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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:14:48 AM   
mnottertail


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Fate has not been as kind to you, I fear.

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:19:25 AM   
flyhumbleguy


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I welcome my fate gladly with eyes wide open even if it is a knife to the throat. If you're so fearful, then you're a pansy just puffing out his chest to pretend otherwise. Thanks for the performance art.

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:20:21 AM   
Lucylastic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Fate has not been as kind to you, I fear.

Keyboard commando stench is strong this weekend!!!

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:21:55 AM   
Toysinbabeland


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quote:



Clinton was a genuine pragmatist. He came into office with an initial two years of leeway to push a liberal agenda that included universal healthcare with Hillary heading that up. Then he got swept up with a conservative Republican House and its Contract with America business. Instead of sticking with his agenda, Clinton shifted gears to work with Congress and ended up accomplishing several things through compromise. Instead of working with a new Congress, Obama has dug in his heals and turned to more pronounced demagoguery that pits one social strata against another, gender against gender, and race/ethnicity against race/ethnicity. Obama is far from being a pragmatist by almost any standard though he might have instances of showing pragmatism periodically









I don't get it...you can spell demagoguery, but not heels?

How brobdingnagian.


< Message edited by Toysinbabeland -- 11/3/2012 7:26:21 AM >


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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:22:50 AM   
mnottertail


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Your hyperbole is sub-par.   You may rattle your keyboard in your trifling way, but I will point out to you that Russias communism (leninism actually, not communism) driving socialists (who didnt go to Hitler)  to Hitler (who were not socialist, but facist like the republicans nowadays) is about as causal as a butterfly dying in the azores driving us into Iraq. If you practice thinking inside the box on this one, since there is a very robust bit of history on this out there available, you might actually glean a fact or two and understand the causality.  It ain't what you got.  

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 11/3/2012 7:28:47 AM >


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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:33:06 AM   
flyhumbleguy


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Were you in high school drama club and have been frustrated for lack of acting opportunities ever since? Don't you have a Yoda action figure nearby that is feeling neglected since perhaps an hour has passed since you last played with it?

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:38:25 AM   
mnottertail


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An invisible box of fuck's, I don't give, young streetwalker. 

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 11/3/2012 7:40:02 AM >


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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 7:43:06 AM   
Edwynn


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Just bitterness he carries from not being accepted into his Jr. High School's Junior Varsity Debate Team, that's all.

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 8:30:51 AM   
DarkSteven


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quote:

ORIGINAL: flyhumbleguy

Clinton was a genuine pragmatist. He came into office with an initial two years of leeway to push a liberal agenda that included universal healthcare with Hillary heading that up. Then he got swept up with a conservative Republican House and its Contract with America business. Instead of sticking with his agenda, Clinton shifted gears to work with Congress and ended up accomplishing several things through compromise. Instead of working with a new Congress, Obama has dug in his heals and turned to more pronounced demagoguery that pits one social strata against another, gender against gender, and race/ethnicity against race/ethnicity. Obama is far from being a pragmatist by almost any standard though he might have instances of showing pragmatism periodically.


I agree with the first part. However, Clinton's GOP Congress was more tractable than Obama's GOP Congress - you seem to equate the two. The current GOP Congress has Tea Partiers who consider compromise to be defeat, and have pledged to gum up the works just because.



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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 9:09:57 AM   
VideoAdminGamma


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Fast reply

Please refrain from the comments about each other and try to stick to the subject. If focus cannot be maintained I have adderal in Gold Mail form ;).

Thanks for being a part of CollarMe,
Gamma

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 9:32:51 AM   
flyhumbleguy


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I don't know how tractability gets scientifically measured, but I remember the 1994 Congress thinking that it had a mandate and having a strong dislike for Clinton that played out with Whitewater investigations and impeachment hearings. Things weren't necessarily cordial on all fronts. Yet there was political willingness to compromise. Also unlike Clinton who always took any moment he could to rub elbows with celebrities, Obama seems to steer clear of them even Oprah...unless it is election time and he desperately needs them on the campaign trail. Obama just comes across as much more agenda-hewn in many regards and thus more ideological. Reasonable minds can differ certainly.

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 9:44:05 AM   
slvemike4u


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It is not possible to be "more ideological" than the tea baggers.
To suggest otherwise is to announce one's own ideological blinders....and makes anything that follows nothing more substantive than white noise(ie:static)
On that point reasonable minds certainly can not differ

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 10:12:19 AM   
flyhumbleguy


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You can get into a battle of who is more ideological than the other or whether one Congress is more tractable than another, but to do so is all based on conjecture and data that isn't particularly scientific or in any way universally accepted, time-tested, what have you. To be fair, you have to ask yourself if the tea party ideology was a reaction to other ideology whether it is embodied in another organized movement or just masses of people developing into a cult following of a particular leader.

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 10:53:10 AM   
Edwynn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: flyhumbleguy

I don't know how tractability gets scientifically measured, but I remember the 1994 Congress thinking that it had a mandate and having a strong dislike for Clinton that played out with Whitewater investigations and impeachment hearings. Things weren't necessarily cordial on all fronts. Yet there was political willingness to compromise. Also unlike Clinton who always took any moment he could to rub elbows with celebrities, Obama seems to steer clear of them even Oprah...unless it is election time and he desperately needs them on the campaign trail. Obama just comes across as much more agenda-hewn in many regards and thus more ideological. Reasonable minds can differ certainly.



Oh, but that Clinton, even Obama, would have been or were to be more ideological in that sense, even as much as I despise ideology (the new Religions) of any sort.

Do you consider it a boon to our economy or to our society that Clinton got bullied by Gingrich into signing the Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Act (PRWORA), which replaced the Job Opportunities and Basic Skills Training (JOBS) program?

The latter (JOBS) program required that welfare recipients either find a job or go to school to get training so as to be better able to find a decent paying job, so as to improve job skills of the nation, by however small a margin, and increase GDP in any event. Gingrich's new plan, which you seem to admire Clinton for signing onto, said, in effect, "screw the education part, you are all cut off from school, just find a job now, because we are short of Molly Maids."

Again, do you think this as an improvement to our economy or to our society, thank goodness for the needed compromise to accomplish it?

Clinton signed the legislation introduced and sponsored by Republicans that deregulated the financial industry to such extent as to allow them to wreck the economy in our own land and spread it across many borders.

You admire this sort of compromise, right?

Compromising the entire country to the interests of those who have no regard or concern for our country, or any other country, you consider to be a good thing, we can presume?

Any President since Kennedy has been bought and paid for to various extent, and certainly the negative implication of not doing 'Their' bidding is always there. Nixon (who proposed the initial version of what was later to be called 'Obamacare') and Carter did not reward 'Them' in a manner 'They' deemed to be sufficient, that's the end of that. 'They' tried to tone tone it down some, so those presidents were not shot in the head, as the concerned parties had sophisticated instruments for political ruination, thereby obviating the need for outright assassination.

If Obama could be even half as obstinate as that, especially against Rush/Hannity-inspired drooling idiots, then I might even be inspired to vote for him.


You can consider somebody wanting to f*ck your wife and daughter as someone who might be good to find some middle ground with, if you like.

Pardon if not all of us feel the same way about the situation.






< Message edited by Edwynn -- 11/3/2012 11:20:06 AM >

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 11:17:17 AM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: flyhumbleguy

You can get into a battle of who is more ideological than the other or whether one Congress is more tractable than another, but to do so is all based on conjecture and data that isn't particularly scientific or in any way universally accepted, time-tested, what have you. To be fair, you have to ask yourself if the tea party ideology was a reaction to other ideology whether it is embodied in another organized movement or just masses of people developing into a cult following of a particular leader.

Like I said,white noise(ie:static)

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 1:20:15 PM   
flyhumbleguy


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Doesn't Clinton tout his balanced budgets/surpluses as well as economic growth, much of it attributed to these very same compromises? Last I checked, growth and surpluses were desirable where as recessions and deficits not as much.

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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 1:42:48 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: flyhumbleguy

Continued welfare state socialism agendas will push some tea partiers towards national socialism just as Communist Russia and economic collapse pushed a Weimar Germany into supporting Hitler.


Ah, welfare state socialism. You do realize corporations get more in welfare that the citizens do, yes?


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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 2:23:53 PM   
Yachtie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: flyhumbleguy

Continued welfare state socialism agendas will push some tea partiers towards national socialism just as Communist Russia and economic collapse pushed a Weimar Germany into supporting Hitler.


Ah, welfare state socialism. You do realize corporations get more in welfare that the citizens do, yes?



If corporations got no welfare, and I agree they shouldn't, would that then make it ok for the other?


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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 2:26:56 PM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Ah, welfare state socialism. You do realize corporations get more in welfare that the citizens do, yes?


This has always struck me as an interesting thing about the American way of doing business.

The US seems to put all the money where it doesn't make a difference, spending more in the process.

In Norway, we spend 50% more than the USA on welfare, which is covered by gains in GDP, savings in healthcare, reductions in crime and so forth. But we spend far less on corporate welfare, if memory serves, and we run at a budget surplus. Where the US has trillions in debt, we have an equivalent figure per capita in savings, still growing. After tax and expenses, most of us have more to spend than most of you, and the entire population is sufficiently educated to handle any transition in the economic model (e.g. if manual labor goes obsolete, manual laborers here will shrug and take up engineering or whatever instead, grumbling about how their old work was more satisfying- a significant factor in choosing education).

Guess we're too greedy to neglect individual welfare, but I'm not sure why we don't do more corporate welfare too.

The liberal wing certainly wants more corporate welfare here, though earmarked, of course.

IWYW,
— Aswad.

P.S.: Is there a maxim along the lines of "frugal to the point of poverty" there? Ours doesn't translate well.


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RE: Why Obama scares conservatives. - 11/3/2012 2:45:25 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: flyhumbleguy

Continued welfare state socialism agendas will push some tea partiers towards national socialism just as Communist Russia and economic collapse pushed a Weimar Germany into supporting Hitler.


Ah, welfare state socialism. You do realize corporations get more in welfare that the citizens do, yes?



If corporations got no welfare, and I agree they shouldn't, would that then make it ok for the other?



Doesnt that fly into the face of the Republican mantra about letting businesses who cant succeed on their own to fail?

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RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
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Profile   Post #: 60
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