RE: Amanda Knox retrial?

RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (Full Version)

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FunCouple5280 -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 10:57:32 AM)
Again, evade what???? Timeline: the italians arrested her. She was duely tried. She was acquitted by an Italian court..... The Italians Freed her. They gave her passport back to her and she flew back. Once they let her get on a plane, they gave up any jurisdiction they had. Justice was served. Period. Now if they want to file a wrongful death suit that is a different game. Again, how about we just retry anyone aquitted of a crime?....

MissBlueangel -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 10:59:23 AM)
[sm=dontfeedtrolls.gif]

slvemike4u -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 10:59:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WantsOfTheFlesh quote: ORIGINAL: FunCouple5280 I have nothing but condolences for the victim's family. They can blame the Italian government for not getting the right person or not doing their job. I am not going to argue as to Knox's guilt. It is not my place or yours for that matter. This is about what is just and ethical. yup tha poor family can blame everyone but knox lol. yr definition of "what is just and ethical" is a strange one if ya think its ok to evade justice over US legal technicalities when tha crime wasnt committed on US soil. It's not a technicality ....not even close.It's a bedrock of our justice system,one you don't seem to be showing much respect for....all the while claiming some sort of "ugly American" stance? Funny that eh ? You disrespect our system of justice while claiming we are uncouth americans.....lol

tj444 -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 10:59:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl An Italian court now wants to retry Amanda Knox. Despite her aquittal, Italy is asking the United States to send her back. In Italy, there is no double jeopordy law. But she's here now, not there. Can the United States send her back without violating our double jeopardy law? This is the same country that sent seismologists to prison for failing to predict an earthquake. What do you think? Can/should she be sent back? They would first have to find her guilty at this trial, which will take years by the sound of it.. apparently she is not legally required to attend the trial at all and wont be, from what I have heard.. If found guilty, then they would have to attempt to extradite her if they want her.. From what I have heard, there was no evidence she or her boyfriend had anything to do with the murder, no dna from them and sounds like some of the so called evidence was left in the apartment for weeks after the murder so likely contaminated.. they have one person in jail for her murder and there seems to be little doubt he did it.. imo he did it alone and there was no crazy sex orgy satan worshipping goings on with either Knox or her boyfriend.. and imo, this retrial is lynch-mob mentality.. I wonder tho.. if she is acquited at this new trial, will they then turn around and try her a third time? [8\|]

absolutchocolat -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 11:00:10 AM)
FR She doesn't have to go back to Italy to be re-tried and convicted. She can be found guilty and then international travel would really be burdensome... Also, not all of us "Yanks" find her so appealing. It is difficult to tell whether justice was served in her case or not; this fiasco stinks on all sides to me.

WantsOfTheFlesh -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 11:00:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam She is an American citizen and as such is entitled to the protections of the US constitution. She was tried. She was found not guilty. She went home. I seriously doubt the state dept will honor the extradition request. I also think she should verrrrry careful about international travel in the future. i just considered tha moral dimension & granted her rights asa citizen shouldnt be violated coz its in tha constitution but thats more a question for her attorney & tha supreme court. if she can be extradited without breaking tha law then let it be so.

WantsOfTheFlesh -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 11:12:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u quote: ORIGINAL: WantsOfTheFlesh quote: ORIGINAL: FunCouple5280 I have nothing but condolences for the victim's family. They can blame the Italian government for not getting the right person or not doing their job. I am not going to argue as to Knox's guilt. It is not my place or yours for that matter. This is about what is just and ethical. yup tha poor family can blame everyone but knox lol. yr definition of "what is just and ethical" is a strange one if ya think its ok to evade justice over US legal technicalities when tha crime wasnt committed on US soil. It's not a technicality ....not even close.It's a bedrock of our justice system,one you don't seem to be showing much respect for....all the while claiming some sort of "ugly American" stance? Funny that eh ? You disrespect our system of justice while claiming we are uncouth americans.....lol dude you have me mixed up wit another poster. [8\|] yup course double jeopardry is a bedrock of tha US judicial system in tha constitution but she was tried elsewhere & seems double jeopardy applies specifically to folks tried under tha US legal system. plus jeopardry is not all black & white so i reckon should be left to tha legal honchos http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Jeopardy_Clause#Retrial_after_acquittal i say let her be extradited but only if it doesnt violate her rights.

Hillwilliam -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 11:26:40 AM)
Apparently, Knox is under no compunction to go to Italy for the trial. http://www.centurylink.net/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CDA58NOMG1%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1012&page=1 If she is convicted in absentia, it will be up to the state department whether to honor an extradition request. There are mixed results for extradition requests between the 2 countries over the years with Italy recently asking that one of its citizens be allowed to serve her sentence in her own country instead of the US. When the US sent her to Italy, they released her "for health reasons".

slvemike4u -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 11:28:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WantsOfTheFlesh quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u quote: ORIGINAL: WantsOfTheFlesh quote: ORIGINAL: FunCouple5280 I have nothing but condolences for the victim's family. They can blame the Italian government for not getting the right person or not doing their job. I am not going to argue as to Knox's guilt. It is not my place or yours for that matter. This is about what is just and ethical. yup tha poor family can blame everyone but knox lol. yr definition of "what is just and ethical" is a strange one if ya think its ok to evade justice over US legal technicalities when tha crime wasnt committed on US soil. It's not a technicality ....not even close.It's a bedrock of our justice system,one you don't seem to be showing much respect for....all the while claiming some sort of "ugly American" stance? Funny that eh ? You disrespect our system of justice while claiming we are uncouth americans.....lol dude you have me mixed up wit another poster. [8\|] yup course double jeopardry is a bedrock of tha US judicial system in tha constitution but she was tried elsewhere & seems double jeopardy applies specifically to folks tried under tha US legal system. plus jeopardry is not all black & white so i reckon should be left to tha legal honchos http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Jeopardy_Clause#Retrial_after_acquittal i say let her be extradited but only if it doesnt violate her rights. Than you will need to explain to me how that extradition could be enacted without it violating her rights as an American citizen who has already stood in the docket wherein her very liberty was at stake ? It matters not that the docket in question was not an American court....jeopardy,for this crime,has attatched. It couldn't be more clearer.....the court had the power to remand her to an indeterminate sentence.....how wasn't she in jeopardy ? Why should any American court have any hand at all in seeing any American citizens fundamental rights be violated ?

BitaTruble -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 11:34:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl An Italian court now wants to retry Amanda Knox. Despite her aquittal, Italy is asking the United States to send her back. In Italy, there is no double jeopordy law. But she's here now, not there. Can the United States send her back without violating our double jeopardy law? This is the same country that sent seismologists to prison for failing to predict an earthquake. What do you think? Can/should she be sent back? Italy must meet the criteria for extradition which has four elements. Each element must be satisfied for the extradiction to be legal. (Abduction is a different subject.) #1. Was the crime commited a crime in both Italy and the USA? Yes, the crime is murder, so that meets one element. #2. Are all the documents of extradiction complete and legally filed? I don't know, but I'm sure they would be pretty careful and will assume a 'yes' answer. If the answer is no, there is no extradition. If yes, move on. Another element is satisfied. #3. Did the suspect flee the country to avoid prosecution? This will be the one that the Italian government will have to prove to satisfy the USA. Knox's lawyers will have a field day with this since they can prove that Knox did 'not' flee to avoid prosecution but was, in fact, prosecuted, accquited and released but say the Italian government does manage to convince the USA that Knox did flee and that element is met. There is one left. #4. Does extradiction violate 'cruel and unusual punishment' laws of the USA? One of the articles of 'cruel and unusual' punishment is double jeopardy. Extradiction would violate that law so, the USA does not 'have' to extradite but, they can still 'choose' to if the governemnt believes it is in the best interest of National Security. i don't think Knox qualifies but who knows what the hell the government is gonna do.

WantsOfTheFlesh -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 11:40:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Than you will need to explain to me how that extradition could be enacted without it violating her rights as an American citizen who has already stood in the docket wherein her very liberty was at stake ? It matters not that the docket in question was not an American court....jeopardy,for this crime,has attatched. It couldn't be more clearer.....the court had the power to remand her to an indeterminate sentence.....how wasn't she in jeopardy ? Why should any American court have any hand at all in seeing any American citizens fundamental rights be violated ? double jeopadry applies to final judgements. im no expert but mistrials & acquittals over lack of evidence dont always apply far as i know. yeah its a different tho related legal system but in canada schmidt was extradited back to tha US coz tha supreme court said her double jeopardy rights shouldnt be imposed on other nations.

VideoAdminChi -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 12:00:37 PM)
FR, This thread has been locked for review.

VideoAdminChi -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 12:54:17 PM)
Unlocked. Thanks for your patience.

VideoAdminChi -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 1:43:03 PM)
I would like to take this opportunity to remind everybody that there is a Hide button that can be used to hide posters who might otherwise make you susceptible to responding with a personal attack.

Yachtie -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 1:51:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BitaTruble prosecuted, accquited and released By that metric alone one could not argue she fled. Given that Italian acquittals can be overturned and remanded back for error, guess the Italians should keep everyone acquitted in jail till the statute of limitations on acquittal reversal have run out (if they have any)[8D] Ultimately she's damned lucky to be on American soil. She's entitled to all her Constitutional protections as a US Citizen on US soil. For the government to extradite her would facially violate that. If the Italians had any concern that her acquittal would be overturned, they should have kept her there.

FunCouple5280 -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 1:53:25 PM)
Amen Edited to add: Even if they hold the trial without her, if she doesn't retain counsel she would have been denied the due process of law. Another reason to deny extradition. If they assign a public defender she never meets, for all purposes a show trial of little meaning.

eulero83 -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 2:21:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FunCouple5280 Lol. She isn't hiding here!!! They tried her, they fucking lost. I get it, Italian law doesn't have a double jeopordy clause. Still the state dept has to consider her constitutional rights as a citizen here. They can't betray them to please the Italians, and the Italians hardly have a case for extraordinary circumstances. Now, if she is dumb enough to hop a flight to Europe ever in her future, I am sure the Italians will be waiting. Then they will likely do their show trial and burn her at the stake. Italian law HAS a double jeopardy clause. It's just that the italian trial is divided in three ranks of judice, both defence or accuse can appeal to the next court if any of the reasons expressed in the law occours. You are not considered guilty or innocent untill the third court expressed it's judice (and they can judge only about mistrial). You are out of jail if any of the first two is in your favor. Actually it's always the same trial but mistakes where found in the second verdict.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 4:09:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BitaTruble quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl An Italian court now wants to retry Amanda Knox. Despite her aquittal, Italy is asking the United States to send her back. In Italy, there is no double jeopordy law. But she's here now, not there. Can the United States send her back without violating our double jeopardy law? This is the same country that sent seismologists to prison for failing to predict an earthquake. What do you think? Can/should she be sent back? Italy must meet the criteria for extradition which has four elements. Each element must be satisfied for the extradiction to be legal. (Abduction is a different subject.) #1. Was the crime commited a crime in both Italy and the USA? Yes, the crime is murder, so that meets one element. #2. Are all the documents of extradiction complete and legally filed? I don't know, but I'm sure they would be pretty careful and will assume a 'yes' answer. If the answer is no, there is no extradition. If yes, move on. Another element is satisfied. #3. Did the suspect flee the country to avoid prosecution? This will be the one that the Italian government will have to prove to satisfy the USA. Knox's lawyers will have a field day with this since they can prove that Knox did 'not' flee to avoid prosecution but was, in fact, prosecuted, accquited and released but say the Italian government does manage to convince the USA that Knox did flee and that element is met. There is one left. #4. Does extradiction violate 'cruel and unusual punishment' laws of the USA? One of the articles of 'cruel and unusual' punishment is double jeopardy. Extradiction would violate that law so, the USA does not 'have' to extradite but, they can still 'choose' to if the governemnt believes it is in the best interest of National Security. i don't think Knox qualifies but who knows what the hell the government is gonna do. [sm=goodpost.gif] Thanks for the breakdown! I didn't know double jeopardy fell under "cruel and unusual" laws.

Phoenixpower -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 4:51:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam I seriously doubt the state dept will honor the extradition request. I also think she should verrrrry careful about international travel in the future. indeed... Personally I remain unsure about it, if she should or should not...but lean more towards the point which has been said already "Italy had their chance..." Of course, in regards to Merediths' Family it might be hard to digest, but I also think, that if they would have had enough solid evidence back then, she would be in prison... I do remember the case where a German doctor killed some patients in the UK due to giving them wrong medication and it was not able to get him to a trial in the UK cause he already has had one in Germany (that's at least how I remember it without looking it up) and how the UK press was - understandably - annoyed about that, even more so as his sentence was low about that...so he could not be tried over here and again in the UK about that... Anyhow it was also topic on our news of course, regarding Amanda Knox, and the newsreader said "USA will be unlikely to do that" (sending her back).

Yachtie -> RE: Amanda Knox retrial? (3/26/2013 4:53:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: eulero83 Italian law HAS a double jeopardy clause. It's just that the italian trial is divided in three ranks of judice, both defence or accuse can appeal to the next court if any of the reasons expressed in the law occours. You are not considered guilty or innocent untill the third court expressed it's judice (and they can judge only about mistrial). You are out of jail if any of the first two is in your favor. Actually it's always the same trial but mistakes where found in the second verdict. Interesting. So had the Italians thought she'd come under review and reversal, they should have held on to her. I mean, given the trial was not officially ended. She wasn't out on bail or OR. This wasn't a simple assault charge either. I'd joke about how Mussolini ever made the trains run on time, but that would be tasteless[8D]

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