RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution.

RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (Full Version)

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RacerJim -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 8:48:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwynn There was one young woman I went out with years ago who kept her Smith and Wesson at her bedside, but on the side closest to the entrance to her room. You can't believe all the finagling and scenario playing it took me to convince her that it would be safer if she kept the gun on the side of the bed further away from the door. In the same era, another young woman I was attracted to told me that she kept a gun in her home, but when I asked if she kept one in the chamber with the safety on, or had the safety off but needing to advance a round, she looked perplexed and told me she didn't know. I didn't ask her out. There are tens of thousands of men too stupid to figure out how to defend their home with a simple 9 mm and two clips, who claim they need assault weapons and a Howitzer for the task. Heaven help us if our country ever gets to the state of relying on people such as these to save our country. Heaven help us if our country ever acquieses to the likes of Senator Dianne Fiestein who wants to deny Joe Blow citizen the right to the same CCW permit that she has.

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:05:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: they are also being dishonest telling us there is no confiscation when the standards for gettinga full auto permit are, understandibley much higher than for other firearms people will not know untill it is too late that for most this will mean immediate confiscation. So now you are arguing that people will be ignorant of the new laws and that isnt fair to them? quote: this will overload ATF as they will go from a few thousand (estimate) to several million. A few hotheads here a few there body count goes up real fast. While reading several assesment of this last night I came across a comment by NYC chief who said it would be so dangerous that half his force would quit first. Another who states all Doctors will leave the country if we implement health care laws? I see people complain all the time on the boards about other countries with much harsher gun laws than we have. But, if every step you attempt to make is hesitant because this might happen, or they might react, or the other might not like it... why bother moving at all? THATS what is happening in this country. And you are proud of that? I am arguing that they are being delibertly missled

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:07:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RacerJim quote: ORIGINAL: Edwynn There was one young woman I went out with years ago who kept her Smith and Wesson at her bedside, but on the side closest to the entrance to her room. You can't believe all the finagling and scenario playing it took me to convince her that it would be safer if she kept the gun on the side of the bed further away from the door. In the same era, another young woman I was attracted to told me that she kept a gun in her home, but when I asked if she kept one in the chamber with the safety on, or had the safety off but needing to advance a round, she looked perplexed and told me she didn't know. I didn't ask her out. There are tens of thousands of men too stupid to figure out how to defend their home with a simple 9 mm and two clips, who claim they need assault weapons and a Howitzer for the task. Heaven help us if our country ever gets to the state of relying on people such as these to save our country. Heaven help us if our country ever acquieses to the likes of Senator Dianne Fiestein who wants to deny Joe Blow citizen the right to the same CCW permit that she has. revolvers don't have safties

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:08:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: they are also being dishonest telling us there is no confiscation when the standards for gettinga full auto permit are, understandibley much higher than for other firearms people will not know untill it is too late that for most this will mean immediate confiscation. So now you are arguing that people will be ignorant of the new laws and that isnt fair to them? quote: this will overload ATF as they will go from a few thousand (estimate) to several million. A few hotheads here a few there body count goes up real fast. While reading several assesment of this last night I came across a comment by NYC chief who said it would be so dangerous that half his force would quit first. Another who states all Doctors will leave the country if we implement health care laws? I see people complain all the time on the boards about other countries with much harsher gun laws than we have. But, if every step you attempt to make is hesitant because this might happen, or they might react, or the other might not like it... why bother moving at all? THATS what is happening in this country. And you are proud of that? not passing bad laws yes I think that is good

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:22:20 AM)
quote: not passing bad laws yes I think that is good In your opinion its a bad law. I think it will stand up to a SC challenge.

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:23:22 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: they are also being dishonest telling us there is no confiscation when the standards for gettinga full auto permit are, understandibley much higher than for other firearms people will not know untill it is too late that for most this will mean immediate confiscation. So now you are arguing that people will be ignorant of the new laws and that isnt fair to them? quote: this will overload ATF as they will go from a few thousand (estimate) to several million. A few hotheads here a few there body count goes up real fast. While reading several assesment of this last night I came across a comment by NYC chief who said it would be so dangerous that half his force would quit first. Another who states all Doctors will leave the country if we implement health care laws? I see people complain all the time on the boards about other countries with much harsher gun laws than we have. But, if every step you attempt to make is hesitant because this might happen, or they might react, or the other might not like it... why bother moving at all? THATS what is happening in this country. And you are proud of that? I am arguing that they are being delibertly missled How so? The bill is available... all laws are made available. If I can figure it out, surely an other gun owner can.

thishereboi -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:28:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RacerJim quote: ORIGINAL: Edwynn There was one young woman I went out with years ago who kept her Smith and Wesson at her bedside, but on the side closest to the entrance to her room. You can't believe all the finagling and scenario playing it took me to convince her that it would be safer if she kept the gun on the side of the bed further away from the door. In the same era, another young woman I was attracted to told me that she kept a gun in her home, but when I asked if she kept one in the chamber with the safety on, or had the safety off but needing to advance a round, she looked perplexed and told me she didn't know. I didn't ask her out. There are tens of thousands of men too stupid to figure out how to defend their home with a simple 9 mm and two clips, who claim they need assault weapons and a Howitzer for the task. Heaven help us if our country ever gets to the state of relying on people such as these to save our country. Heaven help us if our country ever acquieses to the likes of Senator Dianne Fiestein who wants to deny Joe Blow citizen the right to the same CCW permit that she has. It seems there are a lot of politicians who think others should be restricted but not themselves. http://news.yahoo.com/illinois-lawmaker-running-congress-bond-gun-charge-024620350.html

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:30:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: not passing bad laws yes I think that is good In your opinion its a bad law. I think it will stand up to a SC challenge. A that doesn't meam it is a good law see Dred Scott and Plesi vs Fergeson B it is another example of giving the gov more power over your life are you proud of that

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:34:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: they are also being dishonest telling us there is no confiscation when the standards for gettinga full auto permit are, understandibley much higher than for other firearms people will not know untill it is too late that for most this will mean immediate confiscation. So now you are arguing that people will be ignorant of the new laws and that isnt fair to them? quote: this will overload ATF as they will go from a few thousand (estimate) to several million. A few hotheads here a few there body count goes up real fast. While reading several assesment of this last night I came across a comment by NYC chief who said it would be so dangerous that half his force would quit first. Another who states all Doctors will leave the country if we implement health care laws? I see people complain all the time on the boards about other countries with much harsher gun laws than we have. But, if every step you attempt to make is hesitant because this might happen, or they might react, or the other might not like it... why bother moving at all? THATS what is happening in this country. And you are proud of that? I am arguing that they are being delibertly missled How so? The bill is available... all laws are made available. If I can figure it out, surely an other gun owner can. Fienstien assures them that currently owned firearms will be granfathered people will assume that means protected, and much of the media will reinforce this even with your stance if you publically stated you knowlege that this would amount to defacto confiscation you would be branded as a pro gun wacko

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:35:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi quote: ORIGINAL: RacerJim quote: ORIGINAL: Edwynn There was one young woman I went out with years ago who kept her Smith and Wesson at her bedside, but on the side closest to the entrance to her room. You can't believe all the finagling and scenario playing it took me to convince her that it would be safer if she kept the gun on the side of the bed further away from the door. In the same era, another young woman I was attracted to told me that she kept a gun in her home, but when I asked if she kept one in the chamber with the safety on, or had the safety off but needing to advance a round, she looked perplexed and told me she didn't know. I didn't ask her out. There are tens of thousands of men too stupid to figure out how to defend their home with a simple 9 mm and two clips, who claim they need assault weapons and a Howitzer for the task. Heaven help us if our country ever gets to the state of relying on people such as these to save our country. Heaven help us if our country ever acquieses to the likes of Senator Dianne Fiestein who wants to deny Joe Blow citizen the right to the same CCW permit that she has. It seems there are a lot of politicians who think others should be restricted but not themselves. http://news.yahoo.com/illinois-lawmaker-running-congress-bond-gun-charge-024620350.html she needs to be able to protect herself the peasants have no such need

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:42:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: not passing bad laws yes I think that is good In your opinion its a bad law. I think it will stand up to a SC challenge. A that doesn't meam it is a good law see Dred Scott and Plesi vs Fergeson B it is another example of giving the gov more power over your life are you proud of that We "give" the government a lot of power over all our lives... the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, ect ect ect.... being a prime example of that. These were all granted by the same government you now rail against.

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:46:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: not passing bad laws yes I think that is good In your opinion its a bad law. I think it will stand up to a SC challenge. A that doesn't meam it is a good law see Dred Scott and Plesi vs Fergeson B it is another example of giving the gov more power over your life are you proud of that We "give" the government a lot of power over all our lives... the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, ect ect ect.... being a prime example of that. These were all granted by the same government you now rail against. The constitution did not give us rights it recognized them. I am not railing against the goverment I, to the extent that I do, against the people who cheerfully give up their rights to the gov to expect any government not to take any power the people atampesd into giving them is like expecting a dog not to bark

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:50:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: they are also being dishonest telling us there is no confiscation when the standards for gettinga full auto permit are, understandibley much higher than for other firearms people will not know untill it is too late that for most this will mean immediate confiscation. So now you are arguing that people will be ignorant of the new laws and that isnt fair to them? quote: this will overload ATF as they will go from a few thousand (estimate) to several million. A few hotheads here a few there body count goes up real fast. While reading several assesment of this last night I came across a comment by NYC chief who said it would be so dangerous that half his force would quit first. Another who states all Doctors will leave the country if we implement health care laws? I see people complain all the time on the boards about other countries with much harsher gun laws than we have. But, if every step you attempt to make is hesitant because this might happen, or they might react, or the other might not like it... why bother moving at all? THATS what is happening in this country. And you are proud of that? I am arguing that they are being delibertly missled How so? The bill is available... all laws are made available. If I can figure it out, surely an other gun owner can. Fienstien assures them that currently owned firearms will be granfathered people will assume that means protected, and much of the media will reinforce this even with your stance if you publically stated you knowlege that this would amount to defacto confiscation you would be branded as a pro gun wacko The gun I own would not fall under the grandfathered clause. I dont see how she assured anyone they would particularly be ensured of continued ownership.

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:53:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: they are also being dishonest telling us there is no confiscation when the standards for gettinga full auto permit are, understandibley much higher than for other firearms people will not know untill it is too late that for most this will mean immediate confiscation. So now you are arguing that people will be ignorant of the new laws and that isnt fair to them? quote: this will overload ATF as they will go from a few thousand (estimate) to several million. A few hotheads here a few there body count goes up real fast. While reading several assesment of this last night I came across a comment by NYC chief who said it would be so dangerous that half his force would quit first. Another who states all Doctors will leave the country if we implement health care laws? I see people complain all the time on the boards about other countries with much harsher gun laws than we have. But, if every step you attempt to make is hesitant because this might happen, or they might react, or the other might not like it... why bother moving at all? THATS what is happening in this country. And you are proud of that? I am arguing that they are being delibertly missled How so? The bill is available... all laws are made available. If I can figure it out, surely an other gun owner can. Fienstien assures them that currently owned firearms will be granfathered people will assume that means protected, and much of the media will reinforce this even with your stance if you publically stated you knowlege that this would amount to defacto confiscation you would be branded as a pro gun wacko The gun I own would not fall under the grandfathered clause. I dont see how she assured anyone they would particularly be ensured of continued ownership. grandfathering implies exemption not a backdoor confiscation

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 9:59:53 AM)
quote: The constitution did not give us rights it recognized them. I am not railing against the goverment I, to the extent that I do, against the people who cheerfully give up their rights to the gov to expect any government not to take any power the people atampesd into giving them is like expecting a dog not to bark Who said this was cheerful? You do have a funny way of expressing yourself. Needs vs wants. My life is driven by that. Most people's are driven by wants vs needs. At the time of the Constitution, slavery was legal and practiced by many of the founding fathers. That time has gone, thankfully, in my opinion. Doesnt seem to be the opinion of some politicians... but there ya go. Again, I dont see a conflict what what she is proposing and the SC ruling. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/19/us/gun-plans-dont-conflict-with-justices-08-ruling.html?_r=0

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 10:01:17 AM)
quote: grandfathering implies exemption not a backdoor confiscation There are exemptions.

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 10:09:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: grandfathering implies exemption not a backdoor confiscation There are exemptions. we are going to steal it from your heirs isn't an exemption it's a delay

BamaD -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 10:12:48 AM)
again according to FBI stats last year 9 times as many people were murdered with non firearms as with all finds of rifles combined doesn't this make the assault weapons ban a strawman? if you register thumbs you cover all weapons and this still only affects those who try to obey the law

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 10:39:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: grandfathering implies exemption not a backdoor confiscation There are exemptions. we are going to steal it from your heirs isn't an exemption it's a delay Steal it from their heirs. Let me ask you this... if the heir you left it too is a convicted felon, is it still stealing? Why would someone be denied the access to a weapon under the law Feinstien proposed? Would they not also be denied access to a new weapon as they would an old one? If they cannot go out and buy one, why should they be allowed to possess one simply because someone "gave" it to them?

tazzygirl -> RE: Why was the 2nd Amendment written and added to the Constitution. (1/6/2013 10:47:09 AM)
quote: again according to FBI stats last year 9 times as many people were murdered with non firearms as with all finds of rifles combined doesn't this make the assault weapons ban a strawman? if you register thumbs you cover all weapons and this still only affects those who try to obey the law No, I dont believe it does make it a strawman. I find you using that argument a bit disingenuous. One.. not all guns will be banned. Two... just because something else may kill someone doesnt mean we shouldnt tackle this problem as well. I dont see guns as being the problem... I do see certain types of guns popping up in all sorts of crimes, not just homicides or mass murders. I dont see legal gun owners as being the criminals... I do see where they could make it extremely harder on a criminal who has the intentions of obtaining their legally possessed weapons.

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