An understanding of political lies.

An understanding of political lies. (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 5:39:40 PM)
quote: Shall we compare apples to apples and only use the first 4 years of Bush, or how about we use the second 4 years, when the Dems had control of both houses of congress? I pulled this from another thread. If the poster wishes to claim credit, then he/she can do so. I have seen, often, how Obama had "control" of both houses for 2 years. I have also seen claims that he had a fillibuster proof control of the Senate. I say you are wrong. Anyone want to prove he did have that kind of control?

epiphiny43 -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 5:48:26 PM)
The struggles over 'single payer option' and Obama's eventual defeat on the item is hard to interpret as control of anything but his temper. The Democratic 'Majority' of either house has been a label of convenience with the Blue Dogs in particular being Republicans in all but name. Which some now are? In the long run, the biggest damage to the nation of Democratic legislative incompetence may be their failure to establish real party loyalty and voting discipline on vital issues. Which pales in comparison to the flat lies of agenda and aims of the corporate led 'family values' party's wounds to the body politic and community.

GreyStroke -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 5:50:19 PM)
Actually by registration ... the Dems had a majority in the house and senate ... voted in by the disgust of the previous administration and the appeal of a young politician. But ... as Will Rogers said: I don't belong to any organized political party ... I'm a democrat. The Rs were able to pull off Ds from voting a straight party line by various ways ... He's had a good four years with the an intractable minority party fighting him on EVERY issue. Romney offers nothing but Bush II's neo-con chicken hawks. I can find no fault in BHOs performance in the past 4 years. I do think the Rs are headed to oblivion if they truly offer their platform as one a reasonable person could accept. It's nuts.

LookieNoNookie -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 5:54:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Shall we compare apples to apples and only use the first 4 years of Bush, or how about we use the second 4 years, when the Dems had control of both houses of congress? I pulled this from another thread. If the poster wishes to claim credit, then he/she can do so. I have seen, often, how Obama had "control" of both houses for 2 years. I have also seen claims that he had a fillibuster proof control of the Senate. I say you are wrong. Anyone want to prove he did have that kind of control? There's no need to. He's the Head CEO. A President can either take responsibility for his term or he (won't). Why does it matter who had control? He's the Prez. He's the gawdamned CEO of America, Inc. I can claim all kinds of shit to the bank; "economy's been rough"...."my Dad died and I had to spend 20 months drinking from a fire hose, dealing with his Estate"...."I can't find good help"....."people aren't buying".... Guess what? The economy has been rough for everyone. Other CEO's Father's died during the same time. You make good people...they don't just land in your lap. People always buy from someone....it's your (CEO's) job to guide them to buy from you. It's that simple. The man is running the largest corporation on Earth. It's HIS JOB. Accept the responsibility or bow out....it's fairly simple math.

DaNewAgeViking -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 5:57:56 PM)
There is an old adage that 'He who can destroy something controls it'. The Radicals were and still are a minority in the Senate, but if you look back over the last three-some years you will see that they filibustered everything. They didn't have the numbers, but due to an obtuse Parliamentary rule - cloture - they kept the Senate from functioning. It will remain like this for as long as the cloture rule is set at 60. Reduce it to 51 where it belongs, and things will start happening again. [sm=passthelube.gif][sm=soapbox.gif]

tazzygirl -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 5:59:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Shall we compare apples to apples and only use the first 4 years of Bush, or how about we use the second 4 years, when the Dems had control of both houses of congress? I pulled this from another thread. If the poster wishes to claim credit, then he/she can do so. I have seen, often, how Obama had "control" of both houses for 2 years. I have also seen claims that he had a fillibuster proof control of the Senate. I say you are wrong. Anyone want to prove he did have that kind of control? There's no need to. A president can either take responsibility for his term or he (won't). Why does it matter who had control? He's the Prez. Is that not one of the things the conservatives point out repeatedly? How he failed even with a fillibuster proof Senate?

Baroana -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 6:01:14 PM)
Shall we start listing all the things that the W. Bush administration did wrong while at the same time listing all the things that the Obama administration did wrong?

MrRodgers -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 6:03:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GreyStroke Actually by registration ... the Dems had a majority in the house and senate ... voted in by the disgust of the previous administration and the appeal of a young politician. But ... as Will Rogers said: I don't belong to any organized political party ... I'm a democrat. The Rs were able to pull off Ds from voting a straight party line by various ways ... He's had a good four years with the an intractable minority party fighting him on EVERY issue. Romney offers nothing but Bush II's neo-con chicken hawks. I can find no fault in BHOs performance in the past 4 years. I do think the Rs are headed to oblivion if they truly offer their platform as one a reasonable person could accept. It's nuts. Yes, 06-08 the dems had a house majority 49 in the senate with two independants often but not always caucusing with the dems. The dems did not have both houses until then. Still on the important matters and after the first time in history, a president (Bush) with no vetoes in those first 6 years...vetoed 13 dem bills in those last 2. The revision of history rather than learning from it...is part and parcel of right wing plan now and works rather good when even a very large partisan minority of the American polity believes the lies...they being repeated enough to make far too many actually believe them.

tazzygirl -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 6:04:31 PM)
I did not ask what either did right or wrong. You are free to start your own thread about that.

DaNewAgeViking -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 6:10:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie A president can either take responsibility for his term or he (won't). Why does it matter who had control? He's the Prez. Do you really want to live in a society where the President can dictate public policy? We had that under Douche - do you seriously propose we do it again? Our system of government is a bad joke concocted by people (the Founding Fathers) who had no real idea what they were doing, were venturing off into an uncharted La-La Land of 'government by the consent of the governed', and who were faced with the eminent collapse of the temporary system put forth during the Revolution. It's no surprise it works so poorly since it was deliberately designed not to work at all, but it's all we have. We need something better, but until that something can be put together, let's not meddle with what we have. Obama is doing the best he can with a system dominated and skillfully manipulated by traitors and fanatics. [sm=ballchain.gif]

LookieNoNookie -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 6:20:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Shall we compare apples to apples and only use the first 4 years of Bush, or how about we use the second 4 years, when the Dems had control of both houses of congress? I pulled this from another thread. If the poster wishes to claim credit, then he/she can do so. I have seen, often, how Obama had "control" of both houses for 2 years. I have also seen claims that he had a fillibuster proof control of the Senate. I say you are wrong. Anyone want to prove he did have that kind of control? There's no need to. A president can either take responsibility for his term or he (won't). Why does it matter who had control? He's the Prez. Is that not one of the things the conservatives point out repeatedly? How he failed even with a fillibuster proof Senate? Can't help you on that one but I, as the head of our multiple organizations, take full responsibility (and always will) when we fail, because whether I didn't lead well, didn't come up with inventive ideas, didn't guide my people to do all the above....it's my fault...and I hand out accolades to everyone who contributed when we win. Failure is ALWAYS the CEO's responsibility. (It ain't as cushy a job as one might surmise). Them ain't platitudes....it's governance fact. As a CEO, my job....his job...is to lead AND produce results that equal or exceed those we were anticipating or could realistically expect...as shareholders of America Inc. Our firms grew our sales across all product lines (to date), in excess of 43% in 2012. (And I don't sell software or tech...so...it can be done). He didn't get the job done. And I can't argue the point: Running America Incorporated is a smidge tougher than MY job. But he asked for the job, which gives me the right to question his acumen. Don't know if Romney is the logical replacement but....the other guy (Obama)....didn't do it. He flat out didn't, hasn't and can't.

tazzygirl -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 6:30:39 PM)
Umm.. what does that have to do with the question asked?

BamaD -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 6:46:16 PM)
Is Bush running?

LookieNoNookie -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 7:08:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Umm.. what does that have to do with the question asked? Fairly elementary I should imagine. You asked: "Is that not one of the things the conservatives point out repeatedly? How he failed even with a fillibuster proof Senate? " Essentially....that it wasn't his fault, he was swimming upstream. So are you. So am I. Your bank doesn't care why you can't make the mortgage payment...only that you do. He didn't. He needs to go away. Fairly simple. That's why they replace CEO's every day. As the head CEO, he has failed. Time to go work for Chic-Fila.

slvemike4u -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 7:13:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Shall we compare apples to apples and only use the first 4 years of Bush, or how about we use the second 4 years, when the Dems had control of both houses of congress? I pulled this from another thread. If the poster wishes to claim credit, then he/she can do so. I have seen, often, how Obama had "control" of both houses for 2 years. I have also seen claims that he had a fillibuster proof control of the Senate. I say you are wrong. Anyone want to prove he did have that kind of control? This should be interesting [:)]

tazzygirl -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 7:19:12 PM)
LOL... notice how many are avoiding it?

vincentML -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 7:19:54 PM)
quote: Failure is ALWAYS the CEO's responsibility. (It ain't as cushy a job as one might surmise). A false comparison. The President is not a CEO. The Executive is one of three coequal branches of US government. I'll bet you learned that somewhere. So, bullshit.

slvemike4u -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 7:20:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Shall we compare apples to apples and only use the first 4 years of Bush, or how about we use the second 4 years, when the Dems had control of both houses of congress? I pulled this from another thread. If the poster wishes to claim credit, then he/she can do so. I have seen, often, how Obama had "control" of both houses for 2 years. I have also seen claims that he had a fillibuster proof control of the Senate. I say you are wrong. Anyone want to prove he did have that kind of control? There's no need to. He's the Head CEO. A President can either take responsibility for his term or he (won't). Why does it matter who had control? He's the Prez. He's the gawdamned CEO of America, Inc. I can claim all kinds of shit to the bank; "economy's been rough"...."my Dad died and I had to spend 20 months drinking from a fire hose, dealing with his Estate"...."I can't find good help"....."people aren't buying".... Guess what? The economy has been rough for everyone. Other CEO's Father's died during the same time. You make good people...they don't just land in your lap. People always buy from someone....it's your (CEO's) job to guide them to buy from you. It's that simple. The man is running the largest corporation on Earth. It's HIS JOB. Accept the responsibility or bow out....it's fairly simple math. Do you have any idea at all about how our government functions ? I ask because a reading of this post would indicate that you are confused on a number of points.

slvemike4u -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 7:23:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl LOL... notice how many are avoiding it? Only one poster,so far addressed it.....not sure any of the others actually see the question.

Baroana -> RE: An understanding of political lies. (9/2/2012 7:25:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Shall we compare apples to apples and only use the first 4 years of Bush, or how about we use the second 4 years, when the Dems had control of both houses of congress? I pulled this from another thread. If the poster wishes to claim credit, then he/she can do so. I have seen, often, how Obama had "control" of both houses for 2 years. I have also seen claims that he had a fillibuster proof control of the Senate. I say you are wrong. Anyone want to prove he did have that kind of control? There's no need to. A president can either take responsibility for his term or he (won't). Why does it matter who had control? He's the Prez. Is that not one of the things the conservatives point out repeatedly? How he failed even with a fillibuster proof Senate? Can't help you on that one but I, as the head of our multiple organizations, take full responsibility (and always will) when we fail, because whether I didn't lead well, didn't come up with inventive ideas, didn't guide my people to do all the above....it's my fault...and I hand out accolades to everyone who contributed when we win. Failure is ALWAYS the CEO's responsibility. (It ain't as cushy a job as one might surmise). Them ain't platitudes....it's governance fact. As a CEO, my job....his job...is to lead AND produce results that equal or exceed those we were anticipating or could realistically expect...as shareholders of America Inc. Our firms grew our sales across all product lines (to date), in excess of 43% in 2012. (And I don't sell software or tech...so...it can be done). He didn't get the job done. And I can't argue the point: Running America Incorporated is a smidge tougher than MY job. But he asked for the job, which gives me the right to question his acumen. Don't know if Romney is the logical replacement but....the other guy (Obama)....didn't do it. He flat out didn't, hasn't and can't. Good. So, you must be conceding that George W. Bush's performance as President was abysmal beyond words. We had 9/11, which he failed to prevent. He also failed to catch Osama Bin Laden and bring him to justice. We had Hurricanes Katrina and Rita, the damage from which he failed to repair. We had invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan that went poorly and were initiated based on unreliable information. We had an awful recession, disasters in the banking industry, disasters in the auto industry..... and these are just his biggest fuckups.

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