quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Details to make both IED's and homemade explosives are readily available on the internet.

Bath involved dynamite and other industrially produced explosives. No amateur getting instructions of the web could produce such high explosives.

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. I made mercury fulminate in my garage when I was 15 years old. Since the web wasn't born yet I had to make do with instructions I found on a BBS. Less than a minute with Google still produces many dozens of websites with instructions to synthesize many different high explosives. The information is definitely available and anyone who has taken chemistry 101 can make many of them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

No. Oslo involved low explosives, fertilizer and fuel oil. The difference in explosive power is considerable.

He also made high explosives.

But for the main charge, at that scale, ANFO is the preferred option. His mistake was failing to double check his sources, as the correct figures for booster mass are readily available in tabulated form from multiple sources that agree, but he stuck with a single source that gave a figure that was too low. Indeed, it seems he took more care at first, then started rushing toward the end.

Really, it's not very difficult to make high explosives, if you don't rush.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Sure. That's why manufacturers routinely blow up.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Details to make both IED's and homemade explosives are readily available on the internet.

Bath involved dynamite and other industrially produced explosives. No amateur getting instructions of the web could produce such high explosives.

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. I made mercury fulminate in my garage when I was 15 years old. Since the web wasn't born yet I had to make do with instructions I found on a BBS. Less than a minute with Google still produces many dozens of websites with instructions to synthesize many different high explosives. The information is definitely available and anyone who has taken chemistry 101 can make many of them.

If you were to make large quantities of mercury fulminate you'd likely blow yourself up.

Making stable high explosives in quantities that could blow up a building without blowing yourself up is another thing entirely.

quote:

Carver said he personally performed seven autopsies and those children had between three and 11 wounds each. Two were shot at close range, the others at a distance.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Truck fulls of explosives with less explosive power than a couple of sticks of dynamite can be produced if you are careful and lucky. They do a miserable job of doing damage. Oklahomah City involved a rental truck full of 55 gallon drums of ANFO. It tore up the building but did not bring it down. If you don't understand the difference in power between that stuff and real high explosives I suggest you find and talk to someone in the business. Maybe they can show you what one stick of dynamite can do.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
Speaking from my experience in the army, a few things that could have, while not prevented, but minimized the body count is rather obvious.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
soft targets such as schools, malls, train stations, etc need metal detectors at the entrances AND armed security.

quote:

ORIGINAL: stellauk
One thing you cannot control is the mind of the person who for those few moments chooses to hurt or kill another human being.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Truck fulls of explosives with less explosive power than a couple of sticks of dynamite can be produced if you are careful and lucky.

quote:

They do a miserable job of doing damage.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

If you were to make large quantities of mercury fulminate you'd likely blow yourself up.

quote:

Making stable high explosives in quantities that could blow up a building without blowing yourself up is another thing entirely.

quote:

ORIGINAL: y687master

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: y687master


First off, my heart goes to you for your loss. I agree with all the points you have made. The tragedy in CT is bad enough, any tragedy is just that tragedy. I find it simply appalling that anyone would seek to further an agenda and am very cautious when they seek to do so, especially right in the midst or on the heels of such tragedies.

There are those out there that seek to justify turning "rights" into "privileges", or just taking the "rights" away all together. Ask anyone in the 18-20 yr old age group. When the drinking age was raised, there was a lot of talk about how that would resolve the issue. Yet, still today we face it. The root cause was never dealt with, actually teaching your young how to do so responsibly. There are many other countries that work (if I might say, better) with everyone understanding there are "dire" consequences and sticking to those "dire" consequences. But those countries do not also have to deal with the legal system and lawyer issues that we do.

The answer lies in simply and honestly dealing with the real issues, instead of a knee jerk band aid political snowball fix.

Your words are true and I proud that you have used them wisely,
Master Devan

By the way, I love your signature quote. :P

What the fuck do you think you are involved in doing right now ?
You are ,as you put it,right now "furthering an agenda"
Your agenda just happens to be different than mine.
Your agenda is to keep the status quo in place.
Your agenda is to disregard the bodies and ignore the wailing of the parents.
Let me ask you something....how many dead are you willing to suffer ?
How many dead before we are allowed to have a conversation about the Second ?
Don't come here and tell me how distasteful my stance is,my stance seeks to do something about it.....yours would be to do nothing but deflect and allow the manufacturers to continue to peddle their tools of mayhem.


One last thing....your opinion ,the fact that you are "appalled",means nothing to me at all,20 dead children in Newton Conn.,that means everything...and it has to stop.


edited to add: Did you really think it was appropriate to add your little funny emoticon thing there ?
Talk about appalled.....I think I'm going to be sick !

I can see from your comments, that you are quite simply happy to be part of the cattle led to slaughter group. You are completely, blind and oblivious; you allow yourself to be spoonfed your thoughts and enjoy like a babe on any shoulder you can find to catch your regeritated words. Take some time, inform yourself. Look up the 2nd Amendment. Read about the supreme court rulings and attempt to understand them.

You like most, propagated by the media are confused about the differences between the 2nd Amendment and gun control. The only thing similar that they speak of is weapons. The media and the politians prey on your ignorance, you lack of taking the time to inform yourself. The 2nd Amendment speaks of the individual right of defense of oneself, family and loved ones, protection of a free and democratic republic, defence against hostile forces that threaten our free and democratic republic. ---- That is all, end of story... If you would take the time to inform yourself, you would realize how blind you really are to what the 2nd Amendment is. Read the summaries of the supreme court decisions, read the and see for yourself.

Gun Control is a completely separate issue from the 2nd Amendment. I had another post that I worked on for the better part of an hour last night to immediately follow this one, one click deleted the entire body of it while I was trying to quote, out of frustration and simply being tired I chose not to try to recreate it then. But in post you quoted: I did mention that little is and has been done to deal with the root cause; the actual issues I referenced one of them, which is teaching our young how to responsibly deal with things. Another is dealing with gun control and developing true protections for our society, in the issues of this the CT tragedy, the Virgina Tech, Columbine, the Aurora theater shooting and the list goes on and on; all the shooters involved had well documented psychiatric issues. Those issues need to be reported to some agency that is used as part of the licensing or a location that must give approval before any handgun, rifle, shotgun or such should be sold.

This will not be perfect but will work as another red flag for an intervention of some type. We must accept it not be perfect because we must accept this one saying "Where there is a will, there is a way". Those who seek to attack the innocent, to break the law, to do violence to create civil unrest; do not hold themselves to the laws and seek to find ways around them or flat out break them.

Your little rant refused to acknowlege is represents the major flaw of your very arguement. In every case, there is ONE PERSON with major psychological and sociological issues going on. That individual, THE ONE PULLING THE TRIGGER - IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DAMAGE, CIVIL, UNREST AND TRAGEDY THAT IS CREATED!!!! How can you justify laying blame on the rest of the law abiding citizens for those individual actions. Responsibility is something our society enjoys sweeping under the carpet, tries to cover with knee jerk reactions and half thought responses.

I am not disregarding nor do I seek to solely use the previously mention tragedies to stir up emotion to justify my firmly held beliefs. For your information, I personally do not own a gun or firearm. I have in the past and I did so responsibly because I was taught well. I am a veteran of the US Army. You talk about things you do not seem to truly understand. Educate yourself!

Oh yeah, and if you don't like the emoticon in my signature, GTFOI (get the fuck over it)

Master Ron

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Truck fulls of explosives with less explosive power than a couple of sticks of dynamite can be produced if you are careful and lucky. They do a miserable job of doing damage. Oklahomah City involved a rental truck full of 55 gallon drums of ANFO. It tore up the building but did not bring it down. If you don't understand the difference in power between that stuff and real high explosives I suggest you find and talk to someone in the business. Maybe they can show you what one stick of dynamite can do.

Timothy McVeigh did not use the commercially available ANFO as you are insisting, and neither did the terrorist who tried to blow up the World Trade Center.

In both cases they mixed the explosives up themselves.

Read the facts in the FBI file and the statements by Nichols when he was arrested and tried in court.

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

If you were to make large quantities of mercury fulminate you'd likely blow yourself up.

I almost did. I had to scram the cook a couple of times in an ice bath before it worked. It was an incredibly stupid thing for a kid to do.

quote:

Making stable high explosives in quantities that could blow up a building without blowing yourself up is another thing entirely.

Really?

Look. I made enough mercury fulminate to launch a wrecked Jeep 40' into the air and make a 10' wide/10' deep crater. In a dirty garage. From mail-ordered chemicals. When I was 15 years old. Without my parents ever having a clue. What do you think someone with decent equipment, funding, space and knowledge could do?

Again, you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

If you were to make large quantities of mercury fulminate you'd likely blow yourself up.

I almost did. I had to scram the cook a couple of times in an ice bath before it worked. It was an incredibly stupid thing for a kid to do.

quote:

Making stable high explosives in quantities that could blow up a building without blowing yourself up is another thing entirely.

Really?

Look. I made enough mercury fulminate to launch a wrecked Jeep 40' into the air and make a 10' wide/10' deep crater. In a dirty garage. From mail-ordered chemicals. When I was 15 years old. Without my parents ever having a clue. What do you think someone with decent equipment, funding, space and knowledge could do?

Again, you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Truck fulls of explosives with less explosive power than a couple of sticks of dynamite can be produced if you are careful and lucky.

Have you actually seen a stick of dynamite at work?

The booster charge in the Oslo bomb was equivalent to 70lbs of dynamite or so, detonating a tertiary charge of 950lbs of ANFO, with the two things limiting its force being the failure to initiate a high order detonation and the fact that the bomber was unaware of the massive garage complex under the site, which absorbed maybe as much as half the energy of the explosion.

70lbs of dynamite is a hell of a lot more than "a couple of sticks"...

quote:

They do a miserable job of doing damage.

Relatively speaking, yes.

Pound for pound, ANFO is less effective; dollar for dollar, it's more effective.

This according to people charged with shaving down the ocean floor here by about 65000m³ or so.

IWYW,
— Aswad.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

You admitted it yourself. You damn near blew yourself up making Mercury Fulminate.Which is not stable enough to safely transport or use as anything besides an initiator. I'm not sure how you moved the stuff, aborbed into filter paper?, but a single good bump could have detonated the stuff.

quote:

There is a very good reason that terrorists never use the stuff, depsite the fact it is really pretty easy to make. It is far too unstable to transport enough of it to be useful except as a detonator explosive for something more stable.

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Ken,one question if you don't mind.
Back on,I think page 8 ,you detailed some good common sense steps we could take...I'm curious why didn't you consider bio-metric technology ?
Now I am under no illusion about retro fitting all of the many ire arms floating around,but why can't we demand that the industry adopt biometric safeguards on all weapons manufactured from this point forward ?