RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools

RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (Full Version)

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SimplyMichael -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:20:39 PM)
Cell phones are al queda's most lethal weapon, its how they detonate car bombs. Guns and.bombs were illegal in ireland too...

Kirata -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:24:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead If we are getting the NRA excuses about why people need assault rifles, perhaps somebody could answer me this one: whatever for? The AR-15 is simply a small caliber rifle, no different from any other small caliber rifle used for hunting small game, target shooting, or homestead defense except for it's straight-line design, which lowers the barrel (raising the sights to compensate) so that the bore is brought into alignment with the recoil stop (your shoulder). This configuration prevents muzzle rise, making the AR a very stable and controllable weapon. That's why people like it. Only the military version is a full-auto magazine-eating assault rifle. K.

Moonhead -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:28:05 PM)
A competent gunsmith can convert the civilian version to full auto in a quarter of an hour, can't they? (I was always told, if we're getting onto the AR15 specifically, that the tiny little bullets it uses make it easier to control than a 30-06 or a 7.62. That's probably a big plus.)

jlf1961 -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:34:33 PM)
To convert any AR frame semi to full auto requires a change in receiver, lower assembly (to add the select fire switch) and a few very small parts. If you can find the necessary parts in the first place, they are covered under special laws called NFA laws, as is automatic weapons. For the record, prior to 1934,you could buy a full auto tommy gun at sears.

Moonhead -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:36:05 PM)
Hell, you could do that over here before the war. (Mind you, we didn't have Sears: you'd have to go to Halfords.)

DomKen -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:36:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raptorsc quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen quote: ORIGINAL: Raptorsc quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead Not actually the question I asked, or anything to do with it. you asked why do you need an assault rife, Im informing you "assault rifles" such as the ar15 are used as hunting, sporting, and target shooting guns. I answered your questing i thought, maybe im not understanding it AR-15's are terrible hunting and target shooting weapons. They were designed to be less accurate than hunting rifles and earlier military rifles, shorter barrels amongst other features. People buy AR's becuase they are either completely clueless or have rambo fantasies. If you intend to hunt and do it well you get a decent 30 caliber rifle (.30-30 or 30-06 or .308) or a .22 RIM for small game. Both also work much better for target shooting than an AR. Terrible hunting rifles? Its about all anyone uses these days. most states wont let you use 30-06 or .308 because the rounds travel a hell of alot further and with more kenetic energy. I live in indiana and ar15s are mainly varment platforms, I dont know where you get that "they arent accurate" ca-ca from but most are good well out beyond 800 - 900 yards. If you want to argue something bad about the 5.56 round argue that it was designed to tumble in the body and wound, not kill, because the prevalent thinking at the time of its inception was a wounded soldier took two soldiers to carry him off the battlefield thus taking three soldiers off the battlefield. I know of no state where a .30-06 or .30-30 isn't legal for deer hunting. I hunt in both WI and MN and they bother require using centerfire cartridges above .23 (might be .22 in WI). Where do you hunt that basic deer cartridges aren't legal for deer? Some digging around shows there is such a rule in Indiana. I honestly had never heard of such. Another reason to avoid IN.

SimplyMichael -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:38:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 To convert any AR frame semi to full auto requires a change in receiver, lower assembly (to add the select fire switch) and a few very small parts. If you can find the necessary parts in the first place, they are covered under special laws called NFA laws, as is automatic weapons. For the record, prior to 1934,you could buy a full auto tommy gun at sears. No offence but you are so utterly wrong on evrry part of this.

Raptorsc -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:39:20 PM)
I dont know too much about hunting laws in other states but i hear MI is very strict as well when it comes to hunting cartriges. I am not very knowledgeable on that though so ill leave some smarter hunters to that debate, I dont shoot at anything alive anymore.

SimplyMichael -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:39:53 PM)
States like new jersey you have to use slugs out of a shotgun due to range restrictions. We have national.parks bigger than those little ones.

Kirata -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:40:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead A competent gunsmith can convert the civilian version to full auto in a quarter of an hour, can't they? Obviously you would be surprised to learn how many different auto-loading rifles and pistols can be converted to full-auto even without a gunsmith. K.

LookieNoNookie -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:44:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Okay,I'm walking away again I swear I am...but I just caught a State Rep.from Oregon on CNN suggesting that we arm "volunteers" to protect out schools.That it is too expensive to expect law enforcement to do it,but that local leo's could in fact train and vett these proposed volunteers. I get the idea that many believe that America does not have a gun problem....that instead what we are facing is a shortage of armed responders. In other words America does not,currently,have quite enough folks walking around with loaded weapons. Volunteers....I wonder,should such volunteers be armed with assault rifles,I mean the last thing we want is for them to be outgunned in the ensuing gun fights ? I say we follow Ron Paul's lead..... Get the hell out of countries that want to kill us, keep the army on full staff and put one of them as sentry on every door in every school (need more army guys/galls....hire a few more) in America....colleges too.

Moonhead -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:44:57 PM)
Probably not. I know it's a lot easier to hobble a mechanism than replace it with something less effective, and that there's always a way around that.

SimplyMichael -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:46:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead A competent gunsmith can convert the civilian version to full auto in a quarter of an hour, can't they? Obviously you would be surprised to learn how many different auto-loading rifles and pistols can be converted to full-auto even without a gunsmith. K. One of the earliest weapons coverted into an automatic was done before 1900 with an old cowboy lever action. John Moses Browning converted an 1892 Winchester and that resulted in his first production machinegun the potato digger of 1895... In wwii the Aussies converted bolt action hunting rifles into light machineguns.

Notsweet -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:46:28 PM)
I think we're supposed to have the same weapons available to us as the government has, in case the government turns against us. I'm not a Democrat, but I'll put it in these terms. Suppose Bush turned out to be the evil dictator some thought him to be? Suppose he started "rounding up" gay people, people on welfare, people who voted for John Kerry. How would you fight back? If the next guy turns out to be Hitler, Pol Pot.....how are you going to fight back? It happens. Another thought. Every single government building has cops at the door. The cops have guns. All the government buildings except.....schools. They have a big sign that says "There are no guns here. We have no one who can shoot back." Why is it important to guard the mayor's ass, but not the asses of 600 kids? Honestly...how often do you hear about a trained law enforcement officer getting his gun taken from him? Not often. We need to stop fighting about guns and start figuring out what in the hell we're going to do for the mentally ill.

SimplyMichael -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:49:29 PM)
And now with the availability of cnc machines as well as the newer rapid prototyping machines, making guns is pretty easy. The jews made them.in basements during thevwarsaw uprising under the.nose of the gestapo

Moonhead -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 5:52:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael One of the earliest weapons coverted into an automatic was done before 1900 with an old cowboy lever action. John Moses Browning converted an 1892 Winchester and that resulted in his first production machinegun the potato digger of 1895... The Maxin gun was in production a decade before that, and I'm sure there'll be earlier designs still somebody can cite.

SimplyMichael -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 6:16:49 PM)
We were talking about converting rifles into machineguns, not the earliest machinegun which was, as you said, the Maxim. It started out as a machinegun, it was an original design. Never got to shoot one though.

Notsweet -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 6:18:31 PM)
I had a friend who worked as a prison guard in Virginia. He told me some of the ways that inmates have made guns. It was amazing.

slvemike4u -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 6:27:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Notsweet I think we're supposed to have the same weapons available to us as the government has, in case the government turns against us. I'm not a Democrat, but I'll put it in these terms. Suppose Bush turned out to be the evil dictator some thought him to be? Suppose he started "rounding up" gay people, people on welfare, people who voted for John Kerry. How would you fight back? If the next guy turns out to be Hitler, Pol Pot.....how are you going to fight back? It happens. Another thought. Every single government building has cops at the door. The cops have guns. All the government buildings except.....schools. They have a big sign that says "There are no guns here. We have no one who can shoot back." Why is it important to guard the mayor's ass, but not the asses of 600 kids? Honestly...how often do you hear about a trained law enforcement officer getting his gun taken from him? Not often. We need to stop fighting about guns and start figuring out what in the hell we're going to do for the mentally ill. Someone else is going to have to deal with this(tazzy where are you) when you made the "same weapons available to us as the government " claim I nearly jumped out of my skin. Do you really believe such tripe ?

slvemike4u -> RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools (12/17/2012 6:29:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Notsweet I had a friend who worked as a prison guard in Virginia. He told me some of the ways that inmates have made guns. It was amazing. I'm sure it was......were any of them able to duplicate government designs ?

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