RE: The White Female Vote in America

RE: The White Female Vote in America (Full Version)

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vincentML -> RE: The White Female Vote in America (11/14/2012 3:57:46 PM)
quote: SD - this has been repeatedly pointed out on other threads. So much so, I'm really getting tired of repeating it. Since the 40s, a majority of blacks (between 70-94%) have historically voted for Democrats. The peak being Lyndon Johnson's election in '64 (In other words a white Democratic candidate received more black vote than even Obama). And, historically, a majority of whites have voted Republican. This is less about the race of the candidates as which party people feel more aligned with. You are quite right, ftp. It is about how the Party has been treating the voter group. As reported on a TV news show tonight . . .in addressing financial donors Romney complained that the reason Obama received the votes of Blacks, Hispanics, and young people was because they were recipients of his gifts. Romney truly believes the takers and makers myth. Ryan reinforced this meme by complaining about the "urban vote." I wonder who he meant [8\|] The denigration of Blacks, Hispanics, college kids, and women seems to be ingrained in the current Republican Party. They have a long way to go to win back voters from those disaffected groups.

fucktoyprincess -> RE: The White Female Vote in America (11/14/2012 4:23:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: TreasureKY You appear to be assuming that those things that are of interest to you, are of enough interest to other woman that they override any other factors that might be used to make a decision. This. In my opinion ANY candidate who is "not me" is going to represent some mix of stuff I agree with and disagree with. This year I voted green because Jill Stein was the only candidate taking an occupy stance. I instructed Carol to vote democratic because as much as I believe the occupy issues are critical, for her being a female I felt that issues of personal sovereignty over her own body were even more critical. So there's a perfect example of picking thing A I disliked in order to get thing B I did like. I see no reason why someone like Treasure might make a similar stance. Sure there's some crazy anti-female rhetoric going on in the Republican party right now. But it's perfectly reasonable to say something like, "I'm choosing to place the nation's benefit over my own." Let us deal with fiscal responsibility first and then we'll worry about personal sovereignty. It's just a different set of priorities than mine. Again, please read the OP. I say, perhaps they voted this way due to some combination of the following (and then I go on to list many possibilities). I state, clearly, some combination. I also ask for others' opinions (because my list was also not exhaustive). My OP is also NOT limited to issues about personal sovereignty. Please, go back, and read it. In other words, I also agree with what you say. I was trying to isolate the specific reasons that were prioritized. And while I do agree that people can have different priorities personally, this does not mean, as a political matter, that any of the rest of us have to treat that set of priorities as being ideal. In other words, I can criticize someone else for the priorities they have. In addition, having certain sets of priorities also says something deeper about how much people value certain other things. And that means they are open to criticism or praise depending on other people's perspectives. We are all still free to evaluate someone else's priorities as misguided, wrong, not good for other people, selfish, against self-interest, etc. If someone routinely chooses to work over spending time with their family, does this mean because they chose this, and they are free to choose this, that others are not allowed to tell them their priorities are wrong? Some of you are confusing political freedom with freedom from criticism.

fucktoyprincess -> RE: The White Female Vote in America (11/14/2012 5:02:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML You are quite right, ftp. It is about how the Party has been treating the voter group. As reported on a TV news show tonight . . .in addressing financial donors Romney complained that the reason Obama received the votes of Blacks, Hispanics, and young people was because they were recipients of his gifts. Romney truly believes the takers and makers myth. Ryan reinforced this meme by complaining about the "urban vote." I wonder who he meant [8\|] The denigration of Blacks, Hispanics, college kids, and women seems to be ingrained in the current Republican Party. They have a long way to go to win back voters from those disaffected groups. Thanks, and I just want to say that the purpose of my post was to point out that married white women voted for Romney. In other words, the denigration of women that you allude to has not affected one particular demographic - married white women. And I find that fascinating for many reasons. And while most women responded to the denigration of their gender in a predicable manner, some did not. As someone else has mentioned, Janis Lane, tea party leader, white female, thinks women should not have the right to vote. So part of the Republican faction basically thinks the same way as fundamental Islamic types - i.e. women should have no rights. People are allowed whatever priorities they choose. But the rest of us are entitled to criticize them for being self-hating, deluded, selfish, etc. And my feeling has always been, if you don't protect your own rights, and leave it to others to protect what is yours, eventually, you will have less to protect. This is simple historical reality. Married white women who think they can leave the protection of their rights to others, are severely misguided. And history supports my assertion. What frickin' good is a successful economy to women if women DON'T HAVE THE RIGHT TO VOTE?

BouncyBoo -> RE: The White Female Vote in America (11/14/2012 6:21:27 PM)
FR: A few other things I believe come in to play with these numbers that I do not believe have been thrown out yet, or need to be stated again 1. Perhaps conservative men are more likely to marry conservative women? This seems likely 2. Perhaps more older people - who tend to lean Republican - are married, and therefore there is a higher percentage of married women (likely older) voting for the Republican candidate 3. Perhaps married white women do not place the same weight on 'women's issues' as the OP does - these seems to have been expressed already, and finally 4. Perhaps married white women vote on a single candidate - rather than on the entirety of the individual candidate's party members (re: rape idiots).

fucktoyprincess -> RE: The White Female Vote in America (11/14/2012 6:21:50 PM)
p.s. And to those who feel economic issues are the only issues that matter, I would just like to remind you that freedom is not free.

fucktoyprincess -> RE: The White Female Vote in America (11/14/2012 6:36:50 PM)
Thanks BouncyBoo for your comments. I appreciate anyone who is providing information so that the rest of us can get under these numbers, so to speak, so thank you! I do think certain conservative men are much more likely to marry conservative women - particularly if they are part of a more fundamental religious group. I agree that age is also a factor here - I think it is safe to say that married white women are probably on average older than single white women (a majority of whom voted for Obama). And I did point out earlier that older women probably feel that issues around reproductive rights are not as important to them personally. Although with this last issue I do want to point out something that I think is very, very important. Simply because one is post-menopausal does not mean that all the female members of one's family or extended family are also post-menopausal. An elderly married white woman might still have daughters, granddaughters, nieces, sisters, etc. who are still of child-bearing age and for whom reproductive rights and freedoms are still important. So I would argue that if these rights are not important to one personally, one either does not believe others should have these rights or does not care about these rights for other family members more than one cares about other things (such as money). Again, part of what I am grappling with is that some women are not supportive of other women. And again, they are free to be that way. But then I am free to criticize them for it. All I know is that my mother for whom issues like birth control and abortion are irrelevant personally, would NEVER deny her daughters, sisters, granddaughters, nieces, etc. those rights because she cares about their well-being too much, especially her granddaughters. So when we speak of priorities, to me, one priority is how things affect not just me, but how they might affect other women. To only consider oneself, strikes me as selfish.

fucktoyprincess -> RE: The White Female Vote in America (11/14/2012 6:38:57 PM)
FR I also want to point out that people differ on who they think can better handle different aspects of the economy (if one endorses higher taxes on the rich - a Democratic policy - one can address part of the deficit). One doesn't need to vote for a Republican to solve some of the economic issues facing the country. But no one I know, even my Republican friends, thinks the Republicans support women's issues.

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