RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 12:53:20 PM

Nosathro

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Nope.... a black kid with black hair... compared to khaki pants? Thats his head.. not his ass at the bottom of that picture

Also remember Martin was wear a black hoodie..so can the photo really be him?

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 12:54:19 PM

tazzygirl

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Rounded shoulders... hands under his body.. would account for the dark area before the light hit beyond the body.

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 12:56:27 PM

tazzygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Nope.... a black kid with black hair... compared to khaki pants? Thats his head.. not his ass at the bottom of that picture

Also remember Martin was wear a black hoodie..so can the photo really be him?

Thought it was grey

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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:02:56 PM

Raiikun

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Rounded shoulders... hands under his body.. would account for the dark area before the light hit beyond the body.

So would his arm being out to the side as reported by W6 before Ayala got there.

Disclaimer: This is one of the few times I'm making an assertion I'm not 100% of, because at first I did see it the other way (and have seen 2 or 3 other conclusions which IMO are even lower on the probability scale.)

What pushed me toward my (at present) final conclusion was a few things. You can use the house in the distance for a sense of perspective; the angle that the photo was taken at. And my original "head on bottom" interpretation looks more like the photo would have been taken more directly above the body instead of at an angle; inconsistent with the background of the photo, where the arm out to the side interpetation matches the perspective better.

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:04:09 PM

Raiikun

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Nope.... a black kid with black hair... compared to khaki pants? Thats his head.. not his ass at the bottom of that picture

Also remember Martin was wear a black hoodie..so can the photo really be him?

Thought it was grey

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:04:31 PM

Nosathro

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

Does he say it was Zimmerman yelling...Nope.

My reference was that he said the screams were those of pain. Only one of those two were taking injuries concurrently with the screaming; Trayvon had no injuries except the gunshot and a small abrasion on one hand.

quote:

However independent analysts say it was Martin yelling for help..but you don't believe that.

One analyst came back and wrote later that the exemplars were of too poor of quality to make a comparison, and then offered to help the Defense make new ones.

The other analyst just listened by ear and said he thinks it was a young guy screaming. (I wonder if he was aware that Zimmerman has a higher pitched voice than Martin.)

Funny when Owen talked about his anaylist you didn't believe it.....remember, of course not

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/04/01/voice-heard-screaming-on-11-tape-is-not-trayvon-martin-shooter-george-zimmerman/

http://dailycaller.com/2012/04/06/voice-forensics-experts-cast-doubt-on-orlando-sentinel-analysis-of-trayvon-martin-911-tape/

< Message edited by Nosathro -- 10/4/2012 1:05:52 PM >

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:08:59 PM

Rule

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
If I am beating your head, your hands are in a defensive position. And, cause of what I am doing you aren't moving them downward cause if you did....then it would be curtains.

So either its bullshit or he wasn't on top of him or he wasn't being hit much which means his life wasn't being threatened.

Those are good arguments.

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:09:16 PM

Nosathro

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

His head is at the bottom of that photo.

That's what I thought at first too until I started enhancing and the arm seemed to come more visible.

Proof positive Raiikun by his own admission is tampering with the evidence.....

Nope, that's not how it works. The actual photo is quite safe.

Really the oppsite end where you say the hoodie is almost cirular..or the that Martin butt? You claim to be a lawyer now forensic expert...wow......

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:11:07 PM

tazzygirl

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quote:

So would his arm being out to the side as reported by W6 before Ayala got there.

People under stress dont always see things the way they really are. You are assuming that only witness 6 was correct. The Officer who started CPR said his hands were under the body. Im curious as to who would have known better?

quote:

What pushed me toward my (at present) final conclusion was a few things. You can use the house in the distance for a sense of perspective; the angle that the photo was taken at. And my original "head on bottom" interpretation looks more like the photo would have been taken more directly above the body instead of at an angle; inconsistent with the background of the photo, where the arm out to the side interpetation matches the perspective better.

The photo was not taken by a photographer.. or even an investigator.. but by a bystander on a cell phone. The house in the background is not a clear point of reference... but the light from the house or porch does show it on a rise... so without seeing the layout in the daylight, it seems the house is above the body,

The pants are indeed khaki which would photograph much lighter than his head. Thats definitely his head at the bottom of that photo.

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:16:09 PM

Raiikun

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

Funny when Owen talked about his anaylist you didn't believe it.....remember, of course not

You really should stop just inventing what I remember or don't remember. You've not gotten it right yet.

I had specific complaints against Owen's analysis back then, which still hold true. And even Owen made a statement since then that agreed with me (better exemplars were needed for a comparison compared to what Owen did back then).

The other audio expert mentioned didn't even do a forensic comparison; he just listened by ear and said he thought it was a young man screaming. He admitted that "As an audio forensic expert I want to make clear that this is not formal voice identification and not meant for legal purposes." and that he would need an exemplar from George screaming to compare with.

< Message edited by Raiikun -- 10/4/2012 1:17:04 PM >

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:23:25 PM

kdsub

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How about the below....you can make anything you want out of this.

Butch

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:25:46 PM

Raiikun

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

You are assuming that only witness 6 was correct.

Actually I'm making no such assumption. My stance is that

1) Ayala's testimony as to what he saw has factual errors.

He said "I then noticed that there was, what appeared to be a black male wearing a grey sweater, blue jeans, and white/red sneakers laying face down on the
ground, That black male had his hands underneath his body." Trayvon was neither wearing blue jeans, or red/white sneakers.

2) There is a witness with a differing and more specific account compared to Ayala's summary.

3) W6's account is (so far) the earliest description of Trayvon's body after the shooting. With experts having since said that Trayvon was likely alive for a time after the shot, and able to speak for part of it; there's not even reason to assume that they aren't BOTH correct as to the position of his hands.

quote:

The pants are indeed khaki which would photograph much lighter than his head. Thats definitely his head at the bottom of that photo.

They should also photograph lighter than his sweater by that logic.

< Message edited by Raiikun -- 10/4/2012 1:27:19 PM >

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:28:35 PM

tazzygirl

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Then you really must explain to me what that round, black sphere at the bottom of that photo is, if its not his head

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Post #: 553

RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:30:38 PM

Raiikun

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And in more recent news, O'Mara has confirmed that they're looking to sue NBC.

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Post #: 554

RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:32:12 PM

tazzygirl

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I have no doubt he will be suing everyone before its all over with.

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Post #: 555

RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:36:15 PM

tazzygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

And in more recent news, O'Mara has confirmed that they're looking to sue NBC.

Pst... round black sphere.. bottom of photo.. what is it?

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Post #: 556

RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:36:46 PM

Rule

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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle
you'd have to believe that Trayvon Martin attacked George Zimmerman without provocation, which of course is laughable.

No, it is not. Besides, even with provocation the sensible thing to do is to ignore it and to walk away.

There is no doubt whatsoever in my mind that Martin attacked Zimmerman and that Zimmerman was justified in shooting him.

I was not there and I do not know what exactly occurred. But I do know that it is perfectly possible when being pinned that way to the ground to defend with one arm and to have the other arm free - but I do not know if that is what happened.

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:41:45 PM

Raiikun

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

And in more recent news, O'Mara has confirmed that they're looking to sue NBC.

Pst... round black sphere.. bottom of photo.. what is it?

I don't see enough to call it a sphere. There's a rounded edge...then artifacts like there is all over the photo.

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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:43:38 PM

tazzygirl

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Its clearer than what you are claiming is an arm.

For your supposition to be correct, that would have to be his ass.

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Post #: 559

RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/4/2012 1:44:16 PM

Nosathro

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You know a few things come to mind...if Martin body was the way witness 6 claims, remember he has changed is story. And the body was like the Officer say it was when he saw it, then someone must of tampered with it...now who could have done that? I know Raiikun would have, givern Martin body a good kick just to make sure....but he wasn't there....Zimmerman..now why would he do a thing like, tamper with evidence?

So far as I know nothing been filed. But already many are saying it a bad idea also hard to prove. The rules of evidence are not as strict as in a criminal trail, and Zimmerman would have to take the stand, swear the oath, that makes what ever he says public as well as anything admited into evidence. If it happens before the criminal trial, the State would have more ammo, but then again they have I lost count on the conflicting Zimmerman statements, the interview with Fox (O'Mara admit it was wrong, but blame the news man, Osterman book, etc. I know, I know Raiikun you think the State doesn't have Jack....of course that what you think.....

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