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RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/8/2013 11:19:20 AM

TheLilSquaw

Posts: 2340
Joined: 10/24/2012
From: Middle River, MD
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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheLilSquaw

In all fairness we are only hearing 1 side of the story so saying someone was neglectful is harsh IMO.

I agree, and not only don't I want to get into these specifics here, it's also impossible for me to present an objective view on this because of how involved I am.

I already regret making the post where I outlined some of her faults as I see them. I should have just put Notsweet on ignore and moved on.

I would also say that I don't agree with a parent or step parent publicly bad mouthing another parent. IMO this kind of thing can be very damaging to a kid, even an adult child and destroy any relationship they may have with the offending parent or step parent.

To ME when I see it happen it makes me sad for the child because to ME they are in the middle and even if they don't ever see or hear this stuff they do feel the tension and the negative energy. I hope you don't ever say stuff like that to these kids, true or not.

< Message edited by TheLilSquaw -- 3/8/2013 11:20:40 AM >

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Post #: 101

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/8/2013 11:29:14 AM

UllrsIshtar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheLilSquaw

To ME when I see it happen it makes me sad for the child because to ME they are in the middle and even if they don't ever see or hear this stuff they do feel the tension and the negative energy. I hope you don't ever say stuff like that to these kids, true or not.

I think you're absolutely right, which is why I already regret making that post.

Both us and their mother (it's one of the things I think she's doing an absolutely wonderful job on) try to never let the kids see any negativity towards the other household.
Communications in person have all but seized in person, but when it does happen accidentally, both households are enthusiastic about the other parent, prompt kids to go say high, emphasize the fun to be had at the other household during custody exchanges and so on.
We never say negative things of their mother in front of them, and I've got reason to believe that she doesn't about us either.

So while I don't doubt that they sense they're some weird tension going on, all parties involved are really trying very hard to make sure the kids grow up in an environment where their love for all their parental types is respected, encouraged and celebrated.

Adult issues should stay between the adults and not have kids in the middle... another reason why divorce can sometimes make some people better parents.

< Message edited by UllrsIshtar -- 3/8/2013 11:30:14 AM >

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And your whore
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Post #: 102

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/8/2013 11:43:34 AM

TheLilSquaw

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From: Middle River, MD
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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

Adult issues should stay between the adults and not have kids in the middle...

I agree with this.

It happens far to often and children are used as pawns by one side or both and it's heart breaking.

Co-parenting can be hard, coming in as a step parent and co-parenting can really be hard.

Good luck.

< Message edited by TheLilSquaw -- 3/8/2013 11:47:22 AM >

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Post #: 103

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/8/2013 11:52:31 AM

SeekingTrinity

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Joined: 5/29/2012
From: The 'burbs of Portland, OR
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~FRing it~

Co-parenting is a very delicate situation. Kudos to all of you for keeping civility with each other. Far better you vent here if you need to then in front of the little ones. It's by no means an easy place to be.

At first blush, I too kinda was thinking "holy shit, that kid has an assload of chores to do." But after thinking a moment about it, stuff like hanging up your coat and putting away your backpack when you get home from school is the same things I expected out of my now 9 year old daughter when she was your step-son's age.

I guess what I'd like to caution is to have realistic expectations when it comes to dreamer type kids. My daughter is the exact same way too. I'll be honest...it frustrated me too sometimes. What worked better for me was not cramming a circle shaped her into the square hole that was my expectations. Right now, you might have to just pick your battles. Toilet stuff your biggest pet peeve? Pick that battle to fight, but counter that with focus on an activity he does that you think he does pretty well. Take unloading the dishwasher if its one he's naturally pretty good at. Stuff like "I really like the way you put the silverware away in all the right places...great job" or other such phrases build confidence. Use the good job chore as the confidence booster while working on the one issue you choose as the one needing the most work. keep the good job one highly positive and uplifting. For me with my daughter, expecting more than she could give in all areas was killing her self-confidence. So I too would get the "I don't know" answers because I was inadvertently making her so scared to try for fear of failing or disappointing me. When I broke it down into one thing to work on while building confidence with one other, I think it didn't overwhelm her as much and I noticed she wasn't just shutting down on me as much.

Unfortunately kids don't come with instruction manuals and we parents are human beings who fuck up too sometimes.

< Message edited by SeekingTrinity -- 3/8/2013 11:55:08 AM >

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Post #: 104

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/8/2013 6:00:54 PM

LaTigresse

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Joined: 1/15/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SeekingTrinity

~FRing it~

Co-parenting is a very delicate situation. Kudos to all of you for keeping civility with each other. Far better you vent here if you need to then in front of the little ones. It's by no means an easy place to be.

At first blush, I too kinda was thinking "holy shit, that kid has an assload of chores to do." But after thinking a moment about it, stuff like hanging up your coat and putting away your backpack when you get home from school is the same things I expected out of my now 9 year old daughter when she was your step-son's age.

I guess what I'd like to caution is to have realistic expectations when it comes to dreamer type kids. My daughter is the exact same way too. I'll be honest...it frustrated me too sometimes. What worked better for me was not cramming a circle shaped her into the square hole that was my expectations. Right now, you might have to just pick your battles. Toilet stuff your biggest pet peeve? Pick that battle to fight, but counter that with focus on an activity he does that you think he does pretty well. Take unloading the dishwasher if its one he's naturally pretty good at. Stuff like "I really like the way you put the silverware away in all the right places...great job" or other such phrases build confidence. Use the good job chore as the confidence booster while working on the one issue you choose as the one needing the most work. keep the good job one highly positive and uplifting. For me with my daughter, expecting more than she could give in all areas was killing her self-confidence. So I too would get the "I don't know" answers because I was inadvertently making her so scared to try for fear of failing or disappointing me. When I broke it down into one thing to work on while building confidence with one other, I think it didn't overwhelm her as much and I noticed she wasn't just shutting down on me as much.

Unfortunately kids don't come with instruction manuals and we parents are human beings who fuck up too sometimes.

Excellent post.

And Ishtar I commend you for giving a damn about these kids. Many 'additional' parents don't and certainly not to the degree you obviously do.

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Post #: 105

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/8/2013 10:59:00 PM

littlewonder

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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

If you're seriously suggesting that I cater on him hand and foot like a maid, and follow him around the house all day to flush the toilet for him at 5 years old, then tell me... when exactly WILL he be old that I can start expecting him to hang up his coat and put his shoes away before he comes in the house, instead of dropping them wherever the fancy strikes him?

eeerr...to be honest? Never. My daughter even at the age of 16 still could not figure out how to put away her bookbag when she came through the door. That's what kids do. Just because his sister does it does not mean he will do it. I've even volunteered at schools of kids of all ages and there were always kids who had to be told a million times....yes, even at the high school level. Some kids just don't get it or don't care. It has nothing to do with learning disabilities but that not all kids are cookie cutters. Some will do it because they're told to. Some will do it because they want to. Some won't do it because they want to rebel. Some won't do it because they are flighty and just forget. So what? Is it really THAT important???

Like I said on another thread just a little bit ago here. Pick your battles. Maybe lighten up a bit. Hate to tell ya this, but being a parent isn't easy. You will get frustrated. You will get angry. You will tell them a million times to do something. You will have one kid who is a goody two shoes and does everything you tell them. You will always have one kid who won't. That's life.

So unless you want to be the mom who needs a drink everyday because her kid won't flush the toilet or put his coat away and now she's so stressed out from it that she can't cope, you really will need to decide what is and isn't something that is a big deal.

And yeah, as much as I would plan out a day for my daughter when she was little, some days...ok, most days...it didn't happen. I would end up having to spend the entire day following her around either because she was being a grouchy grinch or because she wanted mommy's attention all day. Again, that's kids. Would I get a little bitchy and tired at the end of the day? You betchya. But the moment I signed on to be mom is the moment I signed my life away.

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Post #: 106

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/9/2013 6:46:38 AM

RochesterDomme

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Joined: 2/21/2013
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"No electronics (or anything else fun) until chores are done is already part of the deal and strictly enforces. The problem is that he doesn't seem to care.
I can tell him that, and enforce it, and it will still take him 2 hours to do a chore that should take 10 minutes, mostly because he keeps distracting himself and moves SOOOO slowly.
The concept of "the faster you get done the more time you have to play" just doesn't seem to get through to him for some reason. "

Of course it doesn't get through to him.... he's already playing, you just don't see it. At least from my own experience of raising one of these little creatures, what I don't think you realize is, in his head HE is playing. 5 year olds have a very active imaginary world. And to them it is very real. AND normal. It may look like he's staring off, not doing anything, but in reality, he's off fighting dragons, building robots, climbing an erupting volcano, who knows. Ask him to draw pictures of what he did today and you might be in for an experience. Unbeknownst to me, when my son was that age, we had a house full of dinosaurs that my son had taught tricks to.

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Post #: 107

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/9/2013 9:54:17 AM

lizi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RochesterDomme

"No electronics (or anything else fun) until chores are done is already part of the deal and strictly enforces. The problem is that he doesn't seem to care.
I can tell him that, and enforce it, and it will still take him 2 hours to do a chore that should take 10 minutes, mostly because he keeps distracting himself and moves SOOOO slowly.
The concept of "the faster you get done the more time you have to play" just doesn't seem to get through to him for some reason. "

Of course it doesn't get through to him.... he's already playing, you just don't see it. At least from my own experience of raising one of these little creatures, what I don't think you realize is, in his head HE is playing. 5 year olds have a very active imaginary world. And to them it is very real. AND normal. It may look like he's staring off, not doing anything, but in reality, he's off fighting dragons, building robots, climbing an erupting volcano, who knows. Ask him to draw pictures of what he did today and you might be in for an experience. Unbeknownst to me, when my son was that age, we had a house full of dinosaurs that my son had taught tricks to.

Good point. One thing I see very often in written IEP goals for students is to have them achieve an activity in a certain amount of time. You could tie the reward to completing the task within the time limit.

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Post #: 108

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/9/2013 11:01:05 AM

UllrsIshtar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

If you're seriously suggesting that I cater on him hand and foot like a maid, and follow him around the house all day to flush the toilet for him at 5 years old, then tell me... when exactly WILL he be old that I can start expecting him to hang up his coat and put his shoes away before he comes in the house, instead of dropping them wherever the fancy strikes him?

eeerr...to be honest? Never. My daughter even at the age of 16 still could not figure out how to put away her bookbag when she came through the door.

That's unacceptable to me and will not happen (the never part... not the "he may still not be able to do so at 16").

My mother raised us without having any expectations of personal responsibility and accountability. We weren't expected to help with anything, or do anything. We could boss her around and get her to do stuff for us.
Part of that was because she waited to add in chores until she had 4 kids and me (the oldest) was 14. By that time I was so used to doing nothing that I blatantly refused to even try chores. And she was to busy to last through the fight with me.

In retrospect I think it was very damaging for me, and taught me a whole bunch of exactly the wrong things.
I really wish my mother would have stood firm and taught me how to do chores, not only because now I entered into adult hood not knowing how to even cook an omelet (I had never even made toast before I was 20) but also not knowing how to do anything at all, I didn't want to do.

I had to teach myself work structure, how to persist in an activity I didn't care for, self-discipline and perseverance on the job with work that I needed to support myself between 18-22 years old, while at home I had to teach myself how to do even the simplest of household tasks, how to set up a routine to get things done, and how to cope with not having 10 hours of free time every day, from one day to the next.

It was an absolutely miserable time for me, and I think my mother did me a HUGE disservice by never expecting anything from me as a child.

These kids will already grow up in a very similar environment expectation wise, when they are with their mother... when they are at our house, that will not happen... it's out of the question. If there is only one thing that I can gift these kids with as the impact I had on their life because they knew me, it will be that they are prepared for an adult world where you don't just get to do whatever you want all the time, and people and life will have expectations of you beyond what may strike your fancy at the moment.

They will grow up with chores, because I truly believe it's what's best for them. The only thing I'm willing to budge on in that aspect is which chores, how many, and at which age.

quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

So unless you want to be the mom who needs a drink everyday because her kid won't flush the toilet or put his coat away and now she's so stressed out from it that she can't cope, you really will need to decide what is and isn't something that is a big deal.

They rarely, if ever, stress me out. They annoy me sometimes, and I worry and am concerned about them a lot, especially the boy, but stress isn't really a factor. I'm not even quite sure how a 5 and 6 year old kid are supposed to be able to stress me out. I mean, they're so little, and still so willing to please that if they get loud and wild and stressful it's very easy to curb and manage their behavior so that they either cool down, or go be wild somewhere where it will not impact me. So I can't imagine them driving me to any stress coping behavior, let alone a bottle (I rarely drink outside of restaurants).

< Message edited by UllrsIshtar -- 3/9/2013 11:03:59 AM >

_____________________________

I can be your whore
I am the dirt you created
I am your sinner
And your whore
But let me tell you something baby
You love me for everything you hate me for

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 109

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/9/2013 11:07:44 AM

UllrsIshtar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RochesterDomme

Of course it doesn't get through to him.... he's already playing, you just don't see it.

That's a great point, thanks for that.

It helps in the same way a lot of the advice on this tread has really helped me: to get me outside of my own head and worries, and look at him with fresh eyes and new perspectives.

I've gotten a bunch of great ideas on how to try new stuff (like making pictures charts for him) but most of all, there was a bunch of advice that has just gotten me to approach things with him from a different mindset/angle which I think will help *me* a lot, to then in turn help him because I feel more relaxed and confident.

Thanks everybody!

_____________________________

I can be your whore
I am the dirt you created
I am your sinner
And your whore
But let me tell you something baby
You love me for everything you hate me for

(in reply to RochesterDomme)

Post #: 110

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/9/2013 11:11:30 AM

UllrsIshtar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

And Ishtar I commend you for giving a damn about these kids. Many 'additional' parents don't and certainly not to the degree you obviously do.

Thanks, but to be honest, it's in part pure selfishness on my behalf.

I knew they where part of the deal when I married my husband, and with the behavior that they exhibit/learn at their mother's house I can't cope.
So it was fully in my best interest to lay down house rules, expectations, and structure, to be able to coexist in the same house as them. It's just that I also believe that the most efficient method to achieve what I want with them is to implement these things in a way that also firmly is in their best interest. So it ends up being a win/win for both parties.

_____________________________

I can be your whore
I am the dirt you created
I am your sinner
And your whore
But let me tell you something baby
You love me for everything you hate me for

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 111

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/9/2013 11:40:31 AM

freedomdwarf1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar
That's unacceptable to me and will not happen (the never part... not the "he may still not be able to do so at 16").

You are just going to have to accept that some kids are like that - no matter what you try to do.

I have a 19yo step-son who doesn't flush the loo when he's been in there.
If we don't shout at him, he never thinks to wash or shower.
All 4 of my kids just dump their stuff on the sofa when they walk in and it's not like they haven't been told a zillion times to hang up coats and put bags sensibly on the floor or take it to their rooms.

It's all part of being a (step)parent and sometimes it doesn't stop when they reach 18!

(in reply to UllrsIshtar)

Post #: 112

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/9/2013 9:57:32 PM

littlewonder

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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar
That's unacceptable to me and will not happen (the never part... not the "he may still not be able to do so at 16").

Good luck with that lol.

I hope that works out for you. Really I do. I do hope to hear how it goes in a few years though. We all say that when we're raising kids and then one day you realize, yeah, we were fooling ourselves into believing that lol.

I talk to my daughter now about when she has kids one day. She says her kids will be her little minions. Basically they will do everything she says. I sooo can't wait to see how this works out hahahaha.

I will laugh and laugh and laugh and laugh

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Post #: 113

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/10/2013 12:01:31 AM

UllrsIshtar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar
That's unacceptable to me and will not happen (the never part... not the "he may still not be able to do so at 16").

Good luck with that lol.

I hope that works out for you. Really I do. I do hope to hear how it goes in a few years though. We all say that when we're raising kids and then one day you realize, yeah, we were fooling ourselves into believing that lol.

I talk to my daughter now about when she has kids one day. She says her kids will be her little minions. Basically they will do everything she says. I sooo can't wait to see how this works out hahahaha.

I will laugh and laugh and laugh and laugh

I expect that over the coming years I'll have to readjust various plans and expectations a lot with them (like I'm now doing with the boy).

I'd also hate for them to grow up doing everything I say all that time. In fact, I'd count that as me being a complete failure as a parental figure in raising them to be free, self-thinking individuals.

So yeah, I might end up taking ALL of that back in a couple of years.

But considering that I'm pretty sure I'll still be around here then, if you're too, I'll be glad to give you and update and discuss how it went once they hit their teens.

_____________________________

I can be your whore
I am the dirt you created
I am your sinner
And your whore
But let me tell you something baby
You love me for everything you hate me for

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 114

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/10/2013 12:30:58 AM

littlewonder

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oohh...I love to hear about parents with teenagers.

If you can get them to do anything more than eat, sleep and roll their eyes I'd have to then say you are a saint!

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Post #: 115

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/10/2013 1:56:26 PM

calamitysandra

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Well, we are just starting out in our journey through teenagehood and puberty (Oldest is 13, in the throes of the hormone rollercoaster since he was 11), but right now I can say that, while it is challenging, it is not undoable.

Being understanding, but consequent, and keeping the communication channels open is working for us so far.

That does not exclude me wanting to have a whisky after trying to talk to him on occasion, even if just to do something with my hands to keep me from strangling him.
And yes, there are moments during which I feel I could as well have spoken to the nearest wall, as the effect would have been just about the same.

Right now he just completed 5 weeks without access to any of his electronics, and while he was majorly pissed of about the verdict in the beginning, at the end he admitted to needing it.
Yesterday I confiscated a new shirt he bought. It had "Money Shot" written on top, a female mouth biting a bullet in the middle, and "Shout up, and pucker up" beneath. Followed by a list of suggestive fake actors names and production firm. He got my point and has permission to wear it inside the house.

(Now, I am pretty sure I just jinxed myself, and all hell will break lose tomorrow.)

< Message edited by calamitysandra -- 3/10/2013 2:00:57 PM >

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Post #: 116

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/10/2013 2:36:06 PM

xXsoumisXx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

He also doesn't make eye contact when talking to people. Staring at the ceiling, or off in the distance instead... something that drives me nuts cause it makes me feel like he's not listening.

This can actually be a sign that there is something not quite right. He really should be tested by a professional.

This is my profession, and I agree. Also the school moving him to a smaller class is concerning.
He may just have a hard time concentrating. Pick one or two things for chores. Self help things to begin. Concentrate fully on these things until mastered. Don't turn it into a power struggle, or a stress for him.
The trigrip for the pencil is developmental, each child is able to master it at different times. It isn't about remembering. Boys do progress a little slower than girls at this age.
It would be a good plan to get him into a public preschool next year, either a Head Start, or other options if available. You don't have to be income eligiable for Head Start if there are developmental concerns. Any public school program will have excellent research based curriculum and assesment tools available to address any concerns you may have.
good luck!

(in reply to OsideGirl)

Post #: 117

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/10/2013 6:45:46 PM

stephINca

Posts: 87
Joined: 1/19/2013
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My son is Autistic/ADHD...sounds like him to a T. Have him tested. And also consider that mom is letting him do whatever when they are at her house.

(in reply to lizi)

Post #: 118

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/11/2013 5:50:34 PM

Notsweet

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I've never gone to a kink forum online and asked a bunch of strangers what they thought about my child's development. Or his/her chores.

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Post #: 119

RE: Age appropriate chores - 3/11/2013 6:05:28 PM

MAINEiacMISTRESS

Posts: 1180
Joined: 9/12/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar
That's unacceptable to me and will not happen (the never part... not the "he may still not be able to do so at 16").

You are just going to have to accept that some kids are like that - no matter what you try to do.

I have a 19yo step-son who doesn't flush the loo when he's been in there.
If we don't shout at him, he never thinks to wash or shower.
All 4 of my kids just dump their stuff on the sofa when they walk in and it's not like they haven't been told a zillion times to hang up coats and put bags sensibly on the floor or take it to their rooms.

It's all part of being a (step)parent and sometimes it doesn't stop when they reach 18!

I have a (vanilla) guy-friend who has a special way of dealing with his kids' not helping out around the house. If they can't be bothered to put their dirty dishes in the dishwasher, he goes around while they are at school and puts their dirty dishes in their beds (not ON the bed, *IN* the bed).

His parenting tactics give Me the giggles...

< Message edited by MAINEiacMISTRESS -- 3/11/2013 6:06:36 PM >

(in reply to freedomdwarf1)

Post #: 120

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