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RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 10:04:39 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


Would you also like a link to validate that the sun will rise in the east.
Do you really think that taiwan does not lobby the u.s. govt?


No, I want you to back up your moronic post.
Anyone who passed 3rd grade civics knows the difference between lobbying and diplomacy.


It would appear that you, the alleged school teacher,has yet to pass the 3rd grade.
Simply typing the words taiwan lobbyist into google one will find 702,000 entries This one was at the top of the page.



http://www.propublica.org/article/lobbyists-arranged-n.y.-congressmans-20000-trip-to-taiwan

Well, goodie. You finally learned the difference between lobbying (has to do with the Legislative branch of the government) and diplomacy (has to do with the Executive branch)
Your link mentions a congressman getting a trip worth a whole 20 grand that he had to repay. Damn, that's efficient lobbying.
That's a tiny fracion of the millions the CANF pours into congress.
http://andromeda.rutgers.edu/~hbf/canf.htm

Thus my point of their relative power.

Taiwanese lobbyists 20K that the congressman had to repay
CANF Millions that congresspersons and presidents kept.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 141
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 10:10:09 AM   
YN


Posts: 699
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx



Communism is a governmental system socialism s an economic system.
It would appear that the formation of a "marxist-lenninist communist state" is a fait acompli in cuba.




Not surprising since they are run by the Cuban Communist party according to a constitution that mandates they run a Marx-Lenin-Engels-Marti inspired revolutionary communist state.

However their government is in fact operated as a republic.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 142
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 10:10:34 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Most countries have "Diplomatic Relations" with most others.
That is done thru the Dept of State and isn't lobbying.
Lobbying is private citizens and corporations speaking to congresspeeps concerning pending (or what they wish to be pending) legislation.




So is this recent example lobbying or diplomacy?

quote:

Two days after Christmas last year, Rep. Bill Owens (D-N.Y.) and his wife, Jane, boarded a first-class flight to Taiwan for a four-day tour of the island. Owens and his wife roomed at $500-a-night luxury hotels and enjoyed fine meals between meetings with Taiwanese officials and a day trip to Taipei’s famed National Palace Museum.

The Chinese Culture University in Taiwan had ostensibly invited the congressman and his wife “to promote international cultural exchange.” In fact, lobbyists for Taiwan’s government had organized the trip. Congressional ethics rules prohibit members from participating in most trips arranged by lobbyists.


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0512/76182.html#ixzz2NFYJdJQk

There are quite a few more examples from just the United States, never mind other nations.


It was an attempt at lobbying but turned out to be illegal money that the congressperson had to return.
"Giving" someone a trip, letting him live it up on what he thinks is your dime and then find out when he gets home that he has to repay it all isn't a very good way to buy influence. LOL

Handing Millions to various candidates for their campaign IS efficient lobbying.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to YN)
Profile   Post #: 143
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 10:13:05 AM   
YN


Posts: 699
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


It was an attempt at lobbying but turned out to be illegal money that the congressperson had to return.
"Giving" someone a trip, letting him live it up on what he thinks is your dime and then find out when he gets home that he has to repay it all isn't a very good way to buy influence. LOL

Handing Millions to various candidates for their campaign IS efficient lobbying.


It is usually the case worldwide that lobbying often involves legally questionable activities.

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 144
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 10:27:56 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


It was an attempt at lobbying but turned out to be illegal money that the congressperson had to return.
"Giving" someone a trip, letting him live it up on what he thinks is your dime and then find out when he gets home that he has to repay it all isn't a very good way to buy influence. LOL

Handing Millions to various candidates for their campaign IS efficient lobbying.


It is usually the case worldwide that lobbying often involves legally questionable activities.

I'd love to see all lobbying done away with in the US.
As for other countries, I'm not going to try to tell them how to run their country.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to YN)
Profile   Post #: 145
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 11:09:30 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx



Communism is a governmental system socialism s an economic system.
It would appear that the formation of a "marxist-lenninist communist state" is a fait acompli in cuba.




Not surprising since they are run by the Cuban Communist party according to a constitution that mandates they run a Marx-Lenin-Engels-Marti inspired revolutionary communist state.

However their government is in fact operated as a republic.


Do you percieve any difference between a republic and a marx-lennin-engles-marti inspired revolutionary state?

(in reply to YN)
Profile   Post #: 146
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 11:30:48 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

The difference between China and Cuba is there is no Chinese American National Foundation that considers themselves a "Government in exile" and feeds shitloads of money to Republican candidates to maintain the embargo.

There is taiwan who,while it may not be concerned with the cuban embago,clearly believe that taiwan is the government of china in exile,clearly lobby the u.s.congress and feed shitloads of money to u.s. polititions
quote:

Thus my point of their relative power.

Taiwanese lobbyists 20K that the congressman had to repay
CANF Millions that congresspersons and presidents kept.


Perhaps you should consult the remaining 700,000 + entries I linkied you to. Consider how much the military umbrella we support over taiwan costs.
Do you really believe the punk ass motherfuckers in fla. have more money to bribe u.s. polititians than the punk ass motherfuckers from taiwan?

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 147
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 11:34:18 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

Well, goodie. You finally learned the difference between lobbying (has to do with the Legislative branch of the government) and diplomacy (has to do with the Executive branch)


The difference between lobbying and diplomacy is a construct of your imagination, I have not made any comments on that.
It appears that when you argue with yourself you always win...when you argue with others you seldom win.

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 148
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 11:42:19 AM   
Hillwilliam


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Joined: 8/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


Do you really believe the punk ass motherfuckers in fla. have more money to bribe u.s. polititians than the punk ass motherfuckers from taiwan?

They may not have more but they use it more effectively.
The exile community and CANF have basically dictated US/Cuba relations for 4 decades to the detriment of the people of both countries.
They have bought and sold more politicians than the Taiwanese and even put their own into Congress.
How many Taiwanese are in Congress? ZERO
Hell, we don't even have formal diplomatic relations with Taiwan because we had to appease China. We have "The American Institute in Taiwan" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan_Relations_Act

Yeah, those Taiwanese 'lobbyists' are really influential.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 149
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 11:44:40 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

Well, goodie. You finally learned the difference between lobbying (has to do with the Legislative branch of the government) and diplomacy (has to do with the Executive branch)


The difference between lobbying and diplomacy is a construct of your imagination, I have not made any comments on that.
It appears that when you argue with yourself you always win...when you argue with others you seldom win.


If you don't know the difference between the 2, maybe you could study up on it while you sit around your home waiting for another government check that you brag about getting for not working.
One is the executuve branch, the other is legislative.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 150
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 12:05:09 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

Well, goodie. You finally learned the difference between lobbying (has to do with the Legislative branch of the government) and diplomacy (has to do with the Executive branch)


The difference between lobbying and diplomacy is a construct of your imagination, I have not made any comments on that.
It appears that when you argue with yourself you always win...when you argue with others you seldom win.


If you don't know the difference between the 2, maybe you could study up on it while you sit around your home waiting for another government check that you brag about getting for not working.
One is the executuve branch, the other is legislative.


The difference between the two is something that you seem to be arguing with yourself about.
As for my welfare check they are direct deposit so I do not have to sit around waiting for it to be delivered.


< Message edited by thompsonx -- 3/11/2013 12:12:43 PM >

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 151
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 12:07:45 PM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

Well, goodie. You finally learned the difference between lobbying (has to do with the Legislative branch of the government) and diplomacy (has to do with the Executive branch)


The difference between lobbying and diplomacy is a construct of your imagination, I have not made any comments on that.
It appears that when you argue with yourself you always win...when you argue with others you seldom win.


If you don't know the difference between the 2, maybe you could study up on it while you sit around your home waiting for another government check that you brag about getting for not working.
One is the executuve branch, the other is legislative.


The difference between the two is something that you seem to be arguing with yourself about.
As for my welfare check tey are direct deposit so I do not have to sit around waiting for it to be delivered.


Im not arguing with myself about it. I'm arguing with ignorant people. Know any?

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 152
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 12:10:17 PM   
YN


Posts: 699
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Do you percieve any difference between a republic and a marx-lennin-engles-marti inspired revolutionary state?


What "communist" government has not been a republic? (Perhaps North Korea is the first "constitutional monarchy" which uses a communist social/economic model, for the head of state appears hereditary position.)


< Message edited by YN -- 3/11/2013 12:13:10 PM >

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 153
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 12:53:38 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


Do you really believe the punk ass motherfuckers in fla. have more money to bribe u.s. polititians than the punk ass motherfuckers from taiwan?

They may not have more but they use it more effectively.
The exile community and CANF have basically dictated US/Cuba relations for 4 decades to the detriment of the people of both countries.
They have bought and sold more politicians than the Taiwanese and even put their own into Congress.
How many Taiwanese are in Congress? ZERO


Ever hear of david wu?
Ever hear of grace meng?

quote:

Hell, we don't even have formal diplomatic relations with Taiwan because we had to appease China. We have "The American Institute in Taiwan" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan_Relations_Act

Yeah, those Taiwanese 'lobbyists' are really influential.


From your link.
So as to maintain good relations with the United States, the PRC offered new, more generous proposals to the Taipei government for Chinese reunification, introducing the one country, two systems concept which would allow Taiwan near-complete autonomy. However, the ROC government hardened its position with the Three Noes Policy and mobilized its ethnic lobby in the United States to agitate Congress for the swift passage of an American security guarantee for the island.[2]

Also from your link.
The act authorizes de facto diplomatic relations with the "governing authorities on Taiwan" (which is currently the Republic of China government) by giving special powers to the American Institute in Taiwan to the level that it is the de facto embassy, and states that any international agreements made between the ROC and U.S. before 1979 are still valid unless otherwise terminated.
also from your link
The act provides that for most practical purposes of the U.S. government, the absence of diplomatic relations and recognition will have no effect.
Also from your link.
The act stipulates that the United States will "consider any effort to determine the future of Taiwan by other than peaceful means, including by boycotts or embargoes, a threat to the peace and security of the Western Pacific area and of grave concern to the United States".

This act also requires the United States "to provide Taiwan with arms of a defensive character", and "to maintain the capacity of the United States to resist any resort to force or other forms of coercion that would jeopardize the security, or the social or economic system, of the people on Taiwan." Successive U.S. administrations have sold arms to the ROC in compliance with the Taiwan Relations Act despite demands from the PRC that the U.S. follow the legally non-binding Three Joint Communiques and the U.S. government's proclaimed One-China policy (which differs from the PRC's One-China Policy). The Taiwan Relations Act does not require the U.S. to intervene militarily if the PRC attacks or invades Taiwan, and the U.S. has adopted a policy of "strategic ambiguity" in which the U.S. neither confirms nor denies that it would intervene in such a scenario.

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 154
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 4:37:14 PM   
YN


Posts: 699
Status: offline
To move this forward, neither the Cuban reactionaries and counter-revolutionaries in "Miami," nor the Taiwan lobbyists seem to have much influence outside the United States recently.

And in the case of Venezuela (and likely the rest of Latin America) both Cuba and the People's Republic of China have greater good will, and far greater economic and moral power, then their respective exiled renegades.

(in reply to YN)
Profile   Post #: 155
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 5:48:58 PM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


[Ever hear of david wu?
Ever hear of grace meng?


Wu, not in congress. resigned in disgrace.
Meng, born in queens.

Fail

< Message edited by Hillwilliam -- 3/11/2013 5:53:01 PM >


_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 156
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/11/2013 8:10:06 PM   
FatDomDaddy


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Joined: 1/31/2004
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Toward the end of this decade, I am really going to enjoy my coffee and Cuban Sandwich by the sea wall as I ponder going back to my five star hotel and deciding if I want to play blackjack or craps that evening. I'll have a Cuba Libre or perhaps a Mojito in your honor tompsonx and toast "¡Por Cuba Libre!" Heck.... I may even take up smoking cigars again.

Honestly, I can't wait...

Viva La Revolution Baby

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 157
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/12/2013 6:31:46 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Toward the end of this decade, I am really going to enjoy my coffee and Cuban Sandwich by the sea wall as I ponder going back to my five star hotel and deciding if I want to play blackjack or craps that evening. I'll have a Cuba Libre or perhaps a Mojito in your honor tompsonx and toast "¡Por Cuba Libre!" Heck.... I may even take up smoking cigars again.

Honestly, I can't wait...

Viva La Revolution Baby

Can't you do that now?
You are not afraid of the punks from miami machine gunning your villa in a drive by in a picklefork are you?

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 158
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/12/2013 6:42:27 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


[Ever hear of david wu?
Ever hear of grace meng?


Wu, not in congress. resigned in disgrace.
Meng, born in queens.

Fail

Resigning in disgrace means he was never a taiwanese american congressman?
Both meng and wu were born in the u.s.,that is what makes them taiwanese american congress persons.
Were you unaware of the constitutional requirements for citizenship and residency for congress?

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 159
RE: Chavez dead... - 3/12/2013 7:54:13 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Toward the end of this decade, I am really going to enjoy my coffee and Cuban Sandwich by the sea wall as I ponder going back to my five star hotel and deciding if I want to play blackjack or craps that evening. I'll have a Cuba Libre or perhaps a Mojito in your honor tompsonx and toast "¡Por Cuba Libre!" Heck.... I may even take up smoking cigars again.

Honestly, I can't wait...

Viva La Revolution Baby

Can't you do that now?
You are not afraid of the punks from miami machine gunning your villa in a drive by in a picklefork are you?

There have been many terrorist acts both domestic and abroad linked to CANF and their paramilitary arm Alpha 66.

http://www.spectrezine.org/global/cubaandterrorism.html
http://www.salon.com/2008/01/14/cuba_2/

One of these acts was against a Spanish language radio host in miami who advocated normalizing relaitions.
His car exploded one morning when he started it up and he lost both legs.
Noone was prosecuted.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 160
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