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RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/25/2013 4:54:12 PM   
Politesub53


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Got to love the continued bullshit view that anyone who dislikes the way the Israeli state operates is anti-semetic.

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 141
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/25/2013 6:33:01 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

Yes, the western media are willing dupes of Hamas.


Hilarious claim. So, the entire western media (whose pro-Israel bias has been repeatedly demonstrated) are "willing of dupes of Hamas". Apparently you want us to believe that you, a resident of Chicago, who may never have visited the Middle East knows better. The only thing demonstrated by this claim is the extent of denial by fanatical Zionists about the excesses of their precious Israel and its murderous IDF. Any one making a claim like this has no credibility on this issue.

Wrong. I was in the ME several times both during my military service and afterwords as a tourist. I've actually seen the West Bank and Jerusalem and know the conditions on the ground for both the Israelis and the Palestinians. I know that Hamas lies at every turn. I saw them spreading the Blood Libel and claims that the IDF used nerve gas. I saw what a decade of Hezbollah "rule" did to the city of Beirut.

You have I'm sure never even set foot in the area. I suggest you go. I wouldn't try Gaza though Hamas does like killing western women and blaming the IDF.  Maybe a few nights in Beersheba with Hamas rockets being shot at you might get your attention.

quote:

quote:

I am not a zionist

About as credible as the claim I have just considered above. Everything you have posted on this issue is in absolute agreement with the official looney Right Israeli line. When you continuously talk like an ultra-Zionist and churn out the talking points and mantras of the ultra-Zionists, you give people little option but to conclude you are an ultra-Zionist. Again, that you maintain this charade of not being a Zionist tells us all we need to know about the honesty of your posts on this issue. This claim destroys whatever shreds of credibility might have survived the previous claim.

You really are pathetic. I am not a zionist and am certainly not a right winger. I simply despise terroists and anyone who supports terrorists, like you. I would emphatically support a non violent resistance in Palestine, I've said so many times on this forum and you could easily find them.

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 142
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/25/2013 6:34:50 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Got to love the continued bullshit view that anyone who dislikes the way the Israeli state operates is anti-semetic.

I disapprove of the way Israel operates and am crtainly no anti semite. However people who openly approve of murder bombing of Israeli civilians and others who support and believe Hamas do give a certain perception.

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 143
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/25/2013 8:41:03 PM   
kdsub


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politesub I've found you to be very fair is your views on the situation in the Middle East. You come down hard on both sides on occasion and you manage to call them out as they deserve on the merits of their actions... We don't always agree that's for sure and come to different conclusions at times but I would be hard pressed to call you ANTI anything. I believe you are FOR a resolution that stops the killing and assures both sides a homeland...So am I.

I find nothing wrong with choosing sides in this affair because I can see the atrocities by both the Israeli's and the Palestinians and their allies and understand other fair minded people may look at this mess in a different way. But we must also realize there are reasons for these seemingly atrocious actions by both sides and try to understand the reasoning behind them.

I welcome the likes of Aswad and tweak pointing out these atrocities because we need to be forced to see the suffering like it or not. But when there are atrocities by the Palestinians and their allies I expect these to be condemned as well.

Unless the world players in the Middle East stop picking sides and supporting one or the other for their own selfish reasons this balance of terror will continue. The rhetoric of some in this thread and on this subject in general mirrors this thinking and serves no good purpose... At least in my opinion.

I welcome all opinions, by the way, even if I don't agree with them. But if I don't agree I will say so and not be so childish as to put someone on ignore because they dare to have a different opinion. How would that work in the real world with real problems.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 5/25/2013 9:40:46 PM >


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(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 144
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/25/2013 10:25:30 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

Yes, the western media are willing dupes of Hamas.


Hilarious claim. The only thing demonstrated by this claim is the extent of denial by fanatical about the excesses of their precious Israel and its murderous IDF. Any one making a claim like this has no credibility on this issue.


Wrong. I was in the ME several times both during my military service and afterwords as a tourist. I've actually seen the West Bank and Jerusalem and know the conditions on the ground for both the Israelis and the Palestinians. I know that Hamas lies at every turn.


Not a shred of evidence to support your claim that "the western media are willing dupes of Hamas". Are you seriously suggesting that media organisations with international reputations and stature such as the BBC, New York Times, Reuters, Le Monde, The US public radio station etc are "willing dupes of Hamas"? Are you seriously suggesting that media owners like the staunchly pro-Zionist Rupert Murdoch is a "dupe" of Hamas? Murdoch ensures that every single one of his multiple media organisations internationally run a strong pro-Israel line. Is this what you mean by a "willing dupe"? Do you really think that, apart from other fanatical Zionists, people exist who are idiotic and gullible enough to believe this?

Your claim is nonsense, a fiction dreamt up to avoid having to deal with the content of the BBC's reporting the IDF's cold blooded murders of 2 tiny tots, and their crippling of a third sister, and shooting their grandmother. Is this your commitment to the truth? According to the logic you expounded above (such as it is) telling barefaced lies like " the western media are willing dupes of Hamas" puts you the same moral cesspit as Hamas, whom you accuse of telling "lies at every turn."

No need to think too hard about who is really the dupe here, is there? Israel collects useful idiots prepared to unquestioningly swallow and regurgitate anything it says hook line and sinker.

quote:

quote:

I am not a zionist

About as credible as the claim I have just considered above.


quote:

I am not a zionist and am certainly not a right winger. I simply despise terroists and anyone who supports terrorists, like you.

Your posts here are and always have been a litany of talking points and mantras straight from the Israeli looney Right. For example your denial of apartheid conditions in the West Bank and your specific denial that some Hebron's streets are racially segregated (open to Jews only) is shown to be false by:
this video of colonists/settlers stroll along the road while the IDF forces Palestinians to walk in the ditch ;or
this video made by a member of the European Parliament; or
this report by TIPH, an international civilian observer mission;
"In 1994, the once main market street of Hebron, Al-Shuhada street was closed by military order for Palestinian vehicles and pedestrians. According to the Hebron Protocols from 1997, the street should be re-opened to Palestinians. This was partially implemented in 1997 and 1998. However, since the outbreak of the Second Intifada in 2000, the street has again been closed for Palestinians." (emphasis added)
http://www.tiph.org/en/About_Hebron/Hebron_today/
There are many more such videos and reports available on YouTube and google if people care to look.

Whether you call yourself a Zionist or not is immaterial when you tell such blatant lies in a pathetic attempt to make Israel look good, or when you accuse me others of supporting terrorism or Hamas despite knowing full well that we don't and have said so on many occasions. You place yourself in the Zionist camp, you sound like a Zionist, you say the things Zionist say, you repeat the lies Zionists spread, you play the anti-Semitic card promiscuously. Long time posters here will recall that your abuse of those who dare to criticise Israel is legendary for its vitriol and venom.

For all intents and purposes the difference between your discourse and Zionist discourse is microscopic. So by all means carry on with the charade that you aren't a fanatical Zionist. It's your credibility (such as it is) which is at stake here, not mine or that of others who support human rights and anti-racism and so must be critics of Israeli ethnic cleansing and apartheid. What's one more lie to add to all the others?

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 5/25/2013 10:55:54 PM >


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(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 145
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/26/2013 12:43:17 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Not a shred of evidence to support your claim that "the western media are willing dupes of Hamas". Are you seriously suggesting that media organisations with international reputations and stature such as the BBC, New York Times, Reuters, Le Monde, The US public radio station etc are "willing dupes of Hamas"? Are you seriously suggesting that media owners like the staunchly pro-Zionist Rupert Murdoch is a "dupe" of Hamas? Murdoch ensures that every single one of his multiple media organisations internationally run a strong pro-Israel line. Is this what you mean by a "willing dupe"? Do you really think that, apart from other fanatical Zionists, people exist who are idiotic and gullible enough to believe this?

Still haven't watched Pallywood I see. Why don't you and then maybe we can have a discussion on the subject where you actually have some grounding in reality.

quote:

quote:

I am not a zionist and am certainly not a right winger. I simply despise terroists and anyone who supports terrorists, like you.

Your posts here are and always have been a litany of talking points and mantras straight from the Israeli looney Right. For example your denial of apartheid conditions in the West Bank and your specific denial that some Hebron's streets are racially segregated (open to Jews only) is shown to be false by:

You're a liar. I just ran a search to make sure, I've never written a word about Hebron ever on this forum.

When you're done simply making shit up about me get back to me.

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 146
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/26/2013 3:46:17 AM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline
quote:


You're a liar. I just ran a search to make sure


There have been so many deleted threads on this issue a search of the remaining ones means nothing. I have a crystal clear memory of you denying that al-Shahuda St in Hebron was racially segregated. More importantly, you have repeatedly denied point blank that Israel practices apartheid and ethnic cleansing in the West Bank. Here's just one instance:

"Israel does not practice apartheid. [...] Isrel (sic) does not practice ethnic cleansing. "

post #41 at http://www.collarchat.com/m_4369076/mpage_3/tm.htm

In the light of the videos above clearly demonstrating apartheid-style racially segregation in Hebron, this claim is obviously false.

Here's a video of a 1948 Palmach veteran describing his role in the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8IjnRsRPCQ
The ethnic cleansing continues to this day as these videos of settlers attacking Palestinians villages while the IDF watches on and does nothing to protect the villagers from attack, or even worse, joins in the attacks:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=00W-eThntOs
www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNbrbjDVm-0
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Por53Sa_8ck
There's plenty more videos like these at YouTube or Live Link. Just type in "ethnic cleansing in Palestine" and take your pick.

The ethnic cleansing continues to this day, carried out by fanatical colonists with the blessing of the IDF, who often join in the ethnic cleansing. Watch them and tell me that Israel wasn't founded on ethnic cleansing, or as you have argued previously, the land was empty (unpopulated) and no mass expulsions of the indigenous population occurred, or that "Israel doesn't practice ethnic cleansing".

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 5/26/2013 3:47:03 AM >


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(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 147
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/26/2013 4:28:41 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:


You're a liar. I just ran a search to make sure


There have been so many deleted threads on this issue a search of the remaining ones means nothing. I have a crystal clear memory of you denying that al-Shahuda St in Hebron was racially segregated.

You're full of shit. You want to discuss anything you will still stop lying about me.

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 148
RE: "Welcome to America's 30 year War" - 5/26/2013 4:49:34 AM   
VideoAdminChi


Posts: 3086
Joined: 8/6/2012
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FR,

This thread is locked for review.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 149
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