journaling, but if you know someone else is going to read it, you tend to not write what you would write if you knew no one would read it. It then loses it's effectiveness.


_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:46:38 AM   
DNAHelicase


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

It's off topic but DNA, I've seen your name lurking for a while. It's good to see you join in the posting.



Thanks. And yes, I have been lurking for a while now, but usually I have nothing more to add to a thread that hasn't already been said more eloquently than I could have put it, so I just kept on lurking.

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:46:38 AM   
kiwisub12


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lol - and the sub would be very slow to understand and remember what the dom was barking....

I'm another one who thinks that "having to retrain" a sub is code for talks bdsm crap but doesn't necessarily walk the walk. It sounds good on the 'puter, but in real life is a very short process.

My first dom had years of experience, and my "training" consisted of "these are the rules", and that was that. Of course, my IQ is higher than a walnut , so perhaps i was exceptional!

My sweetie pretty much told me all i needed to know for him in a few sentences - yep- it was hard to retrain me......

My first dom would talk to newbies online and take them with us to munches and parties. He wanted them to get a feel for the atmosphere, and have someone to sit with who wasn't going to prey on them. In the five years i lived with him, there were probably five or six newbies he talked to and invited to parties and real life gatherings, and i still talk to a couple. It was a nonthreatening way of joining in - and although he would occasionally play with some of them, there was no sex involved or trying to seperate them from the crowd.

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RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 10:51:26 AM   
OsideGirl


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Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12



I'm another one who thinks that "having to retrain" a sub is code for talks bdsm crap but doesn't necessarily walk the walk. It sounds good on the 'puter, but in real life is a very short process.


People will follow a strong leader. If you can't get an experienced submissive to follow you in the manner in which you desire, the problem isn't the submissive.....


_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to kiwisub12)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Dominants that seek out the inexperienced - 8/29/2012 11:02:04 AM   
myotherself


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From: The cold bit of the UK
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

In a true BDSM relationship there'd need to be endless......whippings.



WOOHOOO!!!


quote edited to give maximum fappage

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